Rick Nash Part II

[Wolfy*]

To me he could lose a little weight and do better. He can afford to eat well, but juicy steaks every night is not the optimal diet for a pro athlete.

 

[Tawnos]

It's really a shame what happened with David Booth. I have a sinking feeling the same thing is happening with Nash.

 

[LyNX27]

We have two players this year who have posted 40 assists. The problem does not lie in the playmaking or the ability to get the puck to Nash. 26 goals as our go-to guy with 2 40 assist players on the team doesn't look very good for him.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

We have two players this year who have posted 40 assists. The problem does not lie in the playmaking or the ability to get the puck to Nash. 26 goals as our go-to guy with 2 40 assist players on the team doesn't look very good for him.

Sure it does in 65 games. That's 33 goals over 82. What the hell are you talking about?

 

[Fletch]

Sure it does in 65 games. That's 33 goals over 82. What the hell are you talking about?

tough supporting Nash sometimes because there's always a counter. Bottom line is he's paid top dollar and there were about 38 other NHLers who scored more goals than him, and unfortunately goal totals aren't extrapolated at the end of the year. I get what you're saying, and the hope is a healthy Nash, who plays 78-82 games next season, scores 35-40 goals, but the number is the number. The other number is 39 points, which ranked 5/6 on the Rangers. Yea, he's a goal scorer, but it was the worst showing of his career, even less than the prior year which was a shortened season. He likely isn't going anywhere, but until he gets into the 30s in goal scoring, and if the Rangers make it to the playoffs and he shows up more on the scoresheet, the negative barbs will continue. Hopefully his line hums next season and the PP finds consistency so there is less focus on him. I'd like to see him do well.

 

[LyNX27]

Sure it does in 65 games. That's 33 goals over 82. What the hell are you talking about?

I actually don't believe Nash is as big of a problem as people think and I think a replacement player in Richards position and a slap over the head to Nash to get his feet moving would do the trick. You don't have to be so rude, but since you insist are you good with having 7.8 million getting you 30 goals a season, how about Nash matching his numbers from his rookie season, his shooting percentage in these playoffs is 3.7%. His career shooting percentage for the playoffs? Also 3.7% (with 81 shots mind you), or maybe even the 5 goals in 41 play off games... Can you tell me what that averages out to at 82 games?

Also your comparison of Nash to Datsyuk is comical at BEST! You are saying that these 2 players learn the same way and will trend when they play different games for different teams under totally different conditions. Nash has always had to be the one scoring, Datsyuk was worked in as a role player, that kind of thinking was why a poster years ago claimed Enver Lisin was the Russian Wayne Gretzky.

I don't actually think Nash is the center of our problems, I think a more effective offensive player in Richards place will do wonders.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

tough supporting Nash sometimes because there's always a counter. Bottom line is he's paid top dollar and there were about 38 other NHLers who scored more goals than him, and unfortunately goal totals aren't extrapolated at the end of the year. I get what you're saying, and the hope is a healthy Nash, who plays 78-82 games next season, scores 35-40 goals, but the number is the number. The other number is 39 points, which ranked 5/6 on the Rangers. Yea, he's a goal scorer, but it was the worst showing of his career, even less than the prior year which was a shortened season. He likely isn't going anywhere, but until he gets into the 30s in goal scoring, and if the Rangers make it to the playoffs and he shows up more on the scoresheet, the negative barbs will continue. Hopefully his line hums next season and the PP finds consistency so there is less focus on him. I'd like to see him do well.

Very reasonable response to me saying, "what the hell are you talking about?" Makes me feel dumb! Sorry for that, just frustrated at some fans' posts. The frustration with Nash has curtailed all reason regarding his play. I disagree with your "the number is the number," but your point is taken. He also scored those 26 goals in 65 games after suffering two concussions in what? 6 months?

I actually don't believe Nash is as big of a problem as people think and I think a replacement player in Richards position and a slap over the head to Nash to get his feet moving would do the trick. You don't have to be so rude, but since you insist are you good with having 7.8 million getting you 30 goals a season, how about Nash matching his numbers from his rookie season, his shooting percentage in these playoffs is 3.7%. His career shooting percentage for the playoffs? Also 3.7% (with 81 shots mind you), or maybe even the 5 goals in 41 play off games... Can you tell me what that averages out to at 82 games?

Also your comparison of Nash to Datsyuk is comical at BEST! You are saying that these 2 players learn the same way and will trend when they play different games for different teams under totally different conditions. Nash has always had to be the one scoring, Datsyuk was worked in as a role player, that kind of thinking was why a poster years ago claimed Enver Lisin was the Russian Wayne Gretzky.

I don't actually think Nash is the center of our problems, I think a more effective offensive player in Richards place will do wonders.

I agree with almost everything you said. The comparison to Datsyuk was not made by me though. Although the poster who did make the comparison makes a good point. It's not the players themselves, but the general point that sometimes with a player you need to be patient. Nash is a 10 year veteran but he's green come playoff time. We can't label him a playoff bust and run him out of town after two postseason runs.

You're right, I didn't need to be rude.

Oh, and 5 goals in 47 playoff games equates to about 8-9 goals over 82, somewhere in that range. He definitely has been underwhelming on the stat sheet in the playoffs.

 

[LyNX27]

Very reasonable response to me saying, "what the hell are you talking about?" Makes me feel dumb! Sorry for that, just frustrated at some fans' posts. The frustration with Nash has curtailed all reason regarding his play. I disagree with your "the number is the number," but your point is taken. He also scored those 26 goals in 65 games after suffering two concussions in what? 6 months?



I agree with almost everything you said. The comparison to Datsyuk was not made by me though. Although the poster who did make the comparison makes a good point. It's not the players themselves, but the general point that sometimes with a player you need to be patient. Nash is a 10 year veteran but he's green come playoff time. We can't label him a playoff bust and run him out of town after two postseason runs.

You're right, I didn't need to be rude.

Oh, and 5 goals in 47 playoff games equates to about 8-9 goals over 82, somewhere in that range. He definitely has been underwhelming on the stat sheet in the playoffs.

NBD, I feel ya. Things are tense after the LA series. I think he can find himself as a complimentary piece with a big name center taking the heat off him. That and the growth of our core and I think we can make a cup run with. Kreider, Steps, Hagelin, McD, all with an extra year on them of good play off experience. As much as I wish we had a better player in Nash's spot I don't think trading him is the right response, mostly because we will never get the proper value.

If we use the buyout money wisely I think we have a very appealing team going into next season. None of the UFA's look like the right pick in my eyes, but I have some faith that Sather can find a deal to jimmy out the right player. LA and Chi and all those powerhouse teams have top tier players they have drafted getting their biggest paychecks. They get the best value on their superstars... Compare Kane, Kopitar, Toews, Thorton, Marleau... Hell, Crosby's contract looks spectacular compared to Nash/Richards but I think Nash needs to meet the team half way if they get a special center and he needs to show it all over his game, diet, effort, offseason... Everything. He is close to putting it together but it's late in his career.

 

[The Lunatic Fridge]

I did not expect a landslide poll like this, wow.

 

[Ail]

I did not expect a landslide poll like this, wow.

You didn't? The board is replete with biased and unjustified Nash hate. I'm actually surprised 55 people voted no.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

You didn't? The board is replete with biased and unjustified Nash hate. I'm actually surprised 55 people voted no.

LOL, seriously.

 

[Fletch]

Very reasonable response to me saying, "what the hell are you talking about?" Makes me feel dumb! Sorry for that, just frustrated at some fans' posts. The frustration with Nash has curtailed all reason regarding his play. I disagree with your "the number is the number," but your point is taken. He also scored those 26 goals in 65 games after suffering two concussions in what? 6 months?

I knew where you were coming from. Sometimes you'd think Nash is pure garbage. He didn't show up enough to the playoffs. We can point to other things he did, but someone had to score and that was the difference in winning the Cup and people need to place blame and blame goes to your highest paid players. I get that, so I get your frustration. I understand the extrapolation; it's not like you're saying he scored two goals in four games and thus was on pace for a 40 goal season. It's a reasonable extrapolation and the reason why I say "the number is the number" is because his absence in 17 games didn't help the team and 17 games could be the difference in making the playoffs, or missing the playoffs, and that's what really counts when talking about production. I use the extrapolation to say, if he plays in 80 games next season, it's reasonable to expect 35-40 goals out of him based on... The two concussions in 6 months is what is scary though. I saw a Nash that tended to pull away when he got closer to the net. He was comfortable along the boards with a guy hanging on him, but was wary of leaving himself vulnerable and that affected his chance at quality shots. I also saw him take quality shots with juicy rebounds and open nets that weren't converted; either shanked or nobody home, which affected his overall points. I think his head is in the right place. With a good offseason, and hopefully a healthy season, hopefully we can sit here and talk about a 35-40 goal season, and not a 26 goal season that could've been 40 goals had he played.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

You didn't? The board is replete with biased and unjustified Nash hate. I'm actually surprised 55 people voted no.

Hate is never justified when you're talking about something as insignificant as a professional sports player.

But lets not fool ourselves into believing Nash doesn't deserve some of the public flogging hes been getting. He is reduced to a 3rd liner in the playoffs - and that can't happen if this team is ever going to win it all.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Hate is never justified when you're talking about something as insignificant as a professional sports player.

But lets not fool ourselves into believing Nash doesn't deserve some of the public flogging hes been getting. He is reduced to a 3rd liner in the playoffs - and that can't happen if this team is ever going to win it all.

He deserves some of it. But honestly, when I talk to my friends about Nash there's a lot less hate and a lot more "let's see what he can do next year" and "the guy was snakebitten." Only on these boards do I see fans totally blinded by their Rick Nash hatred because the guy didn't score in the playoffs.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

He deserves some of it. But honestly, when I talk to my friends about Nash there's a lot less hate and a lot more "let's see what he can do next year" and "the guy was snakebitten." Only on these boards do I see fans totally blinded by their Rick Nash hatred because the guy didn't score in the playoffs.

I thought that was what everyone was saying last year too. If the team lost to Pittsburgh, the Nash hate would be 100x worse.

I'd love to think the guy is just waiting to break out in the playoffs, but I'd be fooling myself.

I just dont think his game sets up well for playoff hockey. And unless he gets MUCH better along the boards and decides to stop in front of the net every once in a while, I dont think it ever will.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

I thought that was what everyone was saying last year too. If the team lost to Pittsburgh, the Nash hate would be 100x worse.

I'd love to think the guy is just waiting to break out in the playoffs, but I'd be fooling myself.

I just dont think his game sets up well for playoff hockey. And unless he gets MUCH better along the boards and decides to stop in front of the net every once in a while, I dont think it ever will.

Well, hopefully he is learning from these experiences, and the more distance put between his previous concussions the more he drives to the net. We can hope.

A lot of people didn't think Stepan would be able to perform in the playoffs, and I thought he improved tremendously.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Well, hopefully he is learning from these experiences, and the more distance put between his previous concussions the more he drives to the net. We can hope.

A lot of people didn't think Stepan would be able to perform in the playoffs, and I thought he improved tremendously.

Stepan is 23 and still finding his way in this league. He is overslotted as a #1C because this team hasn't been able to find one in almost 20 years.

Nash is about to turn 30, the team's highest paid position player, and brought in here to put the team over the top offensively.

Should he really be given the same leeway as Stepan? Cmon now.

 

[Captain Monglobster]

To me if Nash had a lower cap hit then he would have a place on the team. I would rather keep all of Boyle, Stralman, Pouliot, Brassard, Moore, and Staal going forward than have a playoff no-show on the roster eating up 7.8m cap space.

Nash didn't play poorly in the POs, but he is getting paid to dominate and at this point its clear that he will not elevate his game once the second season comes around.

I look to move him in order to keep some cap space. Nash is not untradeable you could get a decent return for him.

 

[Fletch]

Well, hopefully he is learning from these experiences, and the more distance put between his previous concussions the more he drives to the net. We can hope.

A lot of people didn't think Stepan would be able to perform in the playoffs, and I thought he improved tremendously.

Everyone expects results today. With Nash, the feeling is he is on the decline, and even it he isn't, here's a 31 year old, prolific NHL scorer with little playoff experience and what experience he has had he didn't exactly distinguish himself from others in a positive way. He scored one goal last season in 12 playoff games and I think most believe there isn't going to be a switch that turns on; he's just not a big game guy. The other knock is he scores goals in 7-3 wins and losses and scores goals against lesser teams, defenses and goalies and when the going gets tough, Nash isn't on the scoreboard, and if he's not on the scoreboard, the team could spend $3MM on a very quality checker and use the remainder on other players. Further, the concussion history is worrisome; will his play tail off - will his skills diminish - will he alter his play and not be as productive. And of course there is still, x goals, x playoff games, $7.8MM..wtf?

Personally, to me, he's a Ranger. My only opinion is he isn't earning his paycheck, and really hasn't in two seasons. He's not garbage, and honestly I do not know now where he is in his career, prime or downside. Regardless, he's not getting traded or bought-out and it's up to the coach to make the best team with the pieces he has, and wherever Nash fits into that based on his play, is where he should be. He's a top six forward on this team. Need to try to put aside his pay and root for the team, instead of lamenting what could be if he wasn't here, or was paid less, etc. Hopefully the taste of the Stanley Cup reinvigorated him and the rest, from hockey and injuries, does him well and come the Fall he's beginning anew.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

To me if Nash had a lower cap hit then he would have a place on the team. I would rather keep all of Boyle, Stralman, Pouliot, Brassard, Moore, and Staal going forward than have a playoff no-show on the roster eating up 7.8m cap space.

Nash didn't play poorly in the POs, but he is getting paid to dominate and at this point its clear that he will not elevate his game once the second season comes around.

I look to move him in order to keep some cap space. Nash is not untradeable you could get a decent return for him.

I dont view it as needing to elevate his game. I view it as having to change his game.

The coaching staff should show him tape of Jagr and how his game evolved over the years. Hes going to evolve in a similar way if he wants to be successful in the playoffs. He also needs to get stronger - for such a big guy, he is not very strong on his skates, which is a big reason why he is terrible in the trenches.

 

[LORDE]

The reason people want him gone is his Casper impression in the Poffs. How many Cup finals do u think we will get? How many more until we say "Nash can't cut it when it REALLY counts"

I'm ready to say that now.

Forget (not the word I wanted but that one would get ****) another chance.

 

[vipernsx]

I don't like Nash and never did, never will. It's not waiver trash or buyout worthy like some ridiculously say. He's still a solid player worth a decent return. There's no reason why anyone wouldn't want Dubinsky & Erixon on this team right now over Nash.

Nash was a non-factor the whole playoffs. Maybe he was hurt, maybe he's not. He played no differently then he has in the playoffs of years past. Stepan played hurt, Brassard played hurt, McDonagh played hurt, Kreider played hurt and they were all still impactful players. Someone like that sucking up 8m is wasting good resources that could be better used elsewhere.

 

[vipernsx]

The reason people want him gone is his Casper impression in the Poffs. How many Cup finals do u think we will get? How many more until we say "Nash can't cut it when it REALLY counts"

I'm ready to say that now.

Forget (not the word I wanted but that one would get ****) another chance.

Vanek was lauded for having a terrible playoffs so much so that it's hurt his potential earnings of next year. He put up more goals then Nash and put up his 10 points in 8 fewer games.

Torey Krug, a defenceman, put up similar stats in half as many games and the 18 y/o rookie Nathan MacKinnon did it in one playoff series.

Proponents will say "solid defensive play" and "lack of PP time" to them I say, "Brandon Dubinsky" or even "Artem Anisimov"

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

Vanek was lauded for having a terrible playoffs so much so that it's hurt his potential earnings of next year. He put up more goals then Nash and put up his 10 points in 8 fewer games.

Torey Krug, a defenceman, put up similar stats in half as many games and the 18 y/o rookie Nathan MacKinnon did it in one playoff series.

Proponents will say "solid defensive play" and "lack of PP time" to them I say, "Brandon Dubinsky" or even "Artem Anisimov"

Or, he and Stepan drive possession whenever they're on the ice together even when going up against very difficult competition.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

This Rick Nash issue in undebatable!

Those against Rick Nash are angry that he didn't live up to his hype

Those in favor of Rick Nash defend him for average play due to his hype

There's nothing to do about this now. There wasn't a cup.

Let's see what the general consensus is on Rick Nash when the BlueJackets leap frog us next year.