Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XI: We can read between the lines

[Kakko]

Kreider getting traded is way more likely than AV being fired.

If AV outlasts Kreider on this team, Gorton is just as dumb as AV himself

 

[Irishguy42]

Does Edmonton even want Holden?

I was thinking Kreider for Pulju/Yamamoto+2018 1st+Fayne/Strome (so cap stays roughly the same)

Have Fayne/Strome as cap dumps (particularly Fayne) in order to entice them adding in the first round pick.

 

[NYR Viper]

Didn’t the Rangers try very hard to get that Edmonton pick where they took Puljujaarvi? It sounds like he’s a player they liked going back to that draft.

 

[Irishguy42]

Didn’t the Rangers try very hard to get that Edmonton pick where they took Puljujaarvi? It sounds like he’s a player they liked going back to that draft.

Maloney said the Rangers had a deal in place for the #4 pick in 2016 (where Pulju went) but they wanted Keller (he went at #7 instead).

During his post-draft interview, Gorton did seem decently frustrated when the subject of that rumor came up.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

First off if any of you go to SNYRangersBlog it's clear that Rotter reads these pages and is one of us in disguise or just doesn't post. He's literally writing commentary that is based off what we said a page ago. Not a bad thing just funny.

Oilers are not trading Yamamoto. He's brand new, on an ELC that they don't even have to burn this year, and can be a running mate for McDavid or Drais in 1-2 years when other guys are due for raises, the third and fourth liners all leave. ELCs with productivity are the name of the game in present day NHL especially when you already have two superstars on your club. Phil Esposito isn't running this team.

Kreider-The thing is are all of you willing to accept that he might hit 30 goals and become a 60 point player with McDavid? No seller's remorse. If he's moved, accept it and don't start getting upset by the success he's having because playing with better players will do that. It's only two years after this one and then someone is going to overpay for him. I like him a lot and he's had some nice seasons and moments but he's in the Duguay/Kovalev mold in that he's a pretty good player who should be great. I don't see him becoming a Keith Tzachuk or Tim Kerr in this setting.

With that said I'm not in favor of it but I'd offer Kreider and I want back Puljujarvi, Khaira, and a 1st.

Nash scoring last night was good. Get his value as high as possible. A big part of his game was puck protection and doing all those "Michael Jackson" slick moves to the front of the net. He barely has that anymore he's more of a rush player. He's not a star anymore, last year he was just one of the guy's, and this year he's a 3rd liner. I'll be overjoyed if he has 15 goals and 30 points by the deadline. I've beaten it to death here but Tomas Sandstrom was the same age as Nash when he won a Cup with Red Wings as a role player. Same player at this point, he'll get you back something but not a first.

 

[Beacon]

Maloney said the Rangers had a deal in place for the #4 pick in 2016 (where Pulju went) but they wanted Keller (he went at #7 instead).

During his post-draft interview, Gorton did seem decently frustrated when the subject of that rumor came up.

What did Gorton agree to send back?

 

[Irishguy42]

What did Gorton agree to send back?

Unknown. Maloney just said that there was a deal in place for the #4 pick that fell through.

 

[GregSirico]

If AV outlasts Kreider on this team, Gorton is just as dumb as AV himself

I tend to agree BUT I think they will do this to try and salvage this season.

 

[Mac n Gs]

They're going to make a cultural change... this is long overdue. There hasn't been solid accountability in that room since MSL left... to your point... that falls on the coaches... but guys have to be self-accountable... and very very few are in that room.

Rangers are in a position to really make some aggressive moves and rebuild within two off-seasons... but you have to get rid of the passengers and bring in the drivers.

Nash to Nashville for Petterson. Get a ready made player... Nashville can afford to make a deal like this.

The Rangers have really poor OHL and WHL scouting... they need new guys there.

Their European scouts are good, but leaving... their NA guys brought in too many chums... these guys aren't your meat and potato guys that will step up.

You have a group that mounts a good 20 minutes... feels good about themselves... and says hey we tried... Kreider is in that bucket.

It's good for both parties to move on. Kreider is one of the few assets that can get an over valued haul... the 3-4 shifts every 10 games he gives where he's in beast mode is tantalizing enough to a team... where they will think the right room and city and coach will bring that out of him.

Cost controlled, no ntc... this is the time to make a move. It's not a panic move imo.. it's a move to change directions.

I don’t disagree with you, but how much of this is fluff or an idea to try to have an explanation for the team not having enough talent? We need talent, plain and simple. Kreids is one of our young guys with talent, and shipping him off when we clearly have a coaching problem doesn’t make sense to me.

I don’t believe any of this country club talk, and we never discuss the middle area between having a dictator like Torts/Ruff and a hands-off guy like AV. Great coaches like Laviolette and Babcock do both.

 

[I Eat Crow]

They're going to make a cultural change... this is long overdue. There hasn't been solid accountability in that room since MSL left... to your point... that falls on the coaches... but guys have to be self-accountable... and very very few are in that room.

Rangers are in a position to really make some aggressive moves and rebuild within two off-seasons... but you have to get rid of the passengers and bring in the drivers.

Nash to Nashville for Petterson. Get a ready made player... Nashville can afford to make a deal like this.

The Rangers have really poor OHL and WHL scouting... they need new guys there.

Their European scouts are good, but leaving... their NA guys brought in too many chums... these guys aren't your meat and potato guys that will step up.

You have a group that mounts a good 20 minutes... feels good about themselves... and says hey we tried... Kreider is in that bucket.

It's good for both parties to move on. Kreider is one of the few assets that can get an over valued haul... the 3-4 shifts every 10 games he gives where he's in beast mode is tantalizing enough to a team... where they will think the right room and city and coach will bring that out of him.

Cost controlled, no ntc... this is the time to make a move. It's not a panic move imo.. it's a move to change directions.

Not giving you a hard time here, but who?

Both need to happen. The brass needs to step in before they go the route of the dark ages, you shift away from your passengers. Bring in guys that are accountable. Kreider brings in more pieces than he's worth... you may get that with some other guys if there's a bidding war... but Kreider is the only guy that teams will overpay for outside of McDonagh.



RNH has gotten worse over the years... he'd not a guy you win with imo... go for higher skill or reliability. Clearing space is a smarter move, there will be some very good UFA's.

Backlund is a UFA... that's a very good two way center imo.

Turris, Bozak in the middle.

Hornqvist, Hansen, Komarov, Rousel.

Keep the ca space open, trade pieces like Kreider, Hayes, Vesey... back fill your depth with guys that can play their roles, collect young assets and and sign UFAs.

He's my guy if he makes it to UFA. If the Rangers go the route of trading Hayes, Backlund is a solid two way center that can take hard defensive minutes and contribute offensively as well. He would also be tremendously helpful in insulating Chytil and Andersson in the next couple of years.

Turris will be overpaid. Bozak would be my plan C or D concerning bringing in a center, but he wouldn't be awful.

Hornqvist will be overpaid. Hansen was healthy scratched in San Jose for the last couple, wasn't he? Pass.

Komarov and Roussel would be excellent additions to add a little piss and vinegar to the forward corps.

 

[DanielBrassard]

I am really skeptical of trading Kreider. Has he reached the potential most people thought he had? No, but he's still one of our best forwards, on a great contract, and he's one of the few guys on this team that is a great skater. I think we would need to get back Yamamoto+ to trade him

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I love Roussel as much as the next guy and this team needs his crazy desperately, but he's so getting the Matt Martin/Brandon Prust contract which will lead to four years of some team's fanbase on HF destroying his contract.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Just going to leave this here:

There is considerable chatter circulating within the industry that Tuesday night’s match at the
Garden against Vegas could be determinative for coach Alain Vigneault, whose Rangers slipped to 3-7-2 with Saturday night’s 5-4 defeat in Montreal that featured another distressing, no-show first period.

http://nypost.com/2017/10/29/alain-...-left/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

 

[Fitzy]

Shipachev for Tambellini and Graves

Extremely hesitant to make a move for a guy at a significant cap hit who hasn't yet proven anything in the NHL.

High reward, for sure, but there is a bit of risk as well. Can NYR re-sign Miller, Hayes, and Skjei if they add Ship's 4 mil? Would it ruin a possible chance at signing Tavares?

 

[NYR Viper]

If there is a team willing to overpay for Kreider you make the deal. He will be tremendously difficult to replace, yes. So is Stepan. This is the point of rebuilding so the team doesn’t toil in mediocrity. Build a new young core that can come up together.

Puljujaarvi would be a tremendous addition to the prospect pool for this organization. He had a very good rookie season in the AHL last year for an 18 year old playing in North America for the first time. See if Edmonton would move their 1st in 18 as well. Even a pick in the 20 range would allow this organization to add another quality piece.

If Kreider is dealt Nash is just a matter of time. Let him build up his value until the deadline and then see what team really wants him. Same goes for DD, Grabner, Holden.

Getting picks/prospects back for those guys along with the Kreider deal and this organization may have been able to practically fully restock and rebuild in a matter of 2 years.

ADA
Andersson
Chytil
Pionk
Puljujaarvi
NYR 1st 18
EDM 1st 18
Pick from Nash
Pick from Grabner
Pick from Holden

Re-evaluate the depth after the trade deadline by seeing how guys like Nieves, Lettieri, ADA, Pionk, Puljujaarvi, and any others they want to see and determine where an addition is needed.

 

[Fitzy]

Maybe its the name, nationality, and position, but Puljujaarvi just constantly brings me back to the disasters that was Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson.

No sense in it, just seems weirdly comparable in career tracks so far.

 

[Alluckks]

Kreider
Nash @ 50%
Grabner @ 50%

for

Draisaitl
Puljujarvi

 

[Avery16]

Your periodic reminder that Jagr is not bringing anything to the Flames

 

[Alluckks]

Maybe its the name, nationality, and position, but Puljujaarvi just constantly brings me back to the disasters that was Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson.

No sense in it, just seems weirdly comparable in career tracks so far.

He has far less value than general HF likes to give him - which is par for the course

 

[Fitzy]

Kreider
Nash @ 50%
Grabner @ 50%

for

Draisaitl
Puljujarvi

Not even close. Doubt we'd get Draisaitl alone for that package.

Drai is a 1A center, 22* years old. He's got to be one of the top 30 most valuable pieces in the league. Think of it as trading for Eichel/Matthews.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Dear Jeff Gorton,

If you are having second thoughts about AV as coach, please do the fanbase a favor and just rip the band aid off

Thank you

Reading Brooks article legit just made my day

 

[Fitzy]

Well, since the coach is part of the roster, who would all of you like to be the replacement?

Ruff?
Therrien?

 

[Ail]

Extremely hesitant to make a move for a guy at a significant cap hit who hasn't yet proven anything in the NHL.

High reward, for sure, but there is a bit of risk as well. Can NYR re-sign Miller, Hayes, and Skjei if they add Ship's 4 mil? Would it ruin a possible chance at signing Tavares?

Not to mention the guy is 30, they just traded Stepan and people were justifying that because he was aging, and in decline.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Well, since the coach is part of the roster, who would all of you like to be the replacement?

Ruff?
Therrien?

Ruff is going to be the replacement

That's why he was hired

He isn't the long term solution though

 

[I Eat Crow]

Ruff is going to be the replacement

That's why he was hired

He isn't the long term solution though

Ruff is going to finish out the year. After that, we hope and pray that Barry Trotz or Joel Quenneville become available. Those would be my top two picks.