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Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

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Why is Zibs plus minus so much worse than Kreider and Smith?

Why is Lafs plus minus so much worse than Bread and Vinny?
 
McRanger92 said:
Is this really what happened though? There was no circumvention on Trouba. He had 15 team NTC and Drury was working within the confines of that. And who knows where the leak of Trouba not wanting to leave his family came from? I respect that Trouba feels that way but if his contract says he can be traded, he can be traded. It's also not like every fan didnt know Trouba's wife is his priority. it's literally why he became a Ranger in the first placey. Trouba's play and contract did not warrant his position being safe on the roster. Full stop. Millionaire athletes get traded when they have young kids every day. It became personal because the players took it personal.
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I think the talk about circumvention was related to Goodrow
 
I go back to the Trouba helmet throw. Do we all recall when the team was flat for multiple games in a row and then Trouba just threw a massive public fit when he got throw out of a game and the team responded? I wonder if the trade rumors over the summer have neutered his captaincy (along with his play) and he also has just decided to 'go with the flow'. I think that what we may be seeing is him no longer pushing and willing some of these veterans to provide more effort than they want to on a given night.

For the record, I'm okay trading Kreider, as long as the return is sufficient. And that return MUST include a 1st round pick. No Blais + 2nd crap
 
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Oscar Lindberg said:
I would agree he’s absolutely not gambling, he’s been conservative for the most part. I also would say that some of his moves this past summer were absolutely a gamble and it’s blown up in his face.

It seems the leadership and core didn’t take kindly to his ruthless attempts to make changes and its killed the morale. I’m good with the Goodrow move but I’m not gonna sit and lie that Drury circumventing a well liked leader’s NTC wouldn’t sit badly with me if I was a leader on this team. Then you add in trying to kick your captain out the door, and get into a public squabble with him where you drag his family into the proceedings. And then you welcome him back into the room and expect it to be all gravy.

Obviously these players are entitled and it’s an issue, but I understand how the morale could easily go into the shitter with everything that’s happened.
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Drury's job is to get the team to win not spare feelings in the locker room. Why are we treating players like children? They're f***ing adults making a lot of money.
 
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McRanger92 said:
Im going to speculate here, but it seems like the root of the problem was how the Goodrow situation was handled. I had no problem with it personally. Guy gets to go back to the place he debuted with the same albatross contract instead of a buyout? Seems like a win to me. if it was unexpected by the players, it shouldnt have been. Same with the Trouba trade talks. I get that the guys is the Captain, but lets not pretend that wasnt chosen by default (looking at you Kreider and Mika). Not to mention Trouba was a complete zero in every playoff run he participated in. We'll never know what really happened but Drury shouldve ripped the band-aid off then.

The Lindgren stuff is a legit criticism of Drury. My guess is after alienating the Trouba/Kreider/Mika/Trocheck/Panarin (to varying degrees), he didnt want to further turmoil among the younger core (Fox's bestie and Lafreniere's, who was still unsigned, roommate). It was a poor choice. A half measure. Maybe they thought he'd bounce back. I don't think Drury is in over his head at all, but I think he has work to do to fix the problem. I think he has the rest of this season to figure it out or he and Laviolette are gone and a new braintrust will come in to extract the cancers, and go forward with the young core.
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If any of this is remotely true, then the criticisms of this locker room have been dramatically understated. This is pro sports in a league with a no wiggle room hard cap. The entitlement & country club vibes of this team has been on display since Ryan Strome publicly called out Quinn for "not trusting the players" when Quinn probably was telling them that the east-west hockey wasn't sustainable.

If the Goodrow situation is affecting these guys so much, it's clear we have the wrong mix of players & the room is really broken. And if the GM is catering to them by keeping Lindgren because he's afraid to break up one of the bromances, that's an issue unto itself. It's just emblematic of the NYR culture that has produced 1 Cup in 85 years.


McRanger92 said:
Yeah I dont understand the people who think Drury has been riverboat gamblng with this team. We've made a 1st round pick in every draft he has been in charge. He's been very disciplined and patient regarding the young players. I agree that if you want to criticize him its been that he has been too patient. Credit to him for publicly calling out a 12-6-1 team because we all know that record is fugazi. I think he is actually one of the better GMs in the league and seems to genuinely care.
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Calling them out publicly & floating names on the block has two distinct downsides, 1) it can completely backfire & 2) it removes any leverage Drury might have in potential deals. As much as I like the fact that CD is awake to the fact that this team's core is shot, I'm not sure airing his intentions was the way to go.
 
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Machinehead said:
Also, apropos of not much, when you get rid of Trouba, for the love of God, the captain is Adam Fox.

Please stop big braining this.
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Im not naming a captain until next training camp minimum if Trouba goes. It's Lafreniere or Fox in all likelihood but I'd like to see their effort and play reflect that going forward. I still expect the team to make the playoffs.
 
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IDvsEGO said:
Gallant was a shit coach.
Laf’s lack of development and usage and Kakko’s lack of development and usage alone were firable offenses
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Yeah, that's the one thing that's baffling to me. How is anyone possibly suggesting that getting rid of Gallant wasn't the right move? The guy barely talked to the players and was always mad that nobody would buy into his message. I mean...no shit?

There's a weird mix of guys that appear to want to work and be coached right now and then there's the vets doing their same ol' shtick thinking it'll be different this time.

As an aside, it's very weird to see the Knicks in juxtaposition to the Rangers right now. There hasn't been an NBA team that's made as many gigantic moves as the Knicks, including trading highly-drafted, young "core" pieces and then flipping a key bench piece like DiVo and a borderline star in Randle. It didn't phase them, and they're set up to be an extremely good team once they get their bench pieces healthy (big if there). Hockey is the only sport where everyone is so worried about perfecting all of the intangible things as opposed to focusing primarily on building a good team.
 
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Machinehead said:
Also, apropos of not much, when you get rid of Trouba, for the love of God, the captain is Adam Fox.

Please stop big braining this.
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I dont think Fox would make a good captain. He is another player that just doesnt seem fiery.

The closest this team has to a good captain would be trocheck, but even he seems kind of checked out now.

I was hoping Laf would take the reins but he hasnt.

Wonder if Cuylle can be it in a couple years.

Man i miss Cally more and more. Last good captain we had. Loved him here.
 
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Machinehead said:
Bern, I love you, but 2014 called and they want their trade back.

I wouldn't do Panarin alone for Ekblad+ unless the + was Tkachuk.
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MH,
keep that up and you will be bringing out my inner hippie

"I love you, man"

that said,
yeah, in a vacuum bread commands more, but right now he holds final say.
waiting til next yr reduces return b'c acquiring team gets less term -> use on productive asset
other things are:
1. faster recovery of cap space
2. it sends a message to the vets, and inspires newbies to put in the work

I think if forced we can hold bread if we move zib
moving zib to LI w/o bread departure sending message may/may not be relevant

and btw
would prefer deal that gets us Nemec + Silayev
 
McRanger92 said:
Is this really what happened though? There was no circumvention on Trouba. He had 15 team NTC and Drury was working within the confines of that. And who knows where the leak of Trouba not wanting to leave his family came from? I respect that Trouba feels that way but if his contract says he can be traded, he can be traded. It's also not like every fan didnt know Trouba's wife is his priority. it's literally why he became a Ranger in the first placey. Trouba's play and contract did not warrant his position being safe on the roster. Full stop. Millionaire athletes get traded when they have young kids every day. It became personal because the players took it personal.
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When I say they circumvented a NTC, I’m referring to Goodrow. Drury absolutely circumvented his NTC. It’s obvious San Jose was on his list and they placed him on waivers to get around it.

And we won’t know where the leak came from on Trouba’s family being blamed. But when these sorts of things happen, I always look who benefits from that information being public and that’s probably where it came from. The Rangers absolutely benefited from trying to shift blame off the front office on why a trade didn’t happening.

The public might have known some of Trouba’s wife’s details, but it’s obvious someone on the Rangers side leaked everything else to Larry about the situation circumstances. With the goal being “see, it’s not our fault”.

And I understand why Trouba would be pissed about that, because he and his family have caught so much shit since that info came out.
 
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Boris Zubov said:
If any of this is remotely true, then the criticisms of this locker room have been dramatically understated. This is pro sports in a league with a no wiggle room hard cap. The entitlement & country club vibes of this team has been on display since Ryan Strome publicly called out Quinn for "not trusting the players" when Quinn probably was telling them that the east-west hockey wasn't sustainable.

If the Goodrow situation is affecting these guys so much, it's clear we have the wrong mix of players & the room is really broken. And if the GM is catering to them by keeping Lindgren because he's afraid to break up one of the bromances, that's an issue unto itself. It's just emblematic of the NYR culture that has produced 1 Cup in 85 years.




Calling them out publicly & floating names on the block has two distinct downsides, 1) it can completely backfire & 2) it removes any leverage Drury might have in potential deals. As much as I like the fact that CD is awake to the fact that this team's core is shot, I'm not sure airing his intentions was the way to go.
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I can't kill Drury for doing something Ive wanted the team to do since the Devils series in 2023. Gallant called them out with tire tracks on his back after that series was over but none of them took it to heart. Even Lavi bends over backwards not to name names. Personally, I like that Drury seems like a bit of a loose cannon. He was right to call out Kravtsov back in the day too.
 
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Mac n Gs said:
Yeah, that's the one thing that's baffling to me. How is anyone possibly suggesting that getting rid of Gallant wasn't the right move? The guy barely talked to the players and was always mad that nobody would buy into his message. I mean...no shit?

There's a weird mix of guys that appear to want to work and be coached right now and then there's the vets doing their same ol' shtick thinking it'll be different this time.

As an aside, it's very weird to see the Knicks in juxtaposition to the Rangers right now. There hasn't been an NBA team that's made as many gigantic moves as the Knicks, including trading highly-drafted, young "core" pieces and then flipping a key bench piece like DiVo and a borderline star in Randle. It didn't phase them, and they're set up to be an extremely good team once they get their bench pieces healthy (big if there). Hockey is the only sport where everyone is so worried about perfecting all of the intangible things as opposed to focusing primarily on building a good team.
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When gallant was fired, a piece came out that said Drury was approached by players who basically said "his practices suck, they lack intensity, they're boring, and they're not instructional"

If my players told me that the coach would be gone immediately.
Those aren't player doesn't like the coach because he doesnt give ice time, those are clear, indications that a coach isn't coaching.

From all reports Lavi is coaching. Players are getting better, he uses players as best he can.
Does he over rely on the vets at times? Sure.
He's also willing to throw kids into spots.

Kakko at center was an out of the box solution, that didnt seem to backfire.
 
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Ruggs225 said:
I dont think Fox would make a good captain. He is another player that just doesnt seem fiery.

The closest this team has to a good captain would be trocheck, but even he seems kind of checked out now.

I was hoping Laf would take the reins but he hasnt.

Wonder if Cuylle can be it in a couple years.

Man i miss Cally more and more. Last good captain we had. Loved him here.
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I haven't thought of Cally in a while. And it made me think Cuylle seems like a similar possible player. Am I off?
 
SnowblindNYR said:
Drury's job is to get the team to win not spare feelings in the locker room. Why are we treating players like children? They're f***ing adults making a lot of money.
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I’m not treating them like children, I said it’s an issue. But let’s not kid ourselves that leadership and team morale play a big part in success of any team, in any job. And when morale takes a hit due to circumstances, it’s going to have an effect.

Also, Drury largely did nothing to change the team from the one that wasn’t good enough last year. He swapped out a few minor pieces. So if his job is to win, he sure didn’t do a great job of facilitating that this past summer
 
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