Roster Building Thread: Part VII (2023-24)

[The Crypto Guy]

Kreider had that style in his game at one point. But he got suspended a few times early in his career for "dirty" hits that were just a case of him being stronger than the other guy. Plus the blood clotting issue and he hasn't played that way in a while. He does need to let other team's know he' there a little more, especially in a long playoff series.

This is such a BS excuse, I'm sorry. And fun fact, Kreider has NEVER been suspended. He has just become a less physical player because that's how he wants to play. It's a real shame because he should be bowling players all over the ice if he wanted to.

 

[TGWL]

This is a very good point that he has figured something out.

Tomas Holmstrom, John LeClair, and Adam Graves had their backs reduced to mush after their playing careers in front of the net.

Inference in front of the net gets called a lot more these days. Players don't take as many stupid penalties or cheap shots in front of the net anymore. They can't get away with it anymore.

 

[CLW]

The problem is that he plays a lot. People don't want to accept that, but he does. He's not on the first unit but he's closer to the first unit than the 7th most used player is to him.

He really doesn't have all that much skill despite his pedigree and doesn't really know what he's doing. That's just my eye test.

Most players who are hapless on the powerplay don't play on the powerplay. He wouldn't be dead last if the sample included players in the bottom half of lineups.

Long story short, he's not actually that bad, he's just not that good at being a top six forward. That tracks with what he does 5v5.

People see Lafreniere (or want to see him) as a top six player getting third line usage. He's a lot closer to the third line player getting top six usage.

That's what you get when "the process" is to put the kids on the third line while you wait for the stars to age out down the line. NYR hockey.

It's easy to see that the Rangers want playoff hockey more than they care about development. Players are only commodities in this approach and the players attitude inevitably reflects this.

So rhe stars hog the minutes because in the cycle of "the process" it's their turn to shine, which means they get PP minutes and the PP and game in general is built around their strengths and the way they want to play (hi Jack Hughes). Add coaches who get told to make the playoffs at any cost and voila you've got tepid NYR hockey.

 

[McRanger92]

This is such a BS excuse, I'm sorry. And fun fact, Kreider has NEVER been suspended. He has just become a less physical player because that's how he wants to play. It's a real shame because he should be bowling players all over the ice if he wanted to.

You are right. Im misremembering a hit against Jonas Brodin at MSG many moons ago. He got a 5 minute major but no suspension. That was also a wild (no pun intended) 3rd period comeback for the Rangers. Pretty sure Duclair scored the game winner.

But i digress, I'm not making an excuse for Kreider, just trying to rationalize why he no longer plays that way.

 

[tlk]

Kreider has NEVER been suspended. He has just become a less physical player because

got rib(s) removed?

 

[Fitzy]

I mean, almost no one ever even tries to move Kreider from the front of the net on the power play any more which indicates to me that he’s pretty much established that he’s gonna be there and there’s nothing anyone can do about it

 

[Machinehead]

If Kreider can be the board and net presence he is without taking penalties (and he's very penalty-averse), I don't see that as a bad thing.

Also, I think @Fitzy makes an excellent point. There's a huge element of guys just not bothering with Kreider at this point. It makes more sense to just concede space to him and do something else.

 

[Raspewtin]

If Kreider can be the board and net presence he is without taking penalties (and he's very penalty-averse), I don't see that as a bad thing.

Also, I think @Fitzy makes an excellent point. There's a huge element of guys just not bothering with Kreider at this point. It makes more sense to just concede space to him and do something else.

There's also the alternative of he gets tightly covered by two guys like in games 3-7 of the NJ series which frees Panarin to walk right into the danger zone with the puck, which of course he didn't bother doing.

Kreider is a massive threat by existing. We went ice cold on those PPs because Panarin and Kane couldn't do anything at all with the space they got. In most circumstances, it would've been a huge positive that half the PK unit is covering Kreider.

 

[NYR Viper]

Kreider is elite at that he is elite at. The fact that his defensive game has grown leaps and bounds makes his TOI grow and more opportunities to use those abilities.

If points were granted for guys actually creating the chance or having a direct effect on a goal, Kreider would be well above a ppg.

This may be an odd opinion but another guy on this team with a similar ability to create chances and yet not receive a point is Kaako. His point totals would be far closer to 60 than what they have been if points and assists were granted to those who did the heavy lift in creating the chance rather than the last 2 guys to touch the puck.

 

[TGWL]

Kreider also positions himself a few feet from the middle until traffic starts going to the middle, then he's adjusting to screen the goalie based on where the shot is being taken from. A lot of tips, whether they go in or barley miss, are when he's on the side of the goalie.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Kreider is elite at that he is elite at. The fact that his defensive game has grown leaps and bounds makes his TOI grow and more opportunities to use those abilities.

If points were granted for guys actually creating the chance or having a direct effect on a goal, Kreider would be well above a ppg.

This may be an odd opinion but another guy on this team with a similar ability to create chances and yet not receive a point is Kaako. His point totals would be far closer to 60 than what they have been if points and assists were granted to those who did the heavy lift in creating the chance rather than the last 2 guys to touch the puck.

Point taken that goals are a team effort and there's not statistic to quantify that but it is still far more valuable to be the guy directly setting up or burying his chances.

 

[NYR Viper]

Point taken that goals are a team effort and there's not statistic to quantify that but it is still far more valuable to be the guy directly setting up or burying his chances.

I get that, but we have seen on countless occasions, just last year, where Kreider directly leads to a goal by screening the goalie or drawing attention to himself which leaves someone open. Yes, that is the team portion of the game but his point totals don't properly reflect his on ice effect.

I would argue that Kaako had a similar feel last year where he would make quite a number of plays where he would steal a puck or control the puck down low, draw defenders to him and then move it to create quite a few opportunities for others. Many of those were either missed or somehow would lead to a quick succession of easy passes which led to goals.

I guess that should be covered under expected goals for numbers though?

 

[haohmaru]

The only guys I can come with that had more points in a four year stretch than Panarin has had as a Ranger is Jean Ratelle and Rod Gilbert.

@Amazing Kreiderman - that sound right?

 

[Levitate]

I feel like Kreider would have sniffed 45-50 goals again last year if he had some more lucky
so many tips that went in the prior year just missed this past year

but that's luck and how it goes

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

I feel like Kreider would have sniffed 45-50 goals again last year if he had some more lucky
so many tips that went in the prior year just missed this past year

but that's luck and how it goes

Didn’t he have only like 4 PPG last season?

 

[eco's bones]

Mika's PWP goals were down in 21-22 but he like the others in the first unit were moving more plays through Kreider. Last year it was more Mika and less Kreider but both of them are super dangerous on the PWP. I don't think the Rangers power play was really less dangerous last year than the year before and the end of the day as long as we have one of the better power plays it doesn't matter much to me who gets the goals. Those two are our main finishers though.

On Kakko--I think he takes the next step shooting more. Last year he was driving the net more and that's something that he still could do a bit more of but his shots on goal were somewhat lower than Filip and Lafreniere yet a lot of the time he was the guy really cycling the best and driving the play. Part of it is he's too unselfish sometimes and part of it is he's too hesitant when opportunities come along. Sometimes it's a split second for a shot or the opportunity goes away. That's killer instinct. It needs to kick in for him more.

 

[RangersFan1994]

Get this done.

 

[Ruggs225]

7 years for $4m would be an absolute steal

 

[RangersFan1994]

For some reason with lack of RW depth, I can see Josh Bailey here on a tryout. Not that I would want it, he would not be a bad option. If it came down to another vet, I rather get Kessel if that is the case who is a much better player.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

I love Lindy enough to consciously know he'll be useless by year 4 or 5 of that deal but I still want it to be signed ASAP. AAV is incredible and when the cap starts going up it will be an outright steal.

 

[NickyFotiu]

I view Lindy as a bottom pairing guy in the future so such a long contract may not be ideal. I say that despite being a huge fan of his.

It is almost September. Shouldn't Laf be signed by now?

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

7 years for Lindgren is too long, don’t care what the AAV is

 

[SA16]

I view Lindy as a bottom pairing guy in the future so such a long contract may not be ideal. I say that despite being a huge fan of his.

It is almost September. Shouldn't Laf be signed by now?

I look at as a good thing he's not signed yet. He's probably so busy working out in the weight room and working on his skating on the ice that he isn't able to take time out of his day to sign some paperwork.

 

[GAGLine]

7 years for Lindgren is too long, don’t care what the AAV is

So you would say no to 7 years at 1 mil?

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

So you would say no to 7 years at 1 mil?

Obviously not but that’s not reality so try again lol