Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXII: Stepping up in a Perfect Storm?

[RGY]

Buffalo can ask for the moon, doesn’t mean they will get it for a disgruntled center that carries a $10 million aav cap hit. Not every team can absorb that.

 

[DutchShamrock]

If you arent willing to part with one of Fox, Lafreniere or Kakko, stop talking about aquiring Eichel, Buffalo needs a homerun or they arent moving him

Same thing was said for Nash, Karlsson and McDonagh. We can't overlook the situation there coupled with a $10m cap hit in a stagnant cap. The number of suitors is drastically limited.

If Gorton blinks first, it could very well end up costing one of those pieces. But we see time and time again that stars return underwhelming packages.

Zib gets dealt to recoup some of the pieces lost in the Eichel trade. Hopefully he could return something similar to the deal he originally came to us in. Something like Glass, a body, and a pick from Vegas if Zib agrees to extend there.

As good as Chytil was looking prior to going down, our center depth is still Zib, Strome, Chytil. So Strome can at least be that buffer for another season if necessary, even if it's not an ideal situation.

That all being said, this team may ultimately look to move on from the high-priced centers of the world and try to find guys who can compliment what they have developing on the wings. Eichel is elite and would be a nice add but is he a necessary one? One could make the argument that this team really needs a Bergeron or Toews more than an Eichel.

Which was like the Gaborik trade, although a bit later.

I do wonder if the Eichel trade could involve Zibanejad instead of Chytil. Buffalo has a long history of acquiring soon to be UFAs. Moulson and Skinner off the top of my head. It always goes bad, but still.

 

[NYR Viper]

A trade for Eichel that includes Chytil means Zibanejad is gone in the off-season unless he takes a sweetheart deal. But let's look at the NHL center depth if a trade was made right now:

Current:
Zib
Strome
Chytil
Howden/Rooney

If the trade was made this season and Chytil was included:
Eichel
Zib
Strome
Howden/Rooney

Next season if the trade was made and Zib is traded:
Eichel
Strome
______
Howden/Rooney


It's not that crazy to assume Gorton could find a young 3C as the main centerpiece for a Zibanejad trade or even if someone like Buchnevich is traded. Strome having another year on his deal may be more of a blessing in this scenario than many originally would have thought when he signed his deal for the simple fact that he provides insulation and time for Gorton to make some moves and have a nice 2/3C signed.

 

[True Blue]

Chytil, Buch, Schneider and a 1st. It feels fair. But has anyone returned that besides the first Duchesne deal? Are there more historical examples that exceed this or fall short?

That is a realistic trade profile for Eichel. Schneider can be Robertson or Lundkvist as well. In a vacuum, Eichel is a wonderful player you trade for and insert at 1C. But it is not really black and white. There are reprecussions.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Buffalo can ask for the moon, doesn’t mean they will get it for a disgruntled center that carries a $10 million aav cap hit. Not every team can absorb that.

The fact of the matter is unless Eichel goes full super villain and makes the entire fanbase turn against him, fans are going to say Buffalo lost the trade regardless of the return

I agree, they’re not getting the moon back.

Hopefully Buffalo is prepared to soften the blow when things go down

 

[cheech70]

From Atlantic

 

[True Blue]

If you arent willing to part with one of Fox, Lafreniere or Kakko, stop talking about aquiring Eichel, Buffalo needs a homerun or they arent moving him

Then they get stuck with a player who wants out and does not want to be there. Does that sound like a better scenario? Buffalo knows all three of those names are off limits. Just as LA for example is not including Byfield.

The thing with trading Eichel is that while there are many teams that would love to take him, there are far fewer that can take on that type of contract, even with sending some sort of salary back. Further, the type of package that it would require, shrinks the field even more. And that includes some prospects that teams will not part with. You also know that a center and one that can step in and play immediately is coming back. The teams that can offer the best packages are probably LA & NYC. Probably Ottawa as well. Of those 3, NY can probably put together the most competitive package. Something like Chytil, Buchnevich, Lundqvist/Robertson & a 2021 1st is probably the best package that Buffalo will see. But making that trade brings its own set of possible issues for the Rangers.

 

[cheech70]

Zib gets dealt to recoup some of the pieces lost in the Eichel trade. Hopefully he could return something similar to the deal he originally came to us in. Something like Glass, a body, and a pick from Vegas if Zib agrees to extend there.

As good as Chytil was looking prior to going down, our center depth is still Zib, Strome, Chytil. So Strome can at least be that buffer for another season if necessary, even if it's not an ideal situation.

That all being said, this team may ultimately look to move on from the high-priced centers of the world and try to find guys who can compliment what they have developing on the wings. Eichel is elite and would be a nice add but is he a necessary one? One could make the argument that this team really needs a Bergeron or Toews more than an Eichel.

Does Mika have a NMC?

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Eichel ending up here vs LA may come down to how good the Sabres think Turcotte is.

I don’t see the Kings moving Byfield.

If they see Turcotte as a 50pt good 2C, and Lundqvist as a potential 1D who complements Dahlin well, could tip the scales in NYR favor.

 

[East Coast Bias]

If you arent willing to part with one of Fox, Lafreniere or Kakko, stop talking about aquiring Eichel, Buffalo needs a homerun or they arent moving him

he’s absolutely not returning a Fox or Lafreniere level player. Kakko is valued wildly differently by lots of people so idk about that

but there is no way he’s returning a top Dman on an ELC or 1st OA on an ELC.

It’s not gonna happen

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

This isn't going to be popular, but in hindsight, Tortorella is right. Kreider is a 6'3" 220 lb freak of nature and doesn't nearly use that frame enough to his advantage.

Kreider is much like a water buffalo. It's certainly big and strong enough to kill a lion if it wanted to but its just not in its nature.

 

[Trxjw]

Which was like the Gaborik trade, although a bit later.

I do wonder if the Eichel trade could involve Zibanejad instead of Chytil. Buffalo has a long history of acquiring soon to be UFAs. Moulson and Skinner off the top of my head. It always goes bad, but still.

Yeah, the Nash/Gaborik movement is a good example.

I have a hard time seeing Zib as a centerpiece, unless Buffalo feels they could flip him for the piece they want. Dealing Eichel away is going to be a pretty clear signal that things are bad there and I can't imagine Zib signing an extension with them. Not unless he's purely after money and doesn't care much about winning or the city in which he plays. Not sure what the club scene is like in Buffalo though.

 

[Trxjw]

Does Mika have a NMC?

Yep.

 

[charliemurphy]

Can I play for shits and giggles?

Eichel for Zib, Buch, 2022 and 2023 1st rounders

 

[jay from jersey]

he’s absolutely not returning a Fox or Lafreniere level player. Kakko is valued wildly differently by lots of people so idk about that

but there is no way he’s returning a top Dman on an ELC or 1st OA on an ELC.

It’s not gonna happen

The salary is going to be a big part of it as well. Eichel is no bargain. He’s paid handsomely for what he is. The only other player signing a deal like that in the same stratosphere in the covid era is Barkov. Maybe Zibby too, but I don’t think he gets 10 plus and a NMC

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

This feels like the Rick Nash trade drama. Wing. NMC, $7.8m (11.1% of the cap), 28 years old, 6 years left. Eichel is 24, center, $10m (12.25%), 5 years left. Some things drag down value, but age and position raise it more. I would expect a better package than Dubinsky, Anisimov, Ericson and a 1st.

We don't have two Chytils which is basically the current comparison to the two NHLers we sent in the deal. Buchnevich? We don't have many forwards that have value and no clauses. Chytil isn't as good but he has a lower cap and more upside left.

I am extremely reluctant to include Nils. His impact on an entry level deal should be massive. Take Fox's impact at the price when Fox gets his next deal which would replace ADA'S hit. Any other defensive prospect is doable for me.

The first here is the great equalizer. Eichel has more value but our 1st is exponentially more valuable than our 1st in the Nash deal.

Chytil, Buch, Schneider and a 1st. It feels fair. But has anyone returned that besides the first Duchesne deal? Are there more historical examples that exceed this or fall short?

I'm way more conservative in building than many here or even Gorton. I want to keep accumulating assets. Trade our glut for another team's glut. Pluck an up and comer. The Kings have too many centers. Especially if they land Eichel. Go that route. It's not an indictment of Eichel. Just my preference.

I literally used the same proposal on the main boards swapping out Schneider for Zac Jones - holy Moley was I crushed on that. Buff fans think they’re gonna get good value and a young on the cusp super star back. They are going to be horrified especially when Eichel’s agent goes public with the trade request and he pulls a PLD. I really think it’s between us and LA and maybe Jack is an East coast guy

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

we're most likely drafting top 10 this year. That 1st will definitely be part of any deal for Eichel.

1st + Chytil + Kravtsov/Lundkvist + a roster player who has a decent cap hit

OR

1st + Kakko + salary
this might be hard to swallow but the odds of Kakko ever reaching Eichel's level are questionable, plus we know we DESPERATELY need centers. We're set on the wings even if Kakko becomes a star we have Panarin, Laf, and Kravtsov

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

we're most likely drafting top 10 this year. That 1st will definitely be part of any deal for Eichel.

Yeah thats a given and an easy piece to give up in this deal.

The unspoken downside to Eichel is that trading for him extends Quinn's leash.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Yeah thats a given and an easy piece to give up in this deal.

The unspoken downside to Eichel is that trading for him extends Quinn's leash.

notorious coach killer Eichel may be just what we need to get rid of Quinn tho

 

[Avery16]

Look at the deal that brought ROR to St. Louis:

Berglund, Sobotka, Tage Thompson, a 1st and a 2nd. Berglund and Sobotka were a cap dump to fit ROR, but were also bodies for Buffalo. Thompson was a recent late 1st.

Strome, ADA, Howden, two 1sts

Next season:

Lafreniere/Eichel/Kreider
Panarin/Zibanejad/Buchnevich
Kravtsov/Chytil/Kakko
Lemieux/Barron/Gauthier

 

[JimmyG89]

Eichel ending up here vs LA may come down to how good the Sabres think Turcotte is.

I don’t see the Kings moving Byfield.

If they see Turcotte as a 50pt good 2C, and Lundqvist as a potential 1D who complements Dahlin well, could tip the scales in NYR favor.

Probably more or less depends on what their plans are for their defense. You have Risto and Jokiharju as RHD. Nils is a fantastic player, and could probably surpass Jokiharju and Risto on the depth chart in no time, but you have pieces there. As for center, they have Cozens. Mittelstadt is entering bust territory. Playing 4th line wing at the moment. Not much else there.

If they are moving Eichel, they will want a center coming back that has promise. The real question it would come down to is that do they like Chytil better than Turcotte or someone like Vilardi or does Lundkvist + Chytil supersede the value of Vilardi/Turcott + ???

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Look at the deal that brought ROR to St. Louis:

Berglund, Sobotka, Tage Thompson, a 1st and a 2nd. Berglund and Sobotka were a cap dump to fit ROR, but were also bodies for Buffalo. Thompson was a recent late 1st.

Strome, ADA, Howden, two 1sts

That would be awesome and possible if we ignore the caliber of player being moved out of Buffalo.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Probably more or less depends on what their plans are for their defense. You have Risto and Jokiharju as RHD. Nils is a fantastic player, and could probably surpass Jokiharju and Risto on the depth chart in no time, but you have pieces there. As for center, they have Cozens. Mittelstadt is entering bust territory. Playing 4th line wing at the moment. Not much else there.

If they are moving Eichel, they will want a center coming back that has promise. The real question it would come down to is that do they like Chytil better than Turcotte or someone like Vilardi or does Lundkvist + Chytil supersede the value of Vilardi/Turcott + ???

they have Cozens and 2 top 10 picks this year to get more centers

 

[LOFIN]

Probably more or less depends on what their plans are for their defense. You have Risto and Jokiharju as RHD. Nils is a fantastic player, and could probably surpass Jokiharju and Risto on the depth chart in no time, but you have pieces there. As for center, they have Cozens. Mittelstadt is entering bust territory. Playing 4th line wing at the moment. Not much else there.

Ristolainen is as good as gone. My guess is they trade him before Eichel.

 

[itsPLkielbasa]

I'm not moving Lundkvist for Eichel in a package. He has all the tools in the world and will be cost controlled.

Yes, we need a 1C but I'm in no rush to move our best defensive prospect.

I'm also in no hurry to gut our farm to land Eichel. Our team is young and still growing.

Strome, Kravtsov, Georgiev (since they need a goalie), one of Robertson or Schneider and a 1st. I still think that's highway robbery for the Sabres.