Speculation: Roster Building Thread II (2022-23): The Puck is Prepared to be Mounted

[Machinehead]

They have more open space than just panarins cap hit.

With our him, they’re at around 27 million IIRC.

You're confused.

The cap is 27 million.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Draisitl is not a good skater. Nor is Panarin for that matter. Pavelski and Robertson do just fine in Dallas. Kucherov. Ovechkin lost all his steps before he won his cup. Neither of the Tkachuk brothers are good skaters. Mark Stone. Tavares. Elias Petterson. Eberle. Huberdeau. Pasternak.

I don't know if all of these guys are "below average" but certainly none of them are better skaters than Lafreniere.

Panarin is a WAY better skater than Lafreniere

 

[duhmetreE]

Laffy Chytil Kakko
Panarin Zibs Kravtsov
Kreider Trocheck Vesey
Cuylle Goodrow Gauthier

Bump Goodrow up for Kravtsov late game, since Gallant doesn't trust Kravtsov.
Use the kids as the defacto #1 line. IN ALL SCENARIOS

 

[bhamill]

Panarin is a WAY better skater than Lafreniere

“WAY”? Not so sure. He is better but they are in the same tier. “Good”, not very good nor great, but good.

 

[LOFIN]

You guys are missing the whole point of that discussion between Vince and Marek. It's not about whether or not skating is an issue for Lafreniere. Even if it is, does that warrant the organization wanting him to change his entire style of play, because they don't think he can
A: play to his strengths with his current skating
B: reach that level in the future
This goes right back to the whole issue with our forward development. We think the guys don't have the confidence to hold on to the puck and make plays. Well no f***ING SHIT if the organization tells them to "look for tips and crash the net" instead of doing what they have done so far in their entire career.

 

[bhamill]

You guys are missing the whole point of that discussion between Vince and Marek. It's not about whether or not skating is an issue for Lafreniere. Even if it is, does that warrant the organization wanting him to change his entire style of play, because they don't think he can
A: play to his strengths with his current skating
B: reach that level in the future
This goes right back to the whole issue with our forward development. We think the guys don't have the confidence to hold on to the puck and make plays. Well no f***ING SHIT if the organization tells them to "look for tips and crash the net" instead of doing what they have done so far in their entire career.

I think those two saying NYR are trying to change Laf‘s style of play Is pure conjecture and click bait. This whole thing is moot unless you buy into their “theory,” which I don’t.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

I for one, still cannot fathom how this team is willing to give out clauses like that just like it's candy on Halloween.

This is the New York Rangers. I'm pretty sure there's a line of players who dream playing here. Being here should be a privilege, not a right. If it was up to me, no member of this team has any clauses. Top to bottom. I'm pretty sure there will still be plenty of players interested in playing here.

And it should not be too hard of a thing for the organization to implement. Maybe it makes some players wary for a short while. Then it becomes status quo, and people will accept it, and the organization will have a brighter future.

And I'm not even calling for a guy like Panarin, Kreider, Zibanejad, hell even Captain Cone to be traded. But why the f*** does a 2nd line center Trocheck (actually more like a 3rd line C), and a 3rd line winger Goodrow (more like 4th liner) have NMC and M-NTC on their contracts? Like I said, I don't think anyone on this roster should be unmovable. But I can somewhat live with our supposed top players being unmovable. But these fillers, who are not part of the core? Why?

See, I have no broad knowledge of all teams and the contract they hand out, but by God aren't we the NMC Santa Clause mofos, right? Like every single older FA - be it RFA or UFA - we gave him that shit.

Like, we waste f***ing cap space on not the right players! Is there anyone, that would have lengthened the rebuild, as in NOT SIGN BREAD. And wait for Draisaitl or someone like that, or Matthews. I think there is a proper chance both don't resign, with the headcase franchises they're with now.

Regardless, I also feel we hand that shit out like candy and I want a reason as to why. Grotans no rookie GM, Drury rookie, both handed them out. Idk, imo taxes or some financial shit really. Other option is really that the FO just gets pushed over? Neither good.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Panarin is a WAY better skater than Lafreniere

At this point Panarin could literally score on his own goal and you’d find a way to defend him.

 

[mike14]

See, I have no broad knowledge of all teams and the contract they hand out, but by God aren't we the NMC Santa Clause mofos, right? Like every single older FA - be it RFA or UFA - we gave him that shit.

Like, we waste f***ing cap space on not the right players! Is there anyone, that would have lengthened the rebuild, as in NOT SIGN BREAD. And wait for Draisaitl or someone like that, or Matthews. I think there is a proper chance both don't resign, with the headcase franchises they're with now.

Regardless, I also feel we hand that shit out like candy and I want a reason as to why. Grotans no rookie GM, Drury rookie, both handed them out. Idk, imo taxes or some financial shit really. Other option is really that the FO just gets pushed over? Neither good.

NYR = 7 contracts with clauses

ANA = 7
CAL = 8
EDM = 7
LA = 4
SJS = 7
SEA = 12
VAN = 4
LVK = 9
ARA = 1
CHI = 6
COL = 4
DAL = 7
MIN = 6
NSH = 3
STL = 9
WPG = 7

In our division:
CAR = 8
CBJ = 5
NJ = 2 (will be interesting to see how this looks after this off season as they have lots of expiring contracts)
NYI = 7
PHI = 3
PIT = 10
WAS = 7

I can certainly get behind the argument that there's too many contracts with clauses handed out around the league, but we really aren't an outlier

 

[Off Sides]

Signing Harpur at that cap hit doesn't mean they can't find another good defenseman somewhere. If anything, I would think having a steady, low cost guy around may make it EASIER to slowly bring along a younger LD. If a young player can't beat our Harpur for time then they shouldn't' be playing in the NHL and his cap hit makes him an attractive #7 for the next couple of seasons.

When have the Rangers, other than someone who has not already been in the NHL, recently, like past ten years, found a good defensemen somewhere?

It's not about Harpur and his contract, as a #8 or whatever he is fine. It's more they suck at importing already in the NHL defenders, and are pretty good at getting them before they reach the NHL whether through draft or trade. Luck or skill, who cares, they do that well for some reason.

Jones is going to be a good NHLer. He is not big enough for them, fine, yet every defender they bring in stinks at moving the puck for them, and that includes players like Yandle, Shattenkirk, Smith. The grass is always greener when they make those types of moves as they could have just gone with the in house option and been better off.

 

[EdJovanovski]

At this point Panarin could literally score on his own goal and you’d find a way to defend him.

He could have more points than both Kakko & Laf combined and you'd still find a way to think he's the problem lol

 

[TominNC]

It's so pointless to have all these proposed threads including Panarin, Trouba or Kreider. They're going nowhere with their salaries and NMC. If they did waive it MIGHT be to a select couple of teams, not who the video game players want them to go for.

Also, when teams know you're at the player's mercy, they don't give you as much. So yeah these proposed deals are a waste of space.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

He could have more points than both Kakko & Laf combined and you'd still find a way to think he's the problem lol

He is a major part of the problem.

No one should care that he can fatten up his stats against bad teams. I’m pretty sure that his ES production against playoff competition is either equal or worse than those 2 and they’ve had their struggles with performance and/or luck this year.

Not what you want out of the second highest paid player in the league.

 

[GAGLine]

Goodrow has value. There's less than zero reason to buy him out.

Goodrow‘s hit is “only” 3.6 million and he is tradeable to 16 teams. Why on earth would we buy him out and have part of his cap hit still on the books? At worst you trade him for “future considerations.” His whole cap is gone that way. And we could likely get something for him. He is still a valuable player, even if people here don’t appreciate him.

Which teams have cap space? Which teams are taking him for 4 more years?

If the cap were normal, yeah, odds are pretty good that we could move Goodrow and get something decent back. But cap space is tight all over and lots of teams are going to be trying to move money.

If we need the cap space, Drury will try to trade him. But if the cost ends up being prohibitive, he'll be bought out. It's not a coincidence that the contract was structured such that we get a cap credit the next 2 seasons if we buy him out.

 

[egelband]

Sign Miller for as many years as you can.

But from Millers camp it would be dumb to go anymore than 2 or 3 given his talent unless the Rangers AAV is much higher than expected.

Rangers probably offer 5mx5.
Miller counters 5mx3
Compromise at 5mx4. Maybe 4.5m.
Something like that.

 

[EdJovanovski]

He is a major part of the problem.

No one should care that he can fatten up his stats against bad teams. I’m pretty sure that his ES production against playoff competition is either equal or worse than those 2 and they’ve had their struggles with performance and/or luck this year.

Not what you want out of the second highest paid player in the league.

Players of his caliber never hit free agency, if McDavid were to be a UFA he would get way more. And given how Drury spends money I don't think most of us would trust him to spend 11 mill better than on Panarin who just had his career year in points last season where he was apparently horrible, and got like the most assists of any Rangers forward in franchise history, and top 10 points ever. Buch was largely a cap casualty and making room for the kids. He signed for 5.8M in STL which I'm sure he would've signed for a bit less to stay on the Rangers, the guy was commenting crying emoji's in the Rangers livestream on IG of our home opener when he was a Blue. In warmups his first game back at MSG he stood at his blue line and held his stick out to pass a puck to Mika. His HockeyFightsCancer he did as Blue was that he fights for the Rangers equipment manager. He's a really emotional guy and was devastated by the trade, I'm sure we could've got him for like 5 mill.

Then we went and spent that on what? 3Y 2.5M AAV on Nemeth, 6Y 3.6M AAV on Goodrow, 1Y 1.5M AAV on Blais, 2Y 1.75M AAV on Reaves, 2Y 900K on Tinordi. That's nearly 10.5M on bums. It's getting to the point where it looks like I was right and we can add Trocheck and his 7Y 5.6M AAV deal to the list.

If we gave you 16 million in cap space is that what you'd spend it on?

We're going to be kicking ourselves for that Trocheck deal this summer when we enter negotiations with Chytil. He's on pace for 57pts not playing top 6 mins nor PP. He's absolutely ready for 2C responsibilities and he might even feel slighted by us and that we're hurting him financially keeping him buried like that.

 

[Vitto79]

Same. He is one guy I would have kept. Good player overpaid but he always been a team player.

If they just signed Smith and not Nemeth they would have a few 2nd rounders still

 

[kovazub94]

Which teams have cap space? Which teams are taking him for 4 more years?

If the cap were normal, yeah, odds are pretty good that we could move Goodrow and get something decent back. But cap space is tight all over and lots of teams are going to be trying to move money.

If we need the cap space, Drury will try to trade him. But if the cost ends up being prohibitive, he'll be bought out. It's not a coincidence that the contract was structured such that we get a cap credit the next 2 seasons if we buy him out.

Goodrow’s contract was structured this way for the worst case scenario. As it stands right now even in the East only I could see up-and-coming teams like NJD, DRW, Sabres or Senators being interested in what Goodrow brings - the same reasons why the Rangers signed him in the first place. And if the push came to shove why the Rangers could not try to retain a little (like under $1m) and try to move Goodrow for only $2.6-$2.9 credit vs credit from buyout (without the extended detriment of recapturing and losing on the trade return)? The cap issues will start ease up after the next season if not sooner.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Players of his caliber never hit free agency, if McDavid were to be a UFA he would get way more. And given how Drury spends money I don't think most of us would trust him to spend 11 mill better than on Panarin who just had his career year in points last season where he was apparently horrible, and got like the most assists of any Rangers forward in franchise history, and top 10 points ever. Buch was largely a cap casualty and making room for the kids. He signed for 5.8M in STL which I'm sure he would've signed for a bit less to stay on the Rangers, the guy was commenting crying emoji's in the Rangers livestream on IG of our home opener when he was a Blue. In warmups his first game back at MSG he stood at his blue line and held his stick out to pass a puck to Mika. His HockeyFightsCancer he did as Blue was that he fights for the Rangers equipment manager. He's a really emotional guy and was devastated by the trade, I'm sure we could've got him for like 5 mill.

Then we went and spent that on what? 3Y 2.5M AAV on Nemeth, 6Y 3.6M AAV on Goodrow, 1Y 1.5M AAV on Blais, 2Y 1.75M AAV on Reaves, 2Y 900K on Tinordi. That's nearly 10.5M on bums. It's getting to the point where it looks like I was right and we can add Trocheck and his 7Y 5.6M AAV deal to the list.

If we gave you 16 million in cap space is that what you'd spend it on?

We're going to be kicking ourselves for that Trocheck deal this summer when we enter negotiations with Chytil. He's on pace for 57pts not playing top 6 mins nor PP. He's absolutely ready for 2C responsibilities and he might even feel slighted by us and that we're hurting him financially keeping him buried like that.

We've seen Tavares, Panarin and Gaudreau hit UFA in the last few years so this isn't even remotely true. If I had to guess we'll likely see Matthews hit it too after next year. No shit McDavid would get paid more if he were to be a UFA, hes the best player on the planet. And LOL at being right on Trocheck. He's been fine. He's played most of the season with a toxic ass LW who can't apparently play with anyone despite making more money than every player in the league other than McDavid.

Also Reaves is a bum now in your eyes? Weren't you crying when they traded him? Also Tinordi's hit was able to be completely buried so he was (and still is) completely irrelevant.

I won't really disagree with the others but what does that have to do with his on ice performance? You keep bringing up points like I care, I don't. I already know he can rack up multi point games in his sleep against the likes of Philly and Chicago. Hes sucked against good teams and out side of 2 big games (one of which was that one game in Minnesota when they couldn't keep the puck out of their net against anyone) he has 8 points in 20 games against playoff competition.

That number drops to 6 if we only include points at ES.

He's sucked this year after a very good October. I'd go as far as to say that hes been worse THIS year than he was last year and thats a problem.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Goodrow‘s hit is “only” 3.6 million and he is tradeable to 16 teams. Why on earth would we buy him out and have part of his cap hit still on the books? At worst you trade him for “future considerations.” His whole cap is gone that way. And we could likely get something for him. He is still a valuable player, even if people here don’t appreciate him.

He has a 200k cap credit the first two years of the buyout, meaning the Rangers actually gain cap space. yes there's a hit later on but the cap should be quite a bit higher by then. I don't think it will be that easy to trade him but maybe I am wrong.

 

[Alluckks]

Chris Drury signed a huge contract with the Rangers. His play was straight ass near the end, he knew it, the fans knew, and then management knew it.
Drury got bought out for the final year of his contract. He retired that next August. He knew he was cooked. He could have just retired without forcing the Rangers to buy him out.
Drury didn't take it personally, and neither did the Rangers. He happily came back here afterwards when the Rangers organization invited him.

Drury knows the business. He won't think any of these players would be slighted by a buyout or trade.

Panarin has a full NMC. Trouba only has a full NMC remaining for this year and next year, final 2 years are 15 team and 12 team no trade lists. Kreider also safe for this year and next year, he also goes to a 15 team no trade list, but for the final 3 years of his contract.

Frankly, the 3 obvious contracts for a shake up won't be moved until after next season, unless they also believe it is best for them to move on.

 

[RangersFan1994]

If Drury was told he was next in line for the GM (and Team President) job in NY if he stuck it out here, and learned the organization, then YES, I absolutely think he stays for 3ish years while not being the driving force behind the decisions the current team President and GM are making. Not everyone jumps at the latest shiny thing, some people have long game plans.


Wait. Emo teens are very emotional… is Tkachuk TOO emo?

Mika sounds like he’s about to cry in every interview. Tkachuk has the better type of emotion with bite and some attitude. Mika has that soft emotion like he’s nervous about losing his virginity.

 

[RGY]

Mika sounds like he’s about to cry in every interview. Tkachuk has the better type of emotion with bite and some attitude. Mika has that soft emotion like he’s nervous about losing his virginity.

What did I just read… now were criticizing Mika, arguably our best forward? In fact, its not really an argument, he is our best forward by a long shot. Even one of the best in the league, especially considering how he plays an all around game.

 

[IDvsEGO]

When have the Rangers, other than someone who has not already been in the NHL, recently, like past ten years, found a good defensemen somewhere?

Your question is so limiting its terrible?
The rangers 6 defensemen have been acquired as such
Trade/Trade
Draft/Trade
uFA/Draft

Identifying talented non NHL players is HARDER, i'll say it again, HARDER, than identifying a talented nhl player.
With a non nhl player, such as miller, fox, lindgren, you have to actually make guesses about progression, comparisions based on their competition and assumptions about development, plus identify if they can fit the structure you're playing or looking to play.

The defensemen we have an issue with on the rangers, nemeth, harpur etc. Are all bottom pair guys. Very few teams have perfect pairs up and down the lineup.
We've got a very solid top 4 (if trouba can get healthy) and a very solid right side on the third pair. Typically when you have a solid 3rd pair, or 5/6, its because theyre blocked in the lineup not because a UFA wants to play 12-14 minutes a night.

Chris Drury signed a huge contract with the Rangers. His play was straight ass near the end, he knew it, the fans knew, and then management knew it.
Drury got bought out for the final year of his contract. He retired that next August. He knew he was cooked. He could have just retired without forcing the Rangers to buy him out.
Drury didn't take it personally, and neither did the Rangers. He happily came back here afterwards when the Rangers organization invited him.

Drury knows the business. He won't think any of these players would be slighted by a buyout or trade.

Panarin has a full NMC. Trouba only has a full NMC remaining for this year and next year, final 2 years are 15 team and 12 team no trade lists. Kreider also safe for this year and next year, he also goes to a 15 team no trade list, but for the final 3 years of his contract.

Frankly, the 3 obvious contracts for a shake up won't be moved until after next season, unless they also believe it is best for them to move on.

top 3 for me to move.
CK is first.
Goodrow
Trocheck

Trouba likely doesn't move because he's the captain.

 

[Off Sides]

Your question is so limiting its terrible?
The rangers 6 defensemen have been acquired as such
Trade/Trade
Draft/Trade
uFA/Draft

Identifying talented non NHL players is HARDER, i'll say it again, HARDER, than identifying a talented nhl player.
With a non nhl player, such as miller, fox, lindgren, you have to actually make guesses about progression, comparisions based on their competition and assumptions about development, plus identify if they can fit the structure you're playing or looking to play.

The defensemen we have an issue with on the rangers, nemeth, harpur etc. Are all bottom pair guys. Very few teams have perfect pairs up and down the lineup.
We've got a very solid top 4 (if trouba can get healthy) and a very solid right side on the third pair. Typically when you have a solid 3rd pair, or 5/6, its because theyre blocked in the lineup not because a UFA wants to play 12-14 minutes a night.

Rangers can't find already in the NHL defender mostly because good teams do not trade, or let good defenders leave by free agency.

Rangers seems to believe those who do leave or are available are good.

None of Shattenkirk, Smith, Yandle were treated as bottom pair, they should have been seen as such before they were imported.

More than anything, what the Rangers are doing by not playing Jones, they are asking, to within a year or two,. import a puck moving defender when they already could be developing one. Instead we'll see Hartpur, Hajek, whatever, and then they'll pay the premium for whoever they think it a puck moving defender in a year or two.