Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

[Ruggs225]

Lindgren/Trouba out gives you some money to work with. Trading Kreider for futures makes no sense. We have future defensemen and wings. This isn’t one and done.

Signing Fox, Laf and Shesty in their prime then punting seasons makes no sense

Most of trouba’s contract will be taken up by finding a top 4 replacement. Lindgrens money was just eaten by laff.

I think next year will be a step back no matter what next year. Then kreider has one more year left. Whats the point of holding him and getting nothing. Especially since panarin is also up after next year.

This is the year to go for it. After this, i would pish the old guard to the side and go with the new core. If we cant win this year, we almoat certainly arent winning next year, with a team that is almost guaranteed not to be as strong as this year.

So again what is the point of keeping kreider. “Happy feelings” is not an acceptable answer.

If we lose this year, we need to have a big turnover and start the new chapter.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Most of trouba’s contract will be taken up by finding a top 4 replacement. Lindgrens money was just eaten by laff.

I think next year will be a step back no matter what next year. Then kreider has one more year left. Whats the point of holding him and getting nothing. Especially since panarin is also up after next year.

This is the year to go for it. After this, i would pish the old guard to the side and go with the new core. If we cant win this year, we almoat certainly arent winning next year, with a team that is almost guaranteed not to be as strong as this year.

So again what is the point of keeping kreider. “Happy feelings” is not an acceptable answer.

If we lose this year, we need to have a big turnover and start the new chapter.

Kreider is still productive.
The point is to keep productive players on value contracts to win games.

Letting a guy walk in ufa at 35 isn’t really a waste of assets. A guy who’s showed loyalty and stayed through a rebuild and took a very team friendly deal to do it. That’s a guy who you don’t move unless you’re forced to.

 

[TominNC]

Because the Rangers aren’t punting a season. Wasting a year of Fox, etc.

Kreider and Panarin come off and they go big game hunting. Keep it moving. We know you hate Kreider. Can’t wait until they hang his number.

 

[Ruggs225]

Sirius NhL radio just basically said what i was saying by their analysts.

Someones gotta go in the offseason. Kakko was broight up (if he has a good year and asks for money), and kreider was brought up.

Also the fact that Drury hast to be cutthroat.

To me its a no brainer to keep kakko over kreider if Kakko shows signs of breaking out and wants to get paid. One is 24/25 the other is 33.

This offseason is going to be alot of hard decisions for Drury. And Kreider certainly should not be off the table.

Now that Laff is signed. Next up is Miller. Kakko aint signing till end of year to figure out value.

Shesty, we have no clue when or for what he is going to sign.

Laffys contract was a great start. Future captain baby!

 

[Ruggs225]

Kreider is still productive.
The point is to keep productive players on value contracts to win games.

Letting a guy walk in ufa at 35 isn’t really a waste of assets. A guy who’s showed loyalty and stayed through a rebuild and took a very team friendly deal to do it. That’s a guy who you don’t move unless you’re forced to.

Im not arguing he isnt productive.

But if keeping him and letting go of kakko is the choice. Im keeping kakko and getting the assets for kreider. He has many years of productivity and should keep improving. Kreider is not going to improve and will only start getting worse. Nobody beats father time.

All of this is assuming kakko has a solid season pitting up 40+ pts.

Bc it isnt just keeping kreider, its keeping him and making someone else walk. Thats the choices Drury will have this offseason. Its what the cap forces u to do.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Im not arguing he isnt productive.

But if keeping him and letting go of kakko is the choice. Im keeping kakko and getting the assets for kreider. He has many years of productivity and should keep improving. Kreider is not going to improve and will only start getting worse. Nobody beats father time.

All of this is assuming kakko has a solid season pitting up 40+ pts.

Bc it isnt just keeping kreider, its keeping him and making someone else walk. Thats the choices Drury will have this offseason. Its what the cap forces u to do.

As someone who has vocally defended Kakko for the entire offseason.
That’s a false dichotomy.

There’s money to keep Kakko and Kreider. And Kreider isn’t blocking Kakko.

I have no idea where you’re comparing the two.

 

[LOFIN]

Getting rid of players on value contracts is not the way. Kreider is on one.

And there would be more there with him if he didn't have to play with a literal corpse.

 

[bernmeister]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1849874401400873294

pass

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Im not arguing he isnt productive.

But if keeping him and letting go of kakko is the choice. Im keeping kakko and getting the assets for kreider. He has many years of productivity and should keep improving. Kreider is not going to improve and will only start getting worse. Nobody beats father time.

All of this is assuming kakko has a solid season pitting up 40+ pts.

Bc it isnt just keeping kreider, its keeping him and making someone else walk. Thats the choices Drury will have this offseason. Its what the cap forces u to do.

Kakko is a nice 3rd liner, I don't care where he was drafted and how young he is he cannot shine Kreider's shoes. Your hatred for Kreider is right up there with the loons on Facebook that hate him because his goals don't come from too far away from the net.

 

[Ruggs225]

As someone who has vocally defended Kakko for the entire offseason.
That’s a false dichotomy.

There’s money to keep Kakko and Kreider. And Kreider isn’t blocking Kakko.

I have no idea where you’re comparing the two.

for next year we need to sign shesty to a stupidly high raise

Other rfas who will get big raises.
Miller
Kakko(if produces)

Cuylle wil ger a decent raise, jones/edstrom not so much.

Then, assuming trouba is gone, we need to sign a top 4 dman which will cost at least 6m.

If u dont sign a top 4 dman and go with fox, miller, schneider and mancini you are basically punting the season anyway.

Kreider isnt blocking kreider u are right. Well maybe as net front on Pp1 which i think Kakko might be able to do in the future, though he will never be as good as kreids for that.

However, money is money, cap is cap and its goong to be extremely tight. It might come down to pay kakko and keep him at kreiders expense, or keep kreider and trade kakko to stay under cap.

If kakko gets a 40+pt year he will need to get a 6m contract bc u need to buy all UFA years.

And again, NhL analysts are already talking about this after the laff signing. The cap crunch this year could be really nasty.

 

[Ruggs225]

Kakko is a nice 3rd liner, I don't care where he was drafted and how young he is he cannot shine Kreider's shoes. Your hatred for Kreider is right up there with the loons on Facebook that hate him because his goals don't come from too far away from the net.

And kreiedr is a good 2nd liner. One who happens to be on the wrong side of 30. What he did in the past is irrelevant as u dont beat father time.

I dont hate him. I just dont fawn over him.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Cuylle will get a bridge around 2x2
Miller should get less than 6x5

That forces the Rangers to either trade Kakko and go with an ELC guy or trade Trouba or both.

If Kakko has a good year he'll command something like 5.5x4. If he doesn't he'll be gone anyway.

Lot of options but Shesterkin's # has to be around 11-11.5 at most to squeeze everyone in. One way or another, the team is losing Kakko or Trouba next year.

 

[haohmaru]

3rd line post

Humor. Pass it on.

This is objectively false.

He has 3 even strength goals in 7 games playing with with even strength coronavirus.

I’ve been saying this, sarcastically, for two years.

Clearly NOT a 3rd line ANYTHING.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

And kreiedr is a good 2nd liner. One who happens to be on the wrong side of 30. What he did in the past is irrelevant as u dont beat father time.

I dont hate him. I just dont fawn over him.

Kreider had 39 goals and 75 points last year, some second liner. If he's a second liner he's an elite second liner. Not even close to Kakko.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Probably have to start the year next year something like

Panarin Trocheck Lafreniere
Kreider Zibanejad (Perreault/Othmann)
(Cuylle 2x2) Chytil (Kakko or Perreault/Othmann)
(Edstrom .9) Carrick (Rempe .9 or Brodzinski)

That's perfectly fine.

(Miller 5.85x5) Fox
LD2 Schneider
LD3 Mancini

(Shesterkin 11.5)
(Garand .9)

Needing a RW3 (or RW1, depending on how they use Perreault) with Othmann and Berard as potential fits, and 2 LD (with Jones RFA), that team has about $10M in cap space, assuming Brodzinski and Mackey as spares. That's if they move Trouba without retaining.

 

[Ruggs225]

Kreider had 39 goals and 75 points last year, some second liner. If he's a second liner he's an elite second liner. Not even close to Kakko.

Great lets see where he is at the end of this year

What happens if he foes down to 30-30 and kakko goes to 20-25 without pp time.

Much closer now.

Again,
Kreider is not going to get better. Kakko should keep getting better. One is at the end of his career, the other still in the beginning.

All of this is hypothetical. But i think kakko is going to have a strong year.

 

[bhamill]

This year is our best chance to win. We are going to take a step back next year basically no matter what. We wont have cap space to better ourselves and most likely our d core is going to be a mess.

Knowing this, it is smarter to start a retool by trading a good but aging asset.

With that cap we could also try to sign a dman which we are going to need no matter what.

We have wingers on this team and in the pipeline. Better to start giving them bigger minutes. Laff could probably slide back to LW if really needed. But we have panarin, cuylee, laff, kakko, othmann, berard and perreault who all project to be in the top 9. That six wingers for six slots. U can always sign a free agent to if one isnt ready.

I am completely operating under the assumption we are taking a step back no matter what next year and probably the year after. Better to rip off the bandaid to get a retool quickly and the best assets possible then keep an aging player.

I don’t understand how the step back next year is a forgone conclusion. Our young players will all likely be better. Laf, Fox, Miller, KK, Edstrom, Schneider, Jones, Mancini will all likely be better than this year and likely even better the year after that... Pan is not falling off a cliff next year. Neither is Kreider. Zibs ALREADY has. Troch may START to decline, Trouba gone, addition by subtraction considering his cap hit. IF Lindgren is still here he’ll be a 3rd pair guy. Othmann, Gabe and Berard all reasonably possible positive additions/options. I see us as BETTER next year.
The only way I see a real back step is if we let Shesty walk.

What I meant is that Trouba's list will probably be influenced by it. I'm not saying team will (or should) accommodate his wants/needs.

Ah. Okay. But he will only have a 12 team no trade.

 

[leetch99]

Krieder is definitely not the problem, haha.

He is certainly not the solution either . Part of the problem ? Oh yeah ! I think we can find a guy that can tip pucks on a PP like we have ....in fact we just signed a guy today who has some skill . Good stuff @Ruggs225 Some people just get too attached to some guys and hate to cut the umbilical cord......relax people ...we have a hockey team to run and this is an unpopular move but for the right reasons moving forward . The team will be the very best .....and in all likelihood even better .

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Great lets see where he is at the end of this year

What happens if he foes down to 30-30 and kakko goes to 20-25 without pp time.

Much closer now.

Again,
Kreider is not going to get better. Kakko should keep getting better. One is at the end of his career, the other still in the beginning.

All of this is hypothetical. But i think kakko is going to have a strong year.

I know we love talking about PP usage and I agree lack of PP time depresses his time, but penalizing Kreider for being one of the best PP players in the league seems unfair. I don't think Kakko's game translates to the PP. This isn't Mika and Laf, Mika sucks on the PP now and Laf has a dynamic game that should translate to the PP.

He is certainly not the solution either . Part of the problem ? Oh yeah ! I think we can find a guy that can tip pucks on a PP like we have ....in fact we just signed a guy today who has some skill . Good stuff @Ruggs225 Some people just get too attached to some guys and hate to cut the umbilical cord......relax people ...we have a hockey team to run and this is an unpopular move but for the right reasons moving forward . The team will be the very best .....and in all likelihood even better .

Are you one of those people on Facebook that diminishes Kreider's goals because they're in front of the net? If you are you're not worth arguing this. Oh and good luck finding someone to tip in pucks like Kreider who is one of the best EVER at it. Before Kreider we were all whining we didn't have Holmstrom type. Now that we do he's a scrub because he's not scoring from further away. f***ing absurd.

 

[leetch99]

I know we love talking about PP usage and I agree lack of PP time depresses his time, but penalizing Kreider for being one of the best PP players in the league seems unfair. I don't think Kakko's game translates to the PP. This isn't Mika and Laf, Mika sucks on the PP now and Laf has a dynamic game that should translate to the PP.



Are you one of those people on Facebook that diminishes Kreider's goals because they're in front of the net? If you are you're not worth arguing this. Oh and good luck finding someone to tip in pucks like Kreider who is one of the best EVER at it. Before Kreider we were all whining we didn't have Holmstrom type. Now that we do he's a scrub because he's not scoring from further away. f***ing absurd.

In case you never looked....other clubs had better PP's than us last season and they did not have CK tipping pucks for them . I'm pretty certain you can go back and see other years as well where that also rings true . Leafs had JT an elite tipper....and how many cups did he get them ? Even the Fishsticks had a better PP in the playoffs then we did .Maybe we rework the PP with new people added to it ? There is more than one way to build a successful PP .

 

[SnowblindNYR]

In case you never looked....other clubs had better PP's than us last season and they did not have CK tipping pucks for them . I'm pretty certain you can go back and see other years as well where that also rings true . Leafs had JT an elite tipper....and how many cups did he get them ? Even the Fishsticks had a better PP in the playoffs then we did .Maybe we rework the PP with new people added to it ? There is more than one way to build a successful PP .

You can literally do the same thing with everything. Teams win in different ways, news at 11. Maybe we should get McDavid and Draisaitl because we can have a dominant PP with them. Also, what a clown take about the Islanders. Yeah, their 5 games that they lasted in the playoffs really is amazing proof. We've had one of the best PPs in the league the last 3 seasons, IDGAF that we're not the only good PP team in the league and other teams do it in other ways. We do it this way and it works for us. Oh and some teams had similar players and didn't win cups that means we need to get rid of this player. Just absolute drivel.

 

[noncents]

for next year we need to sign shesty to a stupidly high raise

Other rfas who will get big raises.
Miller
Kakko(if produces)

Cuylle wil ger a decent raise, jones/edstrom not so much.

Then, assuming trouba is gone, we need to sign a top 4 dman which will cost at least 6m.

If u dont sign a top 4 dman and go with fox, miller, schneider and mancini you are basically punting the season anyway.

Kreider isnt blocking kreider u are right. Well maybe as net front on Pp1 which i think Kakko might be able to do in the future, though he will never be as good as kreids for that.

However, money is money, cap is cap and its goong to be extremely tight. It might come down to pay kakko and keep him at kreiders expense, or keep kreider and trade kakko to stay under cap.

If kakko gets a 40+pt year he will need to get a 6m contract bc u need to buy all UFA years.

And again, NhL analysts are already talking about this after the laff signing. The cap crunch this year could be really nasty.

you can trade for a top4 LH Dman with salary retention or on a manageable deal.

walman
gudas
clifton

if we could pry rasmus andersson loose, that'd be great

 

[Rangeri]

Kreider will retire Ranger if he play like he has these couple past seasons. Its not even only sentimental value to us who have been watching his career unfold last 10 years. Man decimated Carolina not even 6 months ago and people speak of him like he is easily replaceable. Shameless.

I hope Rangers could keep Kakko but I will never even consider to sacrifice Kreider for chance of that.

 

[TominNC]

Kreider is not a problem. And not just anyone can do what he does on PP. He's one of the very best at what he does.

 

[LOFIN]

Kreider is not a problem. And not just anyone can do what he does on PP. He's one of the very best at what he does.

He is the best, and this is not an opinion BTW that is a statistical fact. Kreider is the best net front guy in this league and has been for several years.

He's bringing value on that contract by simply being the best at what he does on one of the best powerplays on this league. I just wish we could extract more out of him 5v5 these days. I know how we can, but can't separate Chip 'n' Dale I guess.