Roster Building Thread - Part XI (Off-season edition)

[Paulie Walnutz]

Looks like Buffalo might buy out Skinner. I wonder if signing him like how Dallas did with Duchene makes sense

 

[Guyute]

What do people think of this idea?

Trouba (3.5 mil retained for 2 years)

for

Jeff Skinner (4.5 mil retained for 3 years)

This would result in Skinner costing us 8 mil for 2 years and then 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

Trouba would cost Buffalo 9 mil for 2 years, after which they'd have a cap hit of 4.5 mil for 1 year.

Buffalo gets a veteran leader who can add some size and physicality to their defense while saving 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

The Rangers take on an extra 4.5 mil 3 years from now, but they get a player who may be a fit in the top 6.

We could also potentially expand the deal to include Goodrow (1 mil retained) for Jokiharju.

Thoughts?

Sounds like Buffalo is going to buy out Skinner so you can have him for free if you want

 

[LOFIN]

Exactly. There really needs to be some sort of compromise in the cap to 1) level the cost of living/tax playing field and 2) reward teams for drafting and developing well.

The first one is really a non-issue. Multiple agents have debunked the myth that the difference between state taxes is actually a factor in what the players take home. So much depends on how much you are paid in salary vs signing bonuses, where you live your offseasons, what away teams you play, are you putting the money on differend funds etc. Short version: the players (especially the star players who can afford a competent accountant) playing in these high-tax states (Canada, New York, California) will take home just as much as those players in non/low-tax states. Also, living costs? Oh please. Why not make a compromise to the cap where Winnipeg gets extra because the weather is shitty.

For like 95% of the players, they don't really care about the specific # of dollars they are making, or how much more they have to spend on their living. What they care about is how they stack up against their peers, because most of the top athletes have giant egos. That's how they became this good.


As for the 2nd part, there definitely should be a way to keep the players you have drafted OR have played for your team for X number of years much easier. Be it by exemptions, or by a different cap% modifier whatever.

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

I always feel like if the Rangers had Zuc vs the Kings or Buch this year they win the cup

They are always 1 key player away

We did have Zucc v the Kings?

There's nothing I'm more right about than bad defensemen. I can smell them.

As NYR fans we get a lot of practice sniffing them out. It's, ah, a familiar odor.

 

[Machinehead]

Skinner drives offense at 5v5 like f***ing crazy.

I'm concerned about the defense number. Not because I care about defense but that number shows up for different reasons. If it's there because he legit just sucks at covering people, I really don't care. If it's there because he avoids the boards and can't hang onto the puck, I'm concerned.

 

[bhamill]

The first one is really a non-issue. Multiple agents have debunked the myth that the difference between state taxes is actually a factor in what the players take home. So much depends on how much you are paid in salary vs signing bonuses, where you live your offseasons, what away teams you play, are you putting the money on differend funds etc. Short version: the players (especially the star players who can afford a competent accountant) playing in these high-tax states (Canada, New York, California) will take home just as much as those players in non/low-tax states.

As for the 2nd part, there definitely should be a way to keep the players you have drafted OR have played for your team for X number of years much easier. Be it by exemptions, or by a different cap% modifier whatever.

Well every game played in NYC is taxed with the local/state income tax, non resident if your "home" address is elsewhere. (Every game's salary is taxed in the state where the game is played. At least that is how it was explained to me by an accountant. If I'm wrong please don't hesitate to correct me.) As opposed to ZERO state income tax, yes that is a difference. Unless you are an actual tax cheat, there is CERTAINLY an advantage to playing at least half your games in a no tax state.

 

[McRanger92]

Ive always kinda liked Skinner, but maybe thats because he has always scored against us. He can put the puck in the net at least but can he gain the zone? Thats kinda what they need at top 6RW

 

[effen]

I feel like Lindgren is the worst at protecting himself of maybe any player I've ever seen. That guy gets horribly boarded like 2x per game. At some point its like...its not them dude, its you.

Libor Hajek waves hi because he can't speak with a feeding tube (he is fine don't worry).

 

[LOFIN]

Well every game played in NYC is taxed with the local/state income tax, non resident if your "home" address is elsewhere. (Every game's salary is taxed in the state where the game is played. At least that is how it was explained to me by an accountant. If I'm wrong please don't hesitate to correct me.) As opposed to ZERO state income tax, yes that is a difference. Unless you are an actual tax cheat, there is CERTAINLY an advantage to playing at least half your games in a no tax state.

Sure. But if you are not paid in salary but signing bonuses...

Auston Matthews Shoots and Scores Tax Savings | Crowe Soberman LLP

On February 5, Auston Matthews signed a 5-year contract extension with the Leafs for $58.15M. Fans have reason to be thrilled today, but Canadian taxpayers may be a bit irritated.

www.crowe.com

 

[effen]

Steve Sullivan Jeff Skinner really only fits on a team like Nashville that can support his style.

 

[Levitate]

View attachment 883928

Skinner drives offense at 5v5 like f***ing crazy.

I'm concerned about the defense number. Not because I care about defense but that number shows up for different reasons. If it's there because he legit just sucks at covering people, I really don't care. If it's there because he avoids the boards and can't hang onto the puck, I'm concerned.

I think he floats like crazy as the big issue

 

[bhamill]

Sure. But if you are not paid in salary but signing bonuses...

Auston Matthews Shoots and Scores Tax Savings | Crowe Soberman LLP

On February 5, Auston Matthews signed a 5-year contract extension with the Leafs for $58.15M. Fans have reason to be thrilled today, but Canadian taxpayers may be a bit irritated.

www.crowe.com

If the signing bonus is paid out in NY then that will likely be taxed at the NY rate... Canada has different tax laws than us. Mathews is also an American citizen I don't know how that sits in Canadian Tax Law, but according to your articla it has a huge bearing:

As pertains to "athlete taxes in Canada, the main factor in determining how much Canadian income tax a player pays is based on his residency. While many factors can affect the determination of where a player resides for tax purposes, most foreign-born players, like Matthews, can likely structure their affairs to avoid triggering Canadian residency rules.

Why is residency important? Sticking with the Maple Leafs example, players who are residents of either Canada or the United States are taxed on their entire salary in their home country. Those who are considered residents of the U.S. must also pay tax in Canada – but only to the extent of time on Canadian soil."

And that is also about FEDERAL, or whatever they call it in Canada, taxes, not state or local. I imagine different provinces and cities have local taxes as well, but I don't know the rules up there.

In the states, you are taxed in the state/locality where you earn it. If you are a non resident, you are taxed at a lower rate than resident, but certainly more than a no tax state. If you are being paid to play hockey in NY you are getting taxed.

 

[nsvoyageurs]

hat do people think of this idea?

Trouba (3.5 mil retained for 2 years)

for

Jeff Skinner (4.5 mil retained for 3 years)

This would result in Skinner costing us 8 mil for 2 years and then 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

Trouba would cost Buffalo 9 mil for 2 years, after which they'd have a cap hit of 4.5 mil for 1 year.

Buffalo gets a veteran leader who can add some size and physicality to their defense while saving 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

The Rangers take on an extra 4.5 mil 3 years from now, but they get a player who may be a fit in the top 6.

We could also potentially expand the deal to include Goodrow (1 mil retained) for Jokiharju.

Thoug

What do people think of this idea?

Trouba (3.5 mil retained for 2 years)

for

Jeff Skinner (4.5 mil retained for 3 years)

This would result in Skinner costing us 8 mil for 2 years and then 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

Trouba would cost Buffalo 9 mil for 2 years, after which they'd have a cap hit of 4.5 mil for 1 year.

Buffalo gets a veteran leader who can add some size and physicality to their defense while saving 4.5 mil in the 3rd year.

The Rangers take on an extra 4.5 mil 3 years from now, but they get a player who may be a fit in the top 6.

We could also potentially expand the deal to include Goodrow (1 mil retained) for Jokiharju.

Thoughts?

Delete my post here; already info already posted by others. My bad.

 

[LOFIN]

In the states, you are taxed in the state/locality where you earn it. If you are a non resident, you are taxed at a lower rate than resident, but certainly more than a no tax state. If you are being paid to play hockey in NY you are getting taxed.

So who makes the determination on "where you are earning", and based on what grounds? Is there a tax official who makes a judgement call if necessary? Not just talking about hockey, but in general. If you are getting paid for the job while not living in the state? If you are working remote for a job in a different state? If you are working in a different state but living in NY?

Getting a bit astray here but it's the offseason this is what it's all about I guess.

 

[Mandar]

I think he floats like crazy as the big issue

If he ever got into the playoffs, he would surely move the needle......backwards.

 

[Vitto79]

Looks like Buffalo might buy out Skinner. I wonder if signing him like how Dallas did with Duchene makes sense

That’s what they did with Wheeler
It’s a low risk signing with Skinner

 

[n8]

That’s what they did with Wheeler
It’s a low risk signing with Skinner

He's younger too but does he play RW?
Also, the man has never seen playoff hockey in his entire NHL career.

 

[Vitto79]

He's younger too but does he play RW?

Yup both wings

 

[bhamill]

So who makes the determination on "where you are earning", and based on what grounds? Is there a tax official who makes a judgement call if necessary? Not just talking about hockey, but in general. If you are getting paid for the job while not living in the state? If you are working remote for a job in a different state? If you are working in a different state but living in NY?

Getting a bit astray here but it's the offseason this is what it's all about I guess.

If MSG/NYR are paying you a signing bonus, it would seem most likely you are being paid "in" NY. If you work remotely, out of state, for a NY employer, you are still considered to be earning "in NY." As far as actually playing games what I'm told is that base the salary for each game on WHERE the game is played.
A signing bonus isn't exactly "pay" so I'm not going to try to say anything with any certainty, but states write their tax laws to try to generate tax income, not lose out on it.

Yup, its offseason alright. Hahaha.

 

[McRanger92]

Stammer and JAM both projected to get 3 year deals with AAVs in the 6s (as per Daily faceoff)? Gimme dat.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Have fun everyone!

https://x.com/i/web/status/1803112671312499110

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

If Skinner gets bought out I can pretty much guarantee that a team like Colorado ends up signing him for cheap.

He'd essentially take over the role that Drouin had last year.

I don't think he'd be a fit here, we don't really have the quality forward depth to support a player with his shortcomings.

 

[McRanger92]

Have fun everyone!

https://x.com/i/web/status/1803112671312499110

This was clearly edited to make it look like a return to NY is possible, but thats not what Seravalli said.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

The Patrick Kane ship sailed a while ago.

The only way it works even a little bit is if they boot Panarin and he'd be like... low on my list of players I'd look at to bridge some of the gap there.

Really outside of Guentzel, I'm not really interested in any of the other "top 6" options out there in UFA and thats a guy I'd grab strictly to slot right into where Panarin plays right now.

 

[LOFIN]

If MSG/NYR are paying you a signing bonus, it would seem most likely you are being paid "in" NY. If you work remotely, out of state, for a NY employer, you are still considered to be earning "in NY." As far as actually playing games what I'm told is that base the salary for each game on WHERE the game is played.
A signing bonus isn't exactly "pay" so I'm not going to try to say anything with any certainty, but states write their tax laws to try to generate tax income, not lose out on it.

Yup, its offseason alright. Hahaha.

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle (as usual lol). But I maintain my stance that the tax-differential isn't really a thing in the NHL. It's just a scapegoat for especially Canadian fans, for why their teams have been so bad they haven't been able to win a cup in 30 years.