Re-tooling For One More Run With This Core

[thusk]

The Leafs are soft

Tell me where, give me exemple

Losing doesnt mean youre soft because ibreally dont see where they was sofr

If you talking about physical game... leafs are 9th with 36 hit/60... 4 lower of tampa

Higher than calgary, stl NYR who won their 1st round match up

1 lower than carolina

Top 2 team in term of hit/ 60 list in 1st round are out( nashville and Washington).

 

[The Masters]

Order of business:

need to revamp bottom 6 , improve D , figure out Campbell situation, be aggressive on trade market with nylander and kerfoot and revamp that 2nd line / improve defense. I also like to see JT move to wing. Go after Marchment and Paul. Brings us size and some talent which is what this team needs.

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
XXXXXX - XXXXX - Tavares
Marchment - Kampf - XXXXX
Nick Paul - Blackwell - XXXXX

 

[Dreakmur]

Oh you look closer of what the real problem was...like pittsburgh overcame physicality with speed but lack if production from bottom 6... bottom scored only 2 goal at 5v5 vs 8 for tampa bottom 6...

So the real problem is not a problem of being soft but a lack of scoring depht

It’s more efficient to solve the problem than it is to try to work around it.

 

[Trapper]

For me you have:

Group A:
Matthews, JT, Marner, Nylander

Group B:
Rielly, Muzzin, Brodie, Campbell

After 6 consecutive loses, 1 from each group needs to change. With the exception of Matthews/Rielly, I don’t care who.
We need a new core member in each group with a different intensity, skill set, approach. Be it a Scheif, Helle, something else.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Maybe it's because I have no attachment to and real "like" for this current group -- from Dubas and Keefe right on down to Matthews and Marner -- that I wouldn't mind seeing things shaken up.

 

[rocketman588]

Shief for willy and putting JT on the wing does make some sense

For me you have:

Group A:
Matthews, JT, Marner, Nylander

Group B:
Rielly, Muzzin, Brodie, Campbell

After 6 consecutive loses, 1 from each group needs to change. With the exception of Matthews/Rielly, I don’t care who.
We need a new core member in each group with a different intensity, skill set, approach. Be it a Scheif, Helle, something else.

Campbell gone for sure imo anyways

 

[ULF_55]

For me you have:

Group A:
Matthews, JT, Marner, Nylander

Group B:
Rielly, Muzzin, Brodie, Campbell

After 6 consecutive loses, 1 from each group needs to change. With the exception of Matthews/Rielly, I don’t care who.
We need a new core member in each group with a different intensity, skill set, approach. Be it a Scheif, Helle, something else.

Why exclude Matthews and Rielly from the list?
Shouldn't everything be considered?

McKinnon (extended) and Toews for Matthews? Not happening, but wouldn't you consider it?
Makar for Rielly and a couple 1st. round picks? Again, Makar is untouchable but Rielly shouldn't be.

Scheifele is one who we've heard might be part of the Jets - Leafs scenario. As in the Jets are in the same boat as the Leafs looking to make a change. We've heard less about the Leafs looking to change that core, except from fans who really have no impact on management decisions.

When the top 3 playoff performers are the same 3 players every year and the rest of the team doesn't deliver they really have to find a couple more difference makers. Removing one of the top 3 and replacing that one with another top 3 doesn't fix the problem.

 

[ToneDog]

Friedman and Marek pumping Eric Comrie's tires. He is a UFA and would make a good backup.

 

[Buds17]

Friedman and Marek pumping Eric Comrie's tires. He is a UFA and would make a good backup.

Just 28 GP for his career thus far though. I can see how that makes sense behind a workhorse starter like Hellebuyck. Will that work out as well here? Have to determine who our starter is first.

 

[thusk]

It’s more efficient to solve the problem than it is to try to work around it.

But the fact than toronto style is more about speed than physicality is not a problem at all... so yes they need to fix the problem but they need to fix the good one... its how carolina is build, how calgary, pittsburgh, NYR, Minnesota, colorado, stl, vegas, LAK are build.

 

[ToneDog]

Just 28 GP for his career thus far though. I can see how that makes sense behind a workhorse starter like Hellebuyck. Will that work out as well here? Have to determine who our starter is first.

Sign Comrie and trade for Helly and Schief.

 

[robertmac43]

Scheifele is one who we've heard might be part of the Jets - Leafs scenario. As in the Jets are in the same boat as the Leafs looking to make a change. We've heard less about the Leafs looking to change that core, except from fans who really have no impact on management decisions.

I don't think Scheifele is a good choice for the Leafs. Terrible from a defensive perspective and really does not work that hard in general. It would essentially be trading for a worst version of Nylander in some ways.

 

[Dreakmur]

But the fact than toronto style is more about speed than physicality is not a problem at all... so yes they need to fix the problem but they need to fix the good one... its how carolina is build, how calgary, pittsburgh, NYR, Minnesota, colorado, stl, vegas, LAK are build.

We tried the speed thing. It didn’t work because they were too soft. We don’t have the cap space to bring in better speed players.

 

[Trapper]

Why exclude Matthews and Rielly from the list?
Shouldn't everything be considered?

McKinnon (extended) and Toews for Matthews? Not happening, but wouldn't you consider it?
Makar for Rielly and a couple 1st. round picks? Again, Makar is untouchable but Rielly shouldn't be.

Scheifele is one who we've heard might be part of the Jets - Leafs scenario. As in the Jets are in the same boat as the Leafs looking to make a change. We've heard less about the Leafs looking to change that core, except from fans who really have no impact on management decisions.

When the top 3 playoff performers are the same 3 players every year and the rest of the team doesn't deliver they really have to find a couple more difference makers. Removing one of the top 3 and replacing that one with another top 3 doesn't fix the problem.

We will see what happens ULF. I believe there is something missing in this collection just beyond what you are listing. There is production but nobody ever has the come through, end all production, clamp down, it’s the OT winner, right play at the right moment characteristics. The now we can only score 2 so we have to win 2-1 team play.

People focus on the things like penalties, Holl, Kerfoot but forget that we were also lucky in this series. No suspensions, goaltending didn’t collapse and most importantly, no key injuries. We didn’t lose Muzzin or someone else like Point at the start of game 7. Nobody was sick and invisible all series. We were relatively clean in that regard. So we will see.

 

[ULF_55]

We tried the speed thing. It didn’t work because they were too soft. We don’t have the cap space to bring in better speed players.

I don't think they need speed players, and I don't think they need top 6 talent.

As much as I appreciate Bunting, I don't consider him a 1st. line player. But you don't need to have 3 1st. liner on your 1st. line. I think you need 2, but not 3.

I think they need Bunting2 for the 2nd. line, and that might be quite a different player than Bunting.
Probably need a bridge player between Tavares and Nylander. Doesn't have to skate like Nylander, but should be able to keep up, and should have some hands. Kind of a flawed top 6 player until Knies makes his debut in a year.

 

[Sypher04]

We will see what happens ULF. I believe there is something missing in this collection just beyond what you are listing. There is production but nobody ever has the come through, end all production, clamp down, it’s the OT winner, right play at the right moment characteristics.

People focus on the things like penalties, Holl, Kerfoot but forget that we were also lucky in this series. No suspensions, goaltending didn’t collapse and most importantly, no key injuries. We didn’t lose Muzzin or someone else like Point at the start of game 7. Nobody was sick and invisible all series. We were relatively clean in that regard. So we will see.

Not all of this is quite true.

Clifford was suspended.
Matthews came into the series already with a groin injury. Muzzin wasn’t close to 100% either coming in. Nor was Bunting. We know all those.
Nylander was sick at the beginning half of the series.

We didn’t lose a player of note during the series, but I think it’s pretty clear Lyubushkin was injured in one game and kept playing the east of the series (I don’t recall which game it was)

Either way this team was still battling their share.

 

[ULF_55]

We will see what happens ULF. I believe there is something missing in this collection just beyond what you are listing. There is production but nobody ever has the come through, end all production, clamp down, it’s the OT winner, right play at the right moment characteristics. The now we can only score 2 so we have to win 2-1 team play.

People focus on the things like penalties, Holl, Kerfoot but forget that we were also lucky in this series. No suspensions, goaltending didn’t collapse and most importantly, no key injuries. We didn’t lose Muzzin or someone else like Point at the start of game 7. Nobody was sick and invisible all series. We were relatively clean in that regard. So we will see.

Yeah, Lightning won it on two goals from a support player.

If you exclude the empty net goals by Mikheyev, bottom six scored 4 goals, top 6 scored 13.
If you put Kerfoot in the top 6 the bottom scored 3 goals.

Really, they didn't poop-the-bed this time.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Management's obsessed with Kerfoot. They had a Kerfoot + Dermott for Weegar deal offered and said no.

That’s was Mango not kerf, and Florida said no

 

[Trapper]

Yeah, Lightning won it on two goals from a support player.

If you exclude the empty net goals by Mikheyev, bottom six scored 4 goals, top 6 scored 13.
If you put Kerfoot in the top 6 the bottom scored 3 goals.

Really, they didn't poop-the-bed this time.

Tampa won it from a support in game 7 but Point won it in Game 6 OT and Kucherov tying it. It’s about the only thing he did but like all things it was the exact right time. We never seem to be right place right time. And that’s why I think there needs to be a change of importance. Will it work? I don’t know. I can only tell you for sure what hasn’t. I can only give a past behaviour for future indicators.

 

[ULF_55]

I'm curious about the playing status wrt KHL.

Might there be more availability of players if things are unchanged in the summer?

 

[bossram]

Offseason moves:

Re-sign: Engvall (~$2.5 million), Sandin (~$1.5 million), Liljegren (~$1.75 million), Blackwell (~$900k), Spezza (~$750k), Campbell (~$3 million), Giordano (~$2 million).

I don't think Campbell has a claim to much more than that given his very uneven season. He's coming off a much worse season than Mrazek was when they signed him, so he really shouldn't be given a higher cap hit. Giordano clearly wants to stay in Toronto, and he sounded willing to do the year-by-year hometown discount thing.

UFA: Subban (~900k).

He's cheap depth. Probably willing to come to Toronto on a low-ball deal. Enough said.

Trade: Justin Holl for Jessi Puljujarvi (sign at ~$2.75 million)
Trade: Ondrej Kase to VGK for depth prospect/mid-round draft pick
Trade: Mrazek + 2024 1st + Nick Robertson to Arizona for basically nothing

Edmonton's MSM usually parrot the management line and it's pretty clear they (and/or Holland) are running Pulju out of town. He's already an elite puckhound and defensive forward. If he develops more of a finishing touch, he'll be a major player. EDM is going to have to retool their backend, move Barrie and replace him with a more defensive RHD. Holl comes in here. If not Holl for Pulju straight across, then trade Holl for a 2nd, use the 2nd to get Pulju.

Vegas will lose Rielly Smith to free agency, probably Nic Roy, and will have to trade Dadonov for cap space. Kase gives them a cheap, relatively useful bottom-nine winger to help replace them.

Dubas absolutely must move Mrazek. He'll be expensive to get rid of. You can ditch anyone in Arizona, but the problem is Mrazek's actual cash is higher than his cap hit. I'm not actually super high on Robertson, I don't think he has the speed or hockey IQ to be an impact player as a smaller guy. I honestly think Holmberg is more NHL ready and has a better shot of helping the Leafs

Nylander - Matthews - Puljujarvi
Bunting - Tavares - Marner
Engvall - Kerfoot - Holmberg
Blackwell - Kampf - Spezza

Rielly - Liljegren
Muzzin - Brodie
Giordano - Subban
Sandin

Campbell
Kallgren

They need to get the most out of Tavares they can. Bunting and Marner can do that. Matthews will carry anybody, but Willy and Pulju are still very good linemates. The logic on defense is that you rotate Muzzin, Gio, Brodie, Subban out of the lineup to keep them fresh throughout the season.

 

[bodechek]

Dubas is the idiot that would beat a dead horse with a stick, expecting it to move. His plan has NOT worked in four playoff tries, why is he insisting on continuing with the same group?! Oh yeah, because Dubas is an idiot

 

[thusk]

We tried the speed thing. It didn’t work because they were too soft. We don’t have the cap space to bring in better speed players.

Do you know what does it mean being soft??? Not sure

If they was so soft like you said NEVER they would be 12 minutes and a ghost call away of beating the best team of last 3 season and being the team who challenging tampa the most since 2020 .

 

[egd27]

It's certainly better than going no where every year.

How many coaches did they go through?
IMO, Keefe is the biggest thing holding the team back.

yea but he says f**k a lot and the kids seem t like that.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Offseason moves:

Re-sign: Engvall (~$2.5 million), Sandin (~$1.5 million), Liljegren (~$1.75 million), Blackwell (~$900k), Spezza (~$750k), Campbell (~$3 million), Giordano (~$2 million).

I don't think Campbell has a claim to much more than that given his very uneven season. He's coming off a much worse season than Mrazek was when they signed him, so he really shouldn't be given a higher cap hit. Giordano clearly wants to stay in Toronto, and he sounded willing to do the year-by-year hometown discount thing.

UFA: Subban (~900k).

He's cheap depth. Probably willing to come to Toronto on a low-ball deal. Enough said.

Trade: Justin Holl for Jessi Puljujarvi (sign at ~$2.75 million)
Trade: Ondrej Kase to VGK for depth prospect/mid-round draft pick
Trade: Mrazek + 2024 1st + Nick Robertson to Arizona for basically nothing

Edmonton's MSM usually parrot the management line and it's pretty clear they (and/or Holland) are running Pulju out of town. He's already an elite puckhound and defensive forward. If he develops more of a finishing touch, he'll be a major player. EDM is going to have to retool their backend, move Barrie and replace him with a more defensive RHD. Holl comes in here. If not Holl for Pulju straight across, then trade Holl for a 2nd, use the 2nd to get Pulju.

Vegas will lose Rielly Smith to free agency, probably Nic Roy, and will have to trade Dadonov for cap space. Kase gives them a cheap, relatively useful bottom-nine winger to help replace them.

Dubas absolutely must move Mrazek. He'll be expensive to get rid of. You can ditch anyone in Arizona, but the problem is Mrazek's actual cash is higher than his cap hit. I'm not actually super high on Robertson, I don't think he has the speed or hockey IQ to be an impact player as a smaller guy. I honestly think Holmberg is more NHL ready and has a better shot of helping the Leafs

Nylander - Matthews - Puljujarvi
Bunting - Tavares - Marner
Engvall - Kerfoot - Holmberg
Blackwell - Kampf - Spezza

Rielly - Liljegren
Muzzin - Brodie
Giordano - Subban
Sandin

Campbell
Kallgren

They need to get the most out of Tavares they can. Bunting and Marner can do that. Matthews will carry anybody, but Willy and Pulju are still very good linemates. The logic on defense is that you rotate Muzzin, Gio, Brodie, Subban out of the lineup to keep them fresh throughout the season.

1)
Trade: Mrazek + 2024 1st + Nick Robertson to Arizona for basically nothing

2)
Campbell
Kallgren

1 - You need to put down the pipe. Getting rid of Mrazek won't cost anywhere near that.
2 - If come back without improving in net, we're screwed and nothing else we do will matter.

I repeat - put ... down ... the ... pipe.