Remember the Caps and Blues

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It's guys not willing to go to the net to create havoc and get bounces. None of the top paid players play a physical game. AM does when he chooses to from time to time
Either they grow a pair, or lose their fear and play at full speed, or Bettman has to use same rules in playoffs that they use all season.
Do not understand let players decide on the ice bs.
What that means is the fast skilled players have gone from an advantage to being beat up without calls.
 
I don’t think the gap between Florida and Toronto is that wide TBH. Yes the outplayed us in the playoffs but I don’t think we are worse than them. I know a lot of people don’t want to hear this but getting over that first round hump will help this team. Should be less focus on it now. I think that first round hump narrative completely caused us to self-implode in the second round. It really felt like that was all they were playing to accomplish sadly.

I think the coaching staff and players relaxed way too much as they put so much emotion into getting past that first round. Now that, that mental hurdle has been passed, I’m interested to see how they carry that mindset forward. Either way I do agree, we need to wait for that Tavares contract to expire.

Florida didn’t win a cup though. The gap between a finalist run that gets blown out of the water and winning a cup can be wide.

So we shouldn’t be comparing our ultimate goals to that shitty team.
 
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Florida didn’t win a cup though. The gap between a finalist run that gets blown out of the water and winning a cup can be wide.

So we shouldn’t be comparing our ultimate goals to that shitty team.

I think we are on the same page. I think we are better than them. I don’t know if the leafs will make a run. I can’t sit here with certainty. But IMO the leafs should have two goals. Win the damn division and minimum conference finals. We need to win our division.
 
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Let me remind you that the Panthers when they were winning, their best player, and the reason they went so far in the playoffs was 34 years old.

Their "younger" team was not good, their old goalie was.

I don't even think their core is younger than ours, probably the team overall, but not the core.
aaaaaaah goaltending………..the Dubas afterthought
 
An annual classic: The Burned By The Hot Goalie narrative amended to be Burned By The Hot Old Goalie.

Arguably the teams' core skaters:

Tavares 32
Rielly 29
Nylander 27
Matthews 25
Marner 26


Ekblad 27
Tkachuk 25
Barkov 27
Reinhart 27
Bennett 27
Verhaeghe 27

Sorry, you don't like that Bobrovsky was by far their best player.

It looks like similarly aged cores... Tavares is your issue and you excluded Florida's best player last playoff.

Also Montour > overrated Ekblad

aaaaaaah goaltending………..the Dubas afterthought

Do you want a goalie who is trash every year of his career minus 2 for 10? I am sure we could have traded for Bob for free.

Let's hope the new GM makes some good signings in the net like in Calgary.
 
An annual classic: The Burned By The Hot Goalie narrative amended to be Burned By The Hot Old Goalie.

Arguably the teams' core skaters:

Tavares 32
Rielly 29
Nylander 27
Matthews 25
Marner 26


Ekblad 27
Tkachuk 25
Barkov 27
Reinhart 27
Bennett 27
Verhaeghe 27
I hate the we got goalied argument because it comes out every year and only means one of two things

Either:

1. Our strategy of high paid forwards is flawed and we should abandon that in favor of a single goalie that will provide more value / results

OR

2. The expensive forward strategy works we just picked the wrong players, in which case we need to trade one or more of them for the right kind of players
 
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I feel sorry for the haters. If the Leafs keep the core together and then win it all, are the haters even going to enjoy it?
 
Rielly plays like a top 10D every year in the playoffs.
Hard to dispute that...I hated his game during the regular season but admit he brought it in the playoffs just like he did the year before.

But there isn't to much money locked into 4 players.

Every team has a similar percentage locked into their top 4 players, and those that don't will once their ELC's expire looking at Buffalo here.

But take Florida for example 44% of their cap in 4 players.

Vegas is similar with 39 million between Eichel AP, Stone, Karlsson, and Marsh.

That's 5 players and nearly 50% of Vegas cap.

This idea that Toronto spends to much money on 4 or 5 guys is bullshit, and all you to do to prove it's bullshit is look at the 2 teams that just went to the finals.

They both spend about half their cap on 4 or 5 guys.

Everybody does.
Maybe but leafs still lead in that category and they have all their money tied into 4 similar style forwards....Those other teams spread their money out to different positions.
 
I liked it better when we didn't make the playoffs. Those great teams captained by Dion Phaneuf, Raycroft between the pipes - that was so much better. The brilliant hockey mind of Nonis ahh those were the days
Why does it have to be so extreme....Nobody is saying yea lets go back to those days. 1-2 of our top guys need to be moved so the money can be spent more effectively. To assume we end up back in the dark days seems a little overeactive.

Yes, please tell us all about how good Tkachuk is, I want to hear more about it.

Especially in past years, I witnessed a good playoff from him this year, I want to hear about his past playoff heroics, he has a lot of games played.
I mean if you cant see with your own eyes what he brings to the table and what I think our team needs more of then.....
 
I think the big difference between the "haters" and the cheerleaders are that the former will be happy to be proven wrong.
I don't know, there are some people in the other threads talking about not even watching next season. There's something about the way we finally beat Tampa but then got clobbered by Florida that broke many fans. There's something a bit different this time.
 
Is this thread saying the core is going to win simply because if the Caps and Blues?

What happened to Thornton and Marleau?
What about Lindros and the Legion of Doom?
Roenick and Amonte?

Not everything is guaranteed because you have Matthews/Marner/Nylander. Sorry.
 
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I feel sorry for the haters. If the Leafs keep the core together and then win it all, are the haters even going to enjoy it?
I want to see some changes and if thats hating , Im not sure how to respond to that....but if the core can pull it off I will happily eat crow and admit I was wrong about them. And if they dont succeed will you do the same and acknowledge that those who pushed for change were right all along?
 
Yes, the core hasn't been changed... but nearly every other piece has been.

Starting this year, we will have what... five players that have been here for five years? There have been plenty of changes. 25-33% turnover every year.
 
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I want to see some changes and if thats hating , Im not sure how to respond to that....but if the core can pull it off I will happily eat crow and admit I was wrong about them. And if they dont succeed will you do the same and acknowledge that those who pushed for change were right all along?
Of course not. We'll never know if the changes would have worked either. It's hard to win the cup, every season 31 teams don't. We're not going to win anything without better goaltending so most of us are suggesting changes just not to the core.
 
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Sorry, you don't like that Bobrovsky was by far their best player.

It looks like similarly aged cores... Tavares is your issue and you excluded Florida's best player last playoff.

Also Montour > overrated Ekblad



Do you want a goalie who is trash every year of his career minus 2 for 10? I am sure we could have traded for Bob for free.

Let's hope the new GM makes some good signings in the net like in Calgary.
Nowhere did I say I wanted goalie Bob. What I did expect is a little more effort from Dubas and his henchmen in the pursuit of a tender. Not just going to the scrap heap every dam year
 
Nowhere did I say I wanted goalie Bob. What I did expect is a little more effort from Dubas and his henchmen in the pursuit of a tender. Not just going to the scrap heap every dam year
Goaltending always seemed like an afterthought....We were very lucky that Samsnonov had some success but man what a gamble Dubas took last year
 
Is this thread saying the core is going to win simply because if the Caps and Blues?

What happened to Thornton and Marleau?
What about Lindros and the Legion of Doom?
Roenick and Amonte?

Not everything is guaranteed because you have Matthews/Marner/Nylander. Sorry.

I don’t think the OP is saying Toronto is going to win. They are saying that the patience approach isn’t the worst approach to take. Other teams have been patient and were rewarded.

Other teams revamped completely and rewarded. There isn’t one set way to design a team and win a cup with a particular core. Just saying the core should stay together a little more.

I’m indifferent, I’d welcome a hockey trade. If there was one available, But would also be fine with the core sticking together.
 
I don’t think the OP is saying Toronto is going to win. They are saying that the patience approach isn’t the worst approach to take. Other teams have been patient and were rewarded.

Other teams revamped completely and rewarded. There isn’t one set way to design a team and win a cup with a particular core. Just saying the core should stay together a little more.

I’m indifferent, I’d welcome a hockey trade. If there was one available, But would also be fine with the core sticking together.
What about bringing Keefe back along with the core? Basically nothing has changed. You are good with that and think they will figure it out?
 
Yes, the core hasn't been changed... but nearly every other piece has been.

Starting this year, we will have what... five players that have been here for five years? There have been plenty of changes. 25-33% turnover every year.
Which has amounted to what!?
 
Ironic thing is Shanahan is good with that more than Dubas reportedly was just prior to his firing.
yea not thrilled that Shanny seemed more than ok with the job Dubas was doing and if we do in fact just run it all back with no significant changes and end up in the same place again then Shanny becomes numero uno target to replace
 
I've made this point as well on a previous thread and agree with the posters sensibility

Obviously changes are afoot regardless for this Leafs squad with so many UFA signings or trades required to get to a 23 man roster to start the season... but there's no real justification for trading the true core four unless blown away by a trade offer in which the Leafs can get better in the present and future.

The true core 4 is Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Reilly (Tavares was a sentimental mistake from the beginning) this money (cap) should be allocated to a high-end RD (complimentary to Reilly) and Goaltending

I had this conversation with my brother 5 years ago and told him Tavares was a bad idea & would be liability to the team in every way by year 4 or 5... here we are now

Dear good lord, please answer my prayers and appear to Brad Treliving in an epiphany or dream and implore him to ask Tavares to accept trade 🙏

Thank you in advance, your man, Adam
 
I've made this point as well on a previous thread and agree with the posters sensibility

Obviously changes are afoot regardless for this Leafs squad with so many UFA signings or trades required to get to a 23 man roster to start the season... but there's no real justification for trading the true core four unless blown away by a trade offer in which the Leafs can get better in the present and future.

The true core 4 is Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Reilly (Tavares was a sentimental mistake from the beginning) this money (cap) should be allocated to a high-end RD (complimentary to Reilly) and Goaltending

I had this conversation with my brother 5 years ago and told him Tavares was a bad idea & would be liability to the team in every way by year 4 or 5... here we are now

Dear good lord, please answer my prayers and appear to Brad Treliving in an epiphany or dream and implore him to ask Tavares to accept trade 🙏

Thank you in advance, your man, Adam
So you are good with giving them raises and just keep going with them regardless of how it will impact other positions? Crapping the bed every playoffs isnt enough justification? 7 yrs....really its 4 yrs as I didnt expect them to do much the first 3 yrs they were in the playoffs.
 

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