Roster Building thread - Part IX - (2024 edition)

[cheech70]

Let’s not forget how disconnected Brooks has been with the front office for years now. I don’t think he sees or smells any smoke anymore.

The last year or so Larry has been on the money with inside info...

 

[LOFIN]

Who was it last year (or during the summer) that said Laf is being shopped, and the Rangers denyed it and such a thing never happened?

I'm not saying trading Kakko is unrealistic, or even stupid if it's the right trade. But I have a fear it's going to be something like Kakko and a 2nd for Monahan.

It shouldn't be a surprising notion to anyone that the Rangers see themselves as a contender.

The league is more wide open than it has been for years. You get a hot Shesterkin and Zibanejad unf***s himself a little bit, this team can easily make a big run.

 

[surlysailor]

Haha...if he doesn't score more soon he won't get paid anywhere unless he joins the Swiss league . I just want Cuylee in the top 6 be it either wing if Kreider won't work on RW . Moving Cuylee up increases our physical play and KK solidifies a 3rd line RW problem and also opens up a spot for Othmann next season . We just need a 3rd line C for this season and go plug and play on the 4th line the rest of the way in the playoffs . One simple add upfront . And one simple addition on the D for a 3-4rd pick ? Pray Shesty gets back. Save top picks for future needs .

Well he does have 2 goals in his last 2 games, and 3 points in 8. I know not great no one outside the Panarin line has been lighting it up, and he tends to be the first one benched and given less ice time in those games. KK is a perfect 3c, esp with Cuylle. KK has been setting him up quite a bit but Cuylle isn't getting anything in. Plus they have Brodz centering them. If they can get a legit 3c at a cheaper cost (like Roslovic, or some other under the radar pick up) they should be able to get rolling a bit. Also ideally they can upgrade Wheeler with a Duclair type, then it give PL some flexibility and esp to swap things around mid game. Also Duclair shouldn't be a crazy cost. I'd venture a 2nd at best with the way his season's gone. Also I don't hate the idea of getting Johanson from the Avs as long as the cost is Goodrow. Gets nyr out of a long term contract, but adds a higher priced player for this and next year. A player PL is familiar with. Avs get a gritty guy who can play up and down the lineup and most likely wouldn't be on Goody's NT list, and has that "cup winning" mentality.

 

[Machinehead]

The league is more wide open than it has been for years. You get a hot Shesterkin and Zibanejad unf***s himself a little bit, this team can easily make a big run.

They made a big run in 2022. When are they raising the banner?

They have almost no chance of winning the Cup with this team.

 

[cheech70]

What we are trying to do with Elias is hope with a fresh start he can give us 2020-2023 stats...which is pretty recent

2018-19	Calgary Flames	NHL	81	27	51	78	20	30	|	Playoffs	5	1	1	2	4	-5
	Sweden	WC	8	1	5	6	2	2	|
	Sweden (all)	International	10	2	5	7	2	1	|
2019-20	Calgary Flames	NHL	70	29	25	54	22	-8	|	Playoffs	10	2	4	6	2	1
2020-21	Calgary Flames	NHL	56	19	28	47	22	10	|
2021-22	Calgary Flames	NHL	82	42	40	82	22	61	|	Playoffs	12	5	4	9	6	-7
2022-23	Calgary Flames “A”	NHL	80	22	42	64	14	6	|
2023-24	Calgary Flames “A”	NHL	49	9	23	32	21	-8	|
	Projected	NHL	82	15	38	53

 

[Machinehead]

Every year we talk about how wide open it is, but the cream is rising like it always does. Carolina and Florida are both comfortably in playoff positions. I would be very unsurprised if that's the ECF again.

And that's in the East which is ass this year. Out of the 8 teams in playoff position in the West, I would bet the house on us losing a series to 7 of them.

 

[McRanger92]

What we are trying to do with Elias is hope with a fresh start he can give us 2020-2023 stats...which is pretty recent


[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]2018-19[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]81[/TD]
[TD]27[/TD]
[TD]51[/TD]
[TD]78[/TD]
[TD]20[/TD]
[TD]30[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD]Playoffs[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]-5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]

Sweden[/TD]
[TD]WC[/TD]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]

Sweden (all)[/TD]
[TD]International[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]7[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2019-20[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]70[/TD]
[TD]29[/TD]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD]54[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]-8[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD]Playoffs[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2020-21[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]56[/TD]
[TD]19[/TD]
[TD]28[/TD]
[TD]47[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-22[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]82[/TD]
[TD]42[/TD]
[TD]40[/TD]
[TD]82[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]61[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD]Playoffs[/TD]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]-7[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022-23[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames “A”[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]80[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]42[/TD]
[TD]64[/TD]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2023-24[/TD]
[TD]

Calgary Flames “A”[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]49[/TD]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]23[/TD]
[TD]32[/TD]
[TD]21[/TD]
[TD]-8[/TD]
[TD]|[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]

Projected[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]82[/TD]
[TD]15[/TD]
[TD]38[/TD]
[TD]53[/TD]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

He was playing with Tkachuk during that time.

 

[Raspewtin]

I was vocally against giving this core another chance. I thought their well documented struggles against the younger teams in the east, especially NJ, were enough to tell us that this core wasn't going to get any better or get a better chance than last year which is why I came to terms with Tara/Kane pretty quickly, even though they turned out to be bad moves.

They obviously didn't listen to me and gave them another shot and it hasn't really blown up in their faces like I thought with NJ struggling mightily and the east in general being pretty bad. I vehemently disagree with another "all in" year but I can see the logic behind it...

This absolutely does not excuse a Lindholm add which imo would be one of the worst trades this team has made in years unless the value is laughably low. He's not good.

He was playing with Tkachuk during that time.

And Gaudreau

 

[McRanger92]

Is Larry wrong, though?

"But an overpay for Lindholm — which by definition they would be obligated to do in order to obtain the veteran who, by the way, is 9-32-41 in 49 games with two goals in his last 25 games, and welcome to the party! — would be a historically Rangerish move."

He's not wrong. They got Tarasenko and Kane last year, both struggling, both rentals, both aging stars, both obvious moves. People were screaming last year that it wasn't an all-in deadline, and they did that anyway.

Larry's opinions suck and yes, he flip-flops. He'll sit there and say this guy and that guy isn't a game-changer but the next face puncher he suggests will be a game-changer.

That being said, this piece is mostly not opinion. When Larry says "I heard this," he generally heard it. That's not to say that Lindholm is definitely coming here but they're definitely interested. And it's stupid, and people are right to be concerned. Lindholm has been really bad this year and it just isn't the move to make.

Larry mentions a "summer of renovation." I don't know if that's wishful speculation or that's also something he heard, but they're likely going all-in with this group at least one more time. It shouldn't be a surprising notion to anyone that the Rangers see themselves as a contender.

Lindholm is not my top choice and I have no interest trading Kakko for him, but if they are going all in and getting a bottom 6 C and another defenseman on top of Lindholm, he is theoretically a fit. Hes better as a RW i believe. Im very into the plan to retool this offseason is it doesnt work out. I really just dont want Drury to get fleeced in any of these deals.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Lindgren and Kakko will be going to Ottawa with a couple of pieces for a F’in haul.

That’s my dream, that’s my nightmare….

 

[McRanger92]

I was vocally against giving this core another chance. I thought their well documented struggles against the younger teams in the east, especially NJ, were enough to tell us that this core wasn't going to get any better or get a better chance than last year which is why I came to terms with Tara/Kane pretty quickly, even though they turned out to be bad moves.

They obviously didn't listen to me and gave them another shot and it hasn't really blown up in their faces like I thought with NJ struggling mightily and the east in general being pretty bad. I vehemently disagree with another "all in" year but I can see the logic behind it...

This absolutely does not excuse a Lindholm add which imo would be one of the worst trades this team has made in years unless the value is laughably low. He's not good.


And Gaudreau

The thing about Lindholm is he wouldnt be replacing Chytil. Laviolette would have him playing on Kreider & Mika's wing after 2 shifts. Which admittedly would probably work out fine because he has shown to be at his best playing with top players. But that still leaves them with holes in the bottom 6 and on D. If they are going to go all-in, go all-in. Then we will see where the chips fall in the summer i guess.

 

[Machinehead]

Lindholm is all over the place.

This year, he's getting sub-NHL results.

He was excellent in 2022 but he was playing with Gaudreau who is Marcel Dionne at even strength, and Tkachuk who is LeBron James on skates. These numbers are supposed to adjust for teammates but I'm assuming that process is not perfect.

Last year he had a decent year without either of his former teammates. It's an upgrade on what we have, but it's only decent. If the truth is more towards 2023, which I tend to believe, he's simply not worth the price that is rumored.

 

[McRanger92]

Lindholm is all over the place.

View attachment 813086

This year, he's getting sub-NHL results.

View attachment 813089

He was excellent in 2022 but he was playing with Gaudreau who is Marcel Dionne at even strength, and Tkachuk who is LeBron James on skates. These numbers are supposed to adjust for teammates but I'm assuming that process is not perfect.

View attachment 813090

Last year he had a decent year without either of his former teammates. It's an upgrade on what we have, but it's only decent. If the truth is more towards 2023, which I tend to believe, he's simply not worth the price that is rumored.

Should be noted that Lindholm has been a target of the Rangers going back to the Gorton days. At least according to our old friend @Edge

 

[Machinehead]

Also, like, realistically, what does re-tooling in the summer look like?

Zibanejad has a NMC. The organization licks the ground Trouba walks on. Panarin is in the Hart discussion. None of those guys are going anywhere IMO.

Maybe they move on from guys like Kakko and Lindgren (although, to my knowledge, Lindgren has never been rumored, and it's just people on HF who want that) and shuffle things around the margins. I guess, but 8 and 93 are the two biggest problems.

If the plan is to downgrade on Kreider just to do something, that ain't it.

 

[Kovalev27]

Where was this reported?

On the ice in front of all of us when his fat ass put up 3 pts in 20 games and he got thrown around like a rag doll until he got hurt then came back and talked about how he had to work out the whole time he was out

 

[savebyrichter94]

Lindholm is all over the place.

View attachment 813086

This year, he's getting sub-NHL results.

View attachment 813089

He was excellent in 2022 but he was playing with Gaudreau who is Marcel Dionne at even strength, and Tkachuk who is LeBron James on skates. These numbers are supposed to adjust for teammates but I'm assuming that process is not perfect.

View attachment 813090

Last year he had a decent year without either of his former teammates. It's an upgrade on what we have, but it's only decent. If the truth is more towards 2023, which I tend to believe, he's simply not worth the price that is rumored.

Agreed, not sold on him, a few years ago he was getting ripped on, then that line had a really nice run, now it seems like with these guys gone he’s regressed back a bit towards the player he was before that

 

[McRanger92]

Also, like, realistically, what does re-tooling in the summer look like?

Zibanejad has a NMC. The organization licks the ground Trouba walks on. Panarin is in the Hart discussion. None of those guys are going anywhere IMO.

Maybe they move on from guys like Kakko and Lindgren (although, to my knowledge, Lindgren has never been rumored, and it's just people on HF who want that) and shuffle things around the margins. I guess, but 8 and 93 are the two biggest problems.

If the plan is to downgrade on Kreider just to do something, that ain't it.

I dont think Trouba is as safe as you think. The last 2 captains we've had were also good ol' American boys and were shipped out in-season.

 

[TopShelfSnipes]

Is Larry wrong, though?

"But an overpay for Lindholm — which by definition they would be obligated to do in order to obtain the veteran who, by the way, is 9-32-41 in 49 games with two goals in his last 25 games, and welcome to the party! — would be a historically Rangerish move."

He's not wrong. They got Tarasenko and Kane last year, both struggling, both rentals, both aging stars, both obvious moves. People were screaming last year that it wasn't an all-in deadline, and they did that anyway.

Larry's opinions suck and yes, he flip-flops. He'll sit there and say this guy and that guy isn't a game-changer but the next face puncher he suggests will be a game-changer.

That being said, this piece is mostly not opinion. When Larry says "I heard this," he generally heard it. That's not to say that Lindholm is definitely coming here but they're definitely interested. And it's stupid, and people are right to be concerned. Lindholm has been really bad this year and it just isn't the move to make.

Larry mentions a "summer of renovation." I don't know if that's wishful speculation or that's also something he heard, but they're likely going all-in with this group at least one more time. It shouldn't be a surprising notion to anyone that the Rangers see themselves as a contender.

Tarasenko and Mikkola basically cost a late first, a conditional, and addition by subtraction in getting rid of Blais.
I would hardly classify that as a "youth for vets" move, and I really thought the team should have extended Mikkola and moved Lindgren last offseason and was crucified for it which makes the deal look worse retrospectively. Having Mikkola around seemed to help KK relax and produce better down the stretch last year, and tell me you wouldn't trade Lindgren straight up for Mikkola at 2.5 cap hit now.

I also thought Tarasenko wanted to stay - and would have taken a discount for a one-year deal to stay - and the move didn't have to be a rental if the team would have moved on from Goodrow last offseason.

The trade wasn't bad, it was typical bad asset management by the Rangers. Plus not using Tarasenko correctly once they acquired Kane and deciding to pretend it was 2010 all over again in making Kane one of their "stars," which was always stupid when you looked at how he was moving around the ice last year.

This year, moving Kakko and a first for rentals they literally can't afford to keep - or would have to sign to the type of horrible extensions that have kept this team in cap hell for the last 15 years - is orders of magnitude stupider than any of the primary or secondary impacts of last year's deadline moves.

 

[Guyute]

The thing about Lindholm is he wouldnt be replacing Chytil. Laviolette would have him playing on Kreider & Mika's wing after 2 shifts. Which admittedly would probably work out fine because he has shown to be at his best playing with top players. But that still leaves them with holes in the bottom 6 and on D. If they are going to go all-in, go all-in. Then we will see where the chips fall in the summer i guess.

No way you pay through the nose for Lindholm then play him at RW.

He would play with Panarin and Laf. Trocheck would slide down to the 3rd line.

 

[Machinehead]

I dont think Trouba is as safe as you think. The last 2 captains we've had were also good ol' American boys and were shipped out in-season.

Yeah but they didn't see an expanded role the season prior.

We can only speculate on what the front office thinks. You always know what the coach thinks because the usage tells you. Laviolette is head over heels.

Is Drury going to fight with the coach he basically just hired? He has done it before.

If a retool starts by getting rid of an overused 10th percentile player, I'm very here for that new direction.

 

[McRanger92]

No way you pay through the nose for Lindholm then play him at RW.

He would play with Panarin and Laf. Trocheck would slide down to the 3rd line.

That would be incredibly dumb to break up our one working line to shoehorn in a guy who has never played with any of them.

 

[Harbour Dog]

I dont think Trouba is as safe as you think. The last 2 captains we've had were also good ol' American boys and were shipped out in-season.

Not to mention, Trouba is basically a captain by default, because two different coaches and two different GMs struggled to find an effective leader among this core.

 

[McRanger92]

Yeah but they didn't see an expanded role the season prior.

We can only speculate on what the front office thinks. You always know what the coach thinks because the usage tells you. Laviolette is head over heels.

Is Drury going to fight with the coach he basically just hired? He has done it before.

If a retool starts by getting rid of an overused 10th percentile player, I'm very here for that new direction.

Drury waived Bonino on Laviolette. That's at least something. If they bow out in the playoffs early, I do think the conversations start with Meeka, Trouba and Kreider about if they want to be here and where they might be open to going. Goodrow I think is a goner no matter what.

Not to mention, Trouba is basically a captain by default, because two different coaches and two different GMs struggled to find an effective leader among this core.

Fox is obviously the future captain. The one guy on the team who is a lock to outlive everyone else.

 

[bernmeister]

Ryjo for goodrow.

RyJo full pop
for
Good full pop + Leshitshow half retained

 

[irishlaxburger2]

Lindholm provides value on the 1st or 3rd line. He’s good enough to force Zibanejad down the lineup when he’s playing like garbage. Which he currently is.

That’s the real value here versus the other center options. He’s the only one out there that can be a legitimate Zibanejad hedge.