Speculation: Roster Building Thread II (2022-23): The Puck is Prepared to be Mounted

[McRanger92]

Kreider is simply not a captain. He is very clearly socially awkward. He is such a fake leader, and I don't mean to be "that guy" but if you have played somewhat of a high level you understand what I am talking about. Just does shit to appease the coaches.

But when push comes to shove Kreider isn't blocking a shot to his face to win the Stanley Cup. Trouba would

I dont disagree that Kreider wasnt the best fit as captain either, but the rest of this post is garbage.

Kreider has the 2nd most goals in league history in playoff elimination games (behind Messier). He has been coming up big for the Rangers in the playoffs since his first day in the NHL . Also 7-1 all time in Game 7s in his career (2nd most wins of any player in NHL history). To say hes not a leader or wouldnt do what it takes to win a Cup is bullshit.

I appreciated Trouba's intangibles during last years run, but you're kidding yourself if you think they weren't winning in-spite of his on-ice play. He had at least 1 turnover that led to shorthanded goal in every series, including 1 that gave PIT the lead in Game 7. And he's such a good leader that the Rangers have already had 4 games of 2 goal leads blown and 3 player's only meetings through 25 games of his captaincy. He's really crushing it!

 

[RangerBoy]

K’Andre Miller and Alexis Lafrenière, Rangers​

• Evolving-Hockey’s last contract projection for Miller from before the 2022-23 season: six years, $4.943 million AAV
• Miller 2022-23 stats: zero goals, eight points, minus-5 and 21:55 ATOI in 24 games
• Evolving-Hockey’s last contract projection for Lafrenière from before the 2022-23 season: two years, $2.370 million AAV
• Lafrenière’s 2022-23 stats: three goals, 10 points, even rating and 15:41 ATOI in 24 games

My understanding is that the Rangers brass did throw around some numbers with camps for both players in August and September, but ultimately it sounds like each player’s camp wanted to wait. And that probably makes sense for two youngsters who need to build up their numbers this season — show they can deliver — to gain leverage for the offseason.

Miller is second in Rangers ice time this season, behind only Adam Fox, and is playing well overall, continuing to develop nicely as a reliable top-four presence. But I’m sure he and his agent, Ian Pulver, are hoping for a few more points, and without any real power-play time, that’s not easy to achieve.

Lafrenière had a strong second half in 2021-22, but so far this season the offensive numbers have yet to pile up. We’re still waiting for that big, consistent offensive jump from the first pick in the 2020 NHL Draft. A bridge deal makes the most sense here for Lafrenière. He should bet on himself. It’ll come.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Kreider is simply not a captain. He is very clearly socially awkward. He is such a fake leader, and I don't mean to be "that guy" but if you have played somewhat of a high level you understand what I am talking about. Just does shit to appease the coaches.

But when push comes to shove Kreider isn't blocking a shot to his face to win the Stanley Cup. Trouba would

Trouba is way more socially awkward than Kreider lol, Trouba is barely capable of stringing together a sentence in an interview. And I think he’d do that because he’s dumb not because he has balls lol

 

[Peltz]

I dont disagree that Kreider wasnt the best fit as captain either, but the rest of this post is garbage.

Kreider has the 2nd most goals in league history in playoff elimination games (behind Messier). He has been coming up big for the Rangers in the playoffs since his first day in the NHL . Also 7-1 all time in Game 7s in his career (2nd most wins of any player in NHL history). To say hes not a leader or wouldnt do what it takes to win a Cup is bullshit.

I appreciated Trouba's intangibles during last years run, but you're kidding yourself if you think they weren't winning in-spite of his on-ice play. He had at least 1 turnover that led to shorthanded goal in every series, including 1 that gave PIT the lead in Game 7. And he's such a good leader that the Rangers have already had 4 games of 2 goal leads blown and 3 player's only meetings through 25 games of his captaincy. He's really crushing it!

Personally, I too was shocked Kreider wasn’t named captain. I think he was a logical choice.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Personally, I too was shocked Kreider wasn’t named captain. I think he was a logical choice.

I think Ck doesn’t actually want it. Same with Mika.

 

[McRanger92]

Personally, I too was shocked Kreider wasn’t named captain. I think he was a logical choice.

I always got the sense he didnt want it. He was an obvious choice when he signed that extension in the middle of the rebuild and when it never happened I just assumed that was the case. Empowering a homegrown Captain (with Mika & Fast as A's) could've mitigated some of the locker room problems that plagued Quinn's final year. Oh well.

 

[MrAlmost]

Tell you what, if you’re not listening to Staple and Vally’s podcast you’re really missing something. Vally’s stats and takes are invaluable in trying to understand this team.

I like the segment most about Vesey. I think he is good one that line and this team should really consider a 2 year deal that they could probably get him for very cheap. 2y@925K? Sign me up.

 

[bigdog16]

I dont disagree that Kreider wasnt the best fit as captain either, but the rest of this post is garbage.

Kreider has the 2nd most goals in league history in playoff elimination games (behind Messier). He has been coming up big for the Rangers in the playoffs since his first day in the NHL . Also 7-1 all time in Game 7s in his career (2nd most wins of any player in NHL history). To say hes not a leader or wouldnt do what it takes to win a Cup is bullshit.

I appreciated Trouba's intangibles during last years run, but you're kidding yourself if you think they weren't winning in-spite of his on-ice play. He had at least 1 turnover that led to shorthanded goal in every series, including 1 that gave PIT the lead in Game 7. And he's such a good leader that the Rangers have already had 4 games of 2 goal leads blown and 3 player's only meetings through 25 games of his captaincy. He's really crushing it!

I would be interested to see this list. Its quite a cherrypicked stat and I would like to see how many gp he has compared to others

Trouba is way more socially awkward than Kreider lol, Trouba is barely capable of stringing together a sentence in an interview. And I think he’d do that because he’s dumb not because he has balls lol

Trouba would go grab beers with the guys. Kreider would rather stay home and read a book. Nothing against it, but these two are not the same.

 

[Bruner4329]

Kreider is simply not a captain. He is very clearly socially awkward. He is such a fake leader, and I don't mean to be "that guy" but if you have played somewhat of a high level you understand what I am talking about. Just does shit to appease the coaches.

But when push comes to shove Kreider isn't blocking a shot to his face to win the Stanley Cup. Trouba would

Clearly you are clueless. All you need to do is watch the interaction on the ice between the players and CK to know he is well respected. Watch the end of the game next time they win and the interfaces he has with everyone going off the ice. That is not fake... it is real.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Clearly you are clueless. All you need to do is watch the interaction on the ice between the players and CK to know he is well respected. Watch the end of the game next time they win and the interfaces he has with everyone going off the ice. That is not fake... it is real.

I think there’s a big difference between respect and leading.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Personally, I too was shocked Kreider wasn’t named captain. I think he was a logical choice.

At first I kind of rationalized it with it must be what the room wanted, but the more it's gone on seeing Trouba as captain the more it has bugged me that Kreider isn't the captain.

The captain should've either been Fox or Kreider. If they wanted to wait on Fox then it 100% should've been Kreider. The more I think about it the more it feels like the front office, coach and team all galaxy brained themselves out of what would've been the easiest layup to be made in choosing Kreider to be captain.

 

[IDvsEGO]

At first I kind of rationalized it with it must be what the room wanted, but the more it's gone on seeing Trouba as captain the more it has bugged me that Kreider isn't the captain.

The captain should've either been Fox or Kreider. If they wanted to wait on Fox then it 100% should've been Kreider.

I think that they want specific traits for the captain, and leading by example is a big one.
Trouba is physical and I think that’s one of the things gallant wants in a captain.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

I think that they want specific traits for the captain, and leading by example is a big one.
Trouba is physical and I think that’s one of the things gallant wants in a captain.

Kreider was coming off a 52 goal season, he's the longest tenured Ranger by far, he's been wearing an A for years at this point. He's also a very physical player who plays a solid grind game and will drop the gloves if he has to. He's been the only player to face the media and represent the team after every single game since Hank retired and even then he was the skater doing it along with Hank back then too.

I really don't see how leading by example wouldn't go in the Kreider column over Trouba. Why would Trouba get that nod, because he makes some good open ice hits and fights a couple times a year?

Not arguing with you here, just trying to understand what Gallant and Drury were thinking really.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Kreider was coming off a 52 goal season, he's the longest tenured Ranger by far, he's been wearing an A for years at this point. He's also a very physical player who plays a solid grind game and will drop the gloves if he has to. He's been the only player to face the media and represent the team after every single game since Hank retired and even then he was the skater doing it along with Hank back then too.

I really don't see how leading by example wouldn't go in the Kreider column over Trouba. Why would Trouba get that nod, because he makes some good open ice hits and fights a couple times a year?

Not arguing with you here, just trying to understand what Gallant and Drury were thinking really.

I was arguing about not fox there.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Captaincy means jack shite. There enough vets in the room that the C is irrelevant outside of doing more interviews

 

[JohnC]

Kreider clearly has never wanted the captaincy.

I think Trouba definitely has the makings of a captain, people are just pissy because he’s had a shit year while playing injured and the team’s been mediocre.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

15. New York Rangers​

Last Week: 13
Record: 11-9-4
Dom rank: 14
Sean rank: 16

Wish List: To go back to “fake” winning instead of “Deserve To Win-O-Meter” winning.

I’m guessing life was a lot cooler last year when the Rangers were disrespectfully ranked 15th in the Power Rankings while actually winning games regularly. That’s way better than being 15th because we believe in them more than their record indicates. Who cares about that – you know what’s better than expected goals? Real goals. Can’t spell “underlying numbers” without “lying.”

NHL Power Rankings: Maple Leafs make their jump

We’re kicking off the holiday season by offering up one item on every NHL team’s wish list.

theathletic.com

Of course he has a point, but now I want to Rangers to start playing well the rest of the way just to shove it down Dom's throat.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

I was arguing about not fox there.

Oh gotcha.

 

[Fitzy]

Captaincy means jack shite. There enough vets in the room that the C is irrelevant outside of doing more interviews

If you listen to the guys on the Boston Bruins talk about Bergeron...

The captain doesn't always matter but sometimes there are true leaders.

 

[bigdog16]

Clearly you are clueless. All you need to do is watch the interaction on the ice between the players and CK to know he is well respected. Watch the end of the game next time they win and the interfaces he has with everyone going off the ice. That is not fake... it is real.

This is exactly what I mean by doing stuff to appease coaches, its so fake and if you fall for it you are a fool

 

[Shesterkybomb]

If you listen to the guys on the Boston Bruins talk about Bergeron...

The captain doesn't always matter but sometimes there are true leaders.

Its the group of them, Marchand included, Chara, Shawn Thorton as well before that play hard and players follow their lead. We honestly don't have that guy outside of maybe Lindgren but he's gonna wear out soon. People complained about Richards but he was a leader, St.Louis too, McDonagh , maybe even Girardi as well, i dont see those types here, putting a C on someone doesn't make them a leader i think thats the problem here. I think Trochek was added for that effect, he's hitting everything that moves but nobody is following the lead....maybe Laf and him can do some damage together.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Reading the last couple of pages it's kind of interesting because you have the group that doesn't want bread to go anywhere, the group that doesn't want CK to go anywhere and the group that doesn't want laffy to go anywhere. And every one of these groups overlaps and intersects with each other. So I guess my question is if you don't want any of these guys to go anywhere then how in the world is that supposed to work? Now somebody that says to just put CK down on the third line and make him your net front guy on the power play as a solution leaves me wondering how in the world you can have 18 million of cap tied up into two left wingers AND also have your 1oa pick remain here who you hopefully will eventually give a prominent role to while he thrives in it and also need to be compensated? Regardless of the money, who is going to take a back seat to allow laffy to evolve? And it can't just be at 5v5 because even the most patient person in the room that wants to say that he can improve his game substantially over time just via even strength has to realize that at some point that power play ice time needs to transfer over. I just don't understand how people think that it's going to work even two more years with the way the left side is right now. Not to mention otter is also on his way, or is he going to get put on the right wing now as well?

This is a problem. Can’t contractually move Panarin and can’t move Kreider for now. Alexis Lafrenier isn’t producing so that makes it difficult to get fair value or an overpayment from teams like Ottawa or Montreal.
This has to be up there with one of the most mishandled builds in sports history. I. A perfect scenario for Ranger fans, Panarin is never signed a Kreider went to Dallas for Robertson and the first. At least then the team would be building for something and not treading water.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Kreider knocking the stick of Kravtsov down after a preseason win during the crowd salute is telling.
Should never had been done publicly.
Any issues with teammates should be dealt with behind closed doors.

 

[xsniper11x]

This is a problem. Can’t contractually move Panarin and can’t move Kreider for now. Alexis Lafrenier isn’t producing so that makes it difficult to get fair value or an overpayment from teams like Ottawa or Montreal.
This has to be up there with one of the most mishandled builds in sports history. I. A perfect scenario for Ranger fans, Panarin is never signed a Kreider went to Dallas for Robertson and the first. At least then the team would be building for something and not treading water.

I can’t fault Gorton here as nobody had a 1OA LW on their radar when the letter went out. We were bare at LW w/ nothing in the pipeline. Now that we’re here, we have to do what’s best for the future of the team. Kreider has a NMC that expires in a few years. You could force his hand earlier, but for the price tag, I prefer we do that with Panarin instead. He lacks speed, chemistry with anyone but Strome, and commands a prime PP spot.

If he doesn’t like a reduced role and TOI, then he can ask out. We could use that money on 3-4 players with real speed, which would be a god send for a team with three young playmakers (Laf, KK, Fox) that all lack foot speed. Despite his lack of skills, we all remember how effective Hagelin was. For us, the Pens, the Caps. We need more of these types and asap.

 

[haohmaru]

I really don't see how leading by example wouldn't go in the Kreider column over Trouba. Why would Trouba get that nod, because he makes some good open ice hits and fights a couple times a year?

Not arguing with you here, just trying to understand what Gallant and Drury were thinking really.

I honestly think it's less about Gallant and Drury and more about what the people in the room thought. Many have pointed to Trouba as the guy including Kreider:

‘'if you ask the guys in the locker room, 100% of them will tell you that he's been our captain without actually wearing the "c" for the last couple of years. i'm incredibly happy for him to have this honor and to represent this team because of everything be does for us. he has broad shoulders and no matter the situation and context. he's himself as a person and how he leads. there's no ego to him off the ice or on the ice, and he represents the game, his teammates, and his opponents.''