Speculation: RNH for Dumba trade?

[THall4]

What has to be added to Dumba for Drai, Edmonton fans? Ridiculous overpayment?

Yes, esp after the Hall deal..

 

[57special]

Earlier you were talking about how some people overrate Dumba, and others completely dismiss him as if you were somewhere in the middle, but with ideas like Granlund+Dumba+ for Draisaitl I don't see how you don't fall into the "completely dismiss him" category.

Dumba is a former 7th OA pick who, at age 21, just finished tied for 19th among defensemen in goals scored with guys like Klingberg, Hedman and Lindholm, and ahead of guys like Keith, Ristolainen, Rielly, and our own Suter, who all got much more TOI (and PP TOI) than Dumba.

In fact, just go the the stats page on the NHL website, filter it so you're only looking at defensemen, and sort by goals, then sort by points. Look at Dumba's TOI, then look at all the players around him. Most of them get 3+ minutes more per game than Dumba.

Because I don't rate Dmen by how many goals they've scored.

 

[Wabit]

Still think Spurgeon/RNH 1 for 1 is the best deal for both teams. Cap and term are about the same.

Dumba just joins the mass of 3rd liner Oilers already have, Brodin = Larsson, Scandella = Sekera.

Since Spurgeon has had his 5 years NHL time, he's not going to get much better than 30 points.

There is snark and sarcasm here.

 

[Spurgeon]

Still think Spurgeon/RNH 1 for 1 is the best deal for both teams. Cap and term are about the same.

Dumba just joins the mass of 3rd liner Oilers already have, Brodin = Larsson, Scandella = Sekera.

Since Spurgeon has had his 5 years NHL time, he's not going to get much better than 30 points.

There is snark and sarcasm here.

Spurgeons too important to lose. The team always struggles when he's out of the lineup. Russo's mentioned it's never happening multiple times too.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Something similar to Brodin, who's been a sub-20 point defenseman, all of a sudden scoring 30 (50%+ point increase), or RNH, who's been about a 55 point C, suddenly becoming a 65 point C or higher (18% increase).

So I guess a points increase to some extent, but also a change in their perceived role that they can fill.

i.e. Brodin is seen as a 3-4 defenseman right now because of his lack of offense, but perhaps an increase in points to 30 would make people believe he'd be a #2 at that point.

i.e. RNH is a 55 point C, which is a low end 1C, more fit for splitting duties with another low end 1C or playing 2C than being that go to 1C, but if he increased his scoring to 25 goals and 65 points, he'd be perceived as a legitimate 1C.

Stralman is my only quick twitch example.

 

[Wabit]

Spurgeons too important to lose. The team always struggles when he's out of the lineup. Russo's mentioned it's never happening multiple times too.

I just don't like Spurgeon, and hate his commercials. Never seeing him in another one is enough for me to see him go.

 

[Spurgeon]

I just don't like Spurgeon, and hate his commercials. Never seeing him in another one is enough for me to see him go.

Solid reasoning

 

[rockinghockey]

Chia already stated he is not interested in Dumba

 

[rynryn]

Chia already stated he is not interested in Dumba

Where and when? I don't disbelieve you. Just interested in soaking up as much of this trade chaos as possible.

 

[bernmeister]

Why would the Wild do that? Rather just keep Dumba or add a bit more to get the RNH deal done.

Yes, but the same problem, but even more so(Stepan makes more)exists for the Wild. Dumba will make about 2-2.5M. Stepan makes , what 6.5M?

Wild can't take back 4M+. Other players would have to be added, making it a more complicated deal.

At least EDM can take back some salary, if it comes to that. Rangers can't, so things have to be worked out just so.

yes, what I meant was
value of RNH-Stepan is close, so no need to overpay for similar production
yeah, Step is a bit more now, but RNH's next contract is likely to bump higher also

also, did not mean to imply Dumba-Stepan a 1 for 1.
Meant something around these 2 principals

 

[Golden Gophers 4649]

Spurgeons too important to lose. The team always struggles when he's out of the lineup. Russo's mentioned it's never happening multiple times too.

You're correct on his podcast earlier this week Russo said he asked Fletcher if Spurgeon was discussed and the reaction was "never". Now that should tell you yes he could be moved but if they are second guessing moving Dumba for RNH then Edmonton would have to know their socks off with an offer for Spurgeon and 1 on 1 is not getting it done.

 

[Golden Gophers 4649]

Because I don't rate Dmen by how many goals they've scored.

Nor should you. You rate them based upon how well they defend.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Can Dumba QB a PP?

 

[aemoreira1981]

Why not just offer-sheet Matt Dumba? EDM can have its compensation 2nd rounder slide for an offer sheet only. This could really cause problems with next year's cap if Minnesota matches, given that they must still fill 4-5 forward slots (3 roster and 1-2 extra) and a backup goalie in addition to Matt Dumba...and then have Mikael Granlud, Erik Haula, and Nino Niederreiter needing new contracts after next season. If the offer sheet is for $6.5 to $6.75M, that would leave Minnesota with about $4.75 to $5M to fill out the remaining forward slots, and Darcy Kuempfer must be qualified at $1.5M, leaving just $3.25 to $3.5M to fill out the last 4 forward slots. (Edmonton still has $15M in cap space for next season.)

The idea wouldn't be to try to get Dumba---but to force Minnesota into a cap squeeze. Even a lower offer of $6M would cause a squeeze for Minnesota.

 

[Spurgeon]

Can Dumba QB a PP?

I think that's gonna be his specialty in the league, his shot is phenomenal.

You're correct on his podcast earlier this week Russo said he asked Fletcher if Spurgeon was discussed and the reaction was "never". Now that should tell you yes he could be moved but if they are second guessing moving Dumba for RNH then Edmonton would have to know their socks off with an offer for Spurgeon and 1 on 1 is not getting it done.

Yeah I heard it on the podcast, on twitter, and then he mentioned it on KFAN yesterday. Fletcher has always seemed to be very happy with Spurgeon and signing Spurge as a unsigned draft pick has been one of his best moves that he's probably proud of too lol.

 

[AKL]

Because I don't rate Dmen by how many goals they've scored.

Nor should you. You rate them based upon how well they defend.

Like any player, you should rate them on how positively they impact your team. Dumba has the potential to impact the team more positively than Brodin IMO.

 

[rynryn]

Like any player, you should rate them on how positively they impact your team. Dumba has the potential to impact the team more positively than Brodin IMO.

it was probably just a fluke but didn't our PK take a big huge steep nosedive when Brodin was injured?

And please please please for the love of christ keep in mind Larsson was on a fast bus to bustville before Stevens turned his game around.

 

[AKL]

it was probably just a fluke but didn't our PK take a big huge steep nosedive when Brodin was injured?

And please please please for the love of christ keep in mind Larsson was on a fast bus to bustville before Stevens turned his game around.

And he's still not an offensive player. Imagine what Dumba could be if Stevens has the same effect on him.

 

[KarmaPolice]

I think that's gonna be his specialty in the league, his shot is phenomenal.

I see he only averaged about 16-17 minutes a game last season, though. That's a bit worrying. Although he's only 21, so maybe he's just developing and can become a good #3 guy who can QB a PP. He did score 6 PP goals, which isn't bad for a young kid like him. Not sure we'd want to trade RNH for another 'maybe' though. But I can see Chia being interested in both Dumba and Barrie. Wont be surprised if he trades for one of them. Just hope it's not another overpay, as I don't think it's warranted now that we have a decent top pairing in Klefbom-Larsson who BOTH still have a lot of untapped potential, yet were already looking great last season. So yeah, wouldn't mind picking up Dumba, but I hope it's not at the cost of RNH. We'll have a nice D corps, but our centre depth and forward depth in general will be pretty gutted. Not sure it's worth it.

Maybe it'll be a bigger deal, with RNH+ for Dumba and Granlund, and Granlund can help fill the void on the 3rd line C position. Not sure what the 'plus' would have to be with RNH to get it done, though.

 

[rynryn]

And he's still not an offensive player. Imagine what Dumba could be if Stevens has the same effect on him.

obviously. i'm not in favor of trading either for RNH btw.

But the point is Stevens turned Larsson from a big disappointment to someone that got traded for one of the best 5v5 players in the league over the last handful of years. No guarantees but then again there's no guarantee RNH will be anything other than a Granlund level center here...there's probably a better chance of that than Brodin stagnating under Stevens. I don't think it's worth it. Would have done it and added for Hall but obviously Chia was adamant about the handedness of the D he was looking for.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Can Dumba QB a PP?

Probably, but so far he's done more of the triggerman thing.

 

[Spurgeon]

I see he only averaged about 16-17 minutes a game last season, though. That's a bit worrying. Although he's only 21, so maybe he's just developing and can become a good #3 guy who can QB a PP. He did score 6 PP goals, which isn't bad for a young kid like him. Not sure we'd want to trade RNH for another 'maybe' though. But I can see Chia being interested in both Dumba and Barrie. Wont be surprised if he trades for one of them. Just hope it's not another overpay, as I don't think it's warranted now that we have a decent top pairing in Klefbom-Larsson who BOTH still have a lot of untapped potential, yet were already looking great last season. So yeah, wouldn't mind picking up Dumba, but I hope it's not at the cost of RNH. We'll have a nice D corps, but our centre depth and forward depth in general will be pretty gutted. Not sure it's worth it.

Maybe it'll be a bigger deal, with RNH+ for Dumba and Granlund, and Granlund can help fill the void on the 3rd line C position. Not sure what the 'plus' would have to be with RNH to get it done, though.

Burns and Subban are guys that I'd probably compare Dumba to. Obviously he's not at the level of those guys, but I truly believe he has potential to be at or near their level at some point in his career if he reaches that potential.

Obviously I don't know your guys situation as well as you do, but I think you guys would really benefit with someone like Dumba on that defensive core. He'd be perfect as a 2nd pairing RD and 1st PP QB. It's scary to think what'd he be able to do with someone like McDavid. However, a lot of Minnesota fans are very hesitant about moving Dumba because of his potential and because we're not quite sure that RNH is the center we should target (the cap doesn't work that well either). Eventually, Edmonton has to lose a center because you've got 3 future 1st line centers pretty much on your roster, so I could definitely see you being able to deal one of either RNH or Drai. I personally would want Drai if we're moving Dumba (for cap and potential reasons), with an add from us of potentially Zucker/Haula/Granny, which some Wild fans may say is too much, and I'm assuming most Edmonton fans will say is not enough. I just think it makes sense for Edmonton to hold onto RNH as that veteran center (although he's still very young).

Probably, but so far he's done more of the triggerman thing.

I feel like being a triggerman can still be considered a job of being a PP QB, since you're the main force of the PP. Like I'd consider Ovi a PP QB because of the shot from HIS spot. Although, I guess you could say that it's more about someone leading the plays and dishing the puck more than pulling the trigger on the shot.

 

[Wabit]

Can Dumba QB a PP?

I wouldn't want him to. He's really not that good with the puck, 44 giveaways compared with 13 takeaways.

 

[AKL]

I wouldn't want him to. He's really not that good with the puck, 44 giveaways compared with 13 takeaways.

PK Subban: 106 GvA, 23 TkA
Brent Burns: 102-53
Drew Doughty: 97-10
Erik Karlsson: 96-61
John Klingberg: 78-36
Hampus Lindholm: 65-18
Victor Hedman: 62-48
Rookie Sensation Shayne Gostisbehere: 51-28
Rasmus Ristolainen: 48-20
Duncan Keith: 46-22
Roman Josi: 43-21
Ryan Suter: 41-36
Aaron Ekblad: 41-24

Does that help clarify how little that stat means?

 

[Spurgeon]

Never use giveaways and takeaways, they're so bad at recording that ****.