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RD Adam Fox (2016, 66th, CGY; traded to CAR; traded to NYR)

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I still think his skating needs some work. But he checks every other box.

I also think his skills will really show in the structured NHL game.
 
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Assistant said:
Will he or won’t he sign with the Flames is the big question I guess?
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The fact he is at Harvard scares me.. Obviously making the NHL is every kids dream but if u can get that prestigious Harvard degree to hang on your wall forever and still be only 21 years old scares me for Flames fans that he could test the UFA market. He will get the treatment of teams promising not to play him in the AHL ever.

I mean who knows, he could be 100% committed to the Flames and plan on signing when he is ready or he may be tempted to pick and choose and really take advantage of the unique UFA situation.

IMO he isnt NHL ready yet so maybe he may figure he can sign after this year and spend time in the minors till he is NHL ready or wait it out, get the degree, pick and choose what team he wants with his best chance to succeed and never set foot in the minors... Im sure him and his agent and family discuss this daily
 
The skating concerns about Fox are extremely overblown. He’s certainly not the fastest skater on the ice, but he isn’t the slowest either. With some added strength and further conditioning, he’ll be fine just like Rasmus. I think Fox at times coasts on the ice a lot like Tkachuk more to conserve energy. When he needs to, his top end speed is more than adequate.

Fox is a top end talent, I think he’ll be a top 4 dman for us within 2 seasons.
 
Elias Pettersson said:
and yet all my Flames fans friends consistently complain that the defence is letting them down this year...
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Were consistently complaining, or are consistently complaining?

The Flames to me were atrocious for the first segment of games. In the last stretch, they have been absolutely elite at prevention. I criticized them very hard for their lack of discipline in their own end, but now I find myself praising them quite a lot.

As well, it is worth mentioning that Calgary didn't assemble a defensive corps that is elite at defence. The elite defencemen that Calgary have are 2-way. There are better offensive D in the league. There are better defensive D in the league. Calgary has a defensive corps that should be way above average on both sides of the puck. Look at Nashville last year. They had an elite goalie. They also have an elite (arguably the best) defensive corps in the league. Now go and take a look at last year's numbers simply going off of GA and GF as a team.

GA - 224 - 15th in the league
GF - 240 - 11th in the league

Calgary last year was:

GA - 221 - 14th in the league
GF - 226 - T-15th in the league

By your definition, Nashville didn't have an elite D last year either, since they were just 15th overall in GA. Take a look at Nashville's D, and you also see 2-way defencemen that are among the best in the business.

This year Nashville is 6th in GA so far, and Calgary is (with a horrible start) 13th and climbing. Definitely more to be desired overall so far (which is why I have been very critical of the Flames and Gulutzan in general, as I don't feel his system was making good use of the type of defencemen that Calgary has from the 1-6 spot).

HOWEVER...

CGY 4, ANA 2
CGY 4, LA 3
CGY 4, CHI 3
CGY 1, ANA 2
CGY 2, SJ 3 (SO)
CGY 2, MTL 3
CGY 2, STL 1
CGY 6, VCR 1
CGY 0, NSH 2
CGY 2, SJ 3
CGY 1, MIN 2
CGY 4, VCR 2
CGY 3, MTL 2
CGY 1, TOR 2

30 GA in the last 14 games (since the 5-2 loss to Phi). 2.14 GA/G. That's pretty good. Not good.... rather downright elite. Over 41 games, it would mean a GA of 87, good for 1st in the league (and nobody even close). Now of course this is just a snippet of overall games, but these are 14 consecutive games. It isn't like a 5 game lucky streak here. Flames have been elite at stopping goals over the last 14 games, and we will have to see how it turns out. If any Flames' fans that you know are still complaining about the goals against or chances against, perhaps you shouldn't listen to what they are saying?

It will be interesting to see how they keep it up. I think they have been TOO defensive and not creating enough, which is annoying onto itself, but it wasn't like they were scoring at a high pace before turning into a defensive team. I expect the GA to go up a smidge as the team looks for a bit more offence (and I think the D have not been utilized enough in this area - they skate well as a group and should be jumping in a bit more like Nashville does, even if it costs them a little on the GA, as long as they are a + on the difference). I actually look forward to seeing how they do from here on out - if they can hold it together defensively this well (and it isn't like those were a bunch of lousy teams either).

As for Fox, I disagree he is ready for the NHL. His mind might be there, but until he skates a bit better and maybe even gets a tad stronger, he will have trouble on the defensive side. Without having the coach's trust defensively, it becomes a bit difficult to actually play him. I think he is a tremendous talent, and I am excited that he is a prospect that the Flames own the rights to. We will see if he goes for his last year or not. Hickey didn't seem like he wanted to sign in Calgary (though that was never confirmed). Jankowski and Gaudreau both signed. Flames have also attracted a few high-level college FAs of late as well. I suspect that the Flames talk to him fairly regularly, and have a sense of what Fox is intending to do. I am not sure if he wants to pass up millions of dollars in earnings by waiting until he is a UFA. If he wants to go that route, Flames will trade him for something. I just can't see him in the NHL today - guys are both big and fast, and though I think he has shown incredible progress defensively, I think he needs to improve his footspeed and probably add some strength to be able to handle the NHL better. His IQ? Definitely ready.
 
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Reinhart said:
Were consistently complaining, or are consistently complaining?

The Flames to me were atrocious for the first segment of games. In the last stretch, they have been absolutely elite at prevention. I criticized them very hard for their lack of discipline in their own end, but now I find myself praising them quite a lot.

As well, it is worth mentioning that Calgary didn't assemble a defensive corps that is elite at defence. The elite defencemen that Calgary have are 2-way. There are better offensive D in the league. There are better defensive D in the league. Calgary has a defensive corps that should be way above average on both sides of the puck. Look at Nashville last year. They had an elite goalie. They also have an elite (arguably the best) defensive corps in the league. Now go and take a look at last year's numbers simply going off of GA and GF as a team.

GA - 224 - 15th in the league
GF - 240 - 11th in the league

Calgary last year was:

GA - 221 - 14th in the league
GF - 226 - T-15th in the league

By your definition, Nashville didn't have an elite D last year either, since they were just 15th overall in GA. Take a look at Nashville's D, and you also see 2-way defencemen that are among the best in the business.

This year Nashville is 6th in GA so far, and Calgary is (with a horrible start) 13th and climbing. Definitely more to be desired overall so far (which is why I have been very critical of the Flames and Gulutzan in general, as I don't feel his system was making good use of the type of defencemen that Calgary has from the 1-6 spot).

HOWEVER...

CGY 4, ANA 2
CGY 4, LA 3
CGY 4, CHI 3
CGY 1, ANA 2
CGY 2, SJ 3 (SO)
CGY 2, MTL 3
CGY 2, STL 1
CGY 6, VCR 1
CGY 0, NSH 2
CGY 2, SJ 3
CGY 1, MIN 2
CGY 4, VCR 2
CGY 3, MTL 2
CGY 1, TOR 2

30 GA in the last 14 games (since the 5-2 loss to Phi). 2.14 GA/G. That's pretty good. Not good.... rather downright elite. Over 41 games, it would mean a GA of 87, good for 1st in the league (and nobody even close). Now of course this is just a snippet of overall games, but these are 14 consecutive games. It isn't like a 5 game lucky streak here. Flames have been elite at stopping goals over the last 14 games, and we will have to see how it turns out. If any Flames' fans that you know are still complaining about the goals against or chances against, perhaps you shouldn't listen to what they are saying?

It will be interesting to see how they keep it up. I think they have been TOO defensive and not creating enough, which is annoying onto itself, but it wasn't like they were scoring at a high pace before turning into a defensive team. I expect the GA to go up a smidge as the team looks for a bit more offence (and I think the D have not been utilized enough in this area - they skate well as a group and should be jumping in a bit more like Nashville does, even if it costs them a little on the GA, as long as they are a + on the difference). I actually look forward to seeing how they do from here on out - if they can hold it together defensively this well (and it isn't like those were a bunch of lousy teams either).

As for Fox, I disagree he is ready for the NHL. His mind might be there, but until he skates a bit better and maybe even gets a tad stronger, he will have trouble on the defensive side. Without having the coach's trust defensively, it becomes a bit difficult to actually play him. I think he is a tremendous talent, and I am excited that he is a prospect that the Flames own the rights to. We will see if he goes for his last year or not. Hickey didn't seem like he wanted to sign in Calgary (though that was never confirmed). Jankowski and Gaudreau both signed. Flames have also attracted a few high-level college FAs of late as well. I suspect that the Flames talk to him fairly regularly, and have a sense of what Fox is intending to do. I am not sure if he wants to pass up millions of dollars in earnings by waiting until he is a UFA. If he wants to go that route, Flames will trade him for something. I just can't see him in the NHL today - guys are both big and fast, and though I think he has shown incredible progress defensively, I think he needs to improve his footspeed and probably add some strength to be able to handle the NHL better. His IQ? Definitely ready.
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For me, the most surprising part of his comment was that he had friends!

The flames have been a much better team overall in the last 15 games, though still hot and cold. I would say it's really only one pairing that is consistently under performing relative to expectations now and even Brodie and Hamonic are starting to mesh better.
 
turnagainoutlaw said:
Is there a chance that Fox signs this year?
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there is a lot of depth ahead of him on that Flames blue line...a lot of bodies he has to jump to make it. I see no reason why he doesn't sign this year unless he wants to play with Bode Wilde next year...Fox needs to get in the mix with the bodis ahead of him on the depth chart, but if he thinks he can wait a few years and go elsewhere for an easier path that might be something he is thinking as well.
 
AmericanDream said:
there is a lot of depth ahead of him on that Flames blue line...a lot of bodies he has to jump to make it. I see no reason why he doesn't sign this year unless he wants to play with Bode Wilde next year...Fox needs to get in the mix with the bodis ahead of him on the depth chart, but if he thinks he can wait a few years and go elsewhere for an easier path that might be something he is thinking as well.
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Wilde not going to Harvard
 
turnagainoutlaw said:
Is there a chance that Fox signs this year?
Click to expand...

Really doubt it, nobody is going to leave Harvard early to play in the AHL and he's not going to take Hamilton or Hamonic's spot. Then Stone is still there and Andersson is more than ready to step in as well.

Maybe if the Flames pull a Rangers-esque full rebuild at the draft then maybe.
 
Connor McDaigle said:
Really doubt it, nobody is going to leave Harvard early to play in the AHL and he's not going to take Hamilton or Hamonic's spot. Then Stone is still there and Andersson is more than ready to step in as well.

Maybe if the Flames pull a Rangers-esque full rebuild at the draft then maybe.
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Why would they be pulling a full rebuild?
 
His coach at Harvard just said he is “unique”. Compared him to Brian Leetch and Sergei Zubov. Pretty high praise.
 
tooji said:
So he could get a Harvard degree?
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He’s going to be a pro hockey player though. How many high profile players go for their full four years? Most are done after year 1 or 2.

Vesey was the only one I can think of (although it was Harvard). And I think Fox is a lot higher profile than Vesey
 
snipetype said:
He’s going to be a pro hockey player though. How many high profile players go for their full four years? Most are done after year 1 or 2.

Vesey was the only one I can think of (although it was Harvard). And I think Fox is a lot higher profile than Vesey
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I think it's more likely for a D-man to stay longer than a forward. He might try to accelerate his school in 3 years with summer school and stay the 3 years.
 
snipetype said:
He’s going to be a pro hockey player though. How many high profile players go for their full four years? Most are done after year 1 or 2.

Vesey was the only one I can think of (although it was Harvard). And I think Fox is a lot higher profile than Vesey
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Do you agree with the sentence below or not?

"If Fox was at any other college than Harvard, this would be a non-issue."
 
Maukkis said:
Do you agree with the sentence below or not?

"If Fox was at any other college than Harvard, this would be a non-issue."
Click to expand...

No because he’s an NHL caliber player and is only losing years on his playing career. He’s going to make millions of dollars playing hockey. He can always go back to school.

While a degree from Harvard is prestigious, it’s still only a Bachelor of Arts. It only gets you so far (I know I have one and a 3.8 GPA to boot). You need a masters or a professional degree in the modern job market. And say Fox is trying to join law school, most law schools look at a combo or your GPA and your LSAT (I know because I’ve been through the process). Where you went to school isn’t as important as it’s made out to be.
 
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