Rank These Goat Talents by Team Success

[GMR]

I don't discount it, the Red Wings had a legit dynasty with Howe. I'm just saying if we are going solely on the purpose of this thread I think you have to say Howe certainly had the opportunity to win more Cups than Orr. Definitely more time. There were anywhere from 12-18 teams during Orr's career. Both players could have won more Cups, but I think if you had to pick one to penalize more it is Howe.

Fair enough, but I thought this thread was talking about actual team accomplishments. Thus, the reasons for why Player A won more Cups than Player B aren't as relevant.

 

[Crosby2010]

Fair enough, but I thought this thread was talking about actual team accomplishments. Thus, the reasons for why Player A won more Cups than Player B aren't as relevant.

I guess you give Orr the benefit of the doubt here because he won more Cups per season per se. And the Bruins only missed the playoffs in his 1st year and that was it. Did it with more teams and less time. Could go either way of course. Howe didn't win after age 27, but made the Cup final 5 times afterwards.

 

[authentic]

Played less than a game on one of those cup win, terrible injury game 1.

More of a 3 win in 17 playoff run in 19 seasons really (if we stop counting after the 1966 playoff), winning it a bit less 1/6 of the time.

If we talk only about cups, Lemieux-Jagr winning 2 times when they did.... could have an argument over him.

Howe did lead (not co-lead) a cup winning teams in points a single time in his career, 1955 with one more point than Lindsay. Not sure about Richard, I think also once in 1958 (while it did in goals scored at least a couple of others times)

This is reinforcing to me (along with your recently posted adjusted playoff points thread) that my opinion of McDavid ahead of Howe for peak may be correct. Keeping in mind Howe’s overall game but also keeping in mind todays talent pool and strength of competition.

 

[Gorskyontario]

Taking into consideration how often they won, how often they choked, how good their teams were

Beliveau -> best player on 2 different dynasties.
Richard

Gretzky
Orr -> Boston was awful for like a decade before him
Howe -> His wings imploded in the 60s due to bad management
Lemieux -> bad choke jobs in 93,96, health held him back, like Orr completely rebuild a failed franchise
Crosby

Jagr
Hull / Ovechkin, Ironically 2 of the best goal scorers ever, who choked many times and won 1 cup each.



Mcdavid's career isn't close to over yet so I won't rank him. As it stands I would put him above Hull/Ovechkin. The oilers are a 2 man show.

Maybe I would swap Howe and Orr.

 

[daver]

I guess you give Orr the benefit of the doubt here because he won more Cups per season per se. And the Bruins only missed the playoffs in his 1st year and that was it. Did it with more teams and less time. Could go either way of course. Howe didn't win after age 27, but made the Cup final 5 times afterwards.

Ironically, you can argue that Howe was a better playoff performer during the Wing's four SCF losses in the '60s than he was during their four Cups.