Post-Game Talk: RANGERS @ Maple Leafs [mod warning post #378]

[chosen]

I rolled my eyes at that Tony tweet last night

Buchnevich is what he is.

Maybe the folks that don’t like him should re-adjust their expectations of him based on that.

It's not about liking or disliking. It's about evaluating a player based on results. Yeah, he might become a 1st-liner someday, but no player in the history of sports has had 4 seasons in a row of unlucky bounces, so maybe people should stop using that as an excuse.

 

[Mugless]

When something happens for 4 seasons, can it still be bad puck luck?

Yup. He's got warning track power.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

It's not about liking or disliking. It's about evaluating a player based on results. Yeah, he might become a 1st-liner someday, but no player in the history of sports has had 4 seasons in a row of unlucky bounces, so maybe people should stop using that as an excuse.

His results are driving offense consistently and getting anywhere from 35-45 points a year

I’m not seeing an issue. He is a prototypical middle 6 forward in this league

I’m confused what you’re expecting of him. If he was putting up 20 points a season I can understand the complaints but he’s not.

 

[chosen]

His results are driving offense consistently and getting anywhere from 35-45 points a year

I’m not seeing an issue. He is a prototypical middle 6 forward in this league

I’m confused what you’re expecting of him. If he was putting up 20 points a season I can understand the complaints but he’s not.

I'm getting what I expect from him, but people who think he's been getting bad bounces for 4 seasons make no sense to me and this evaluation is becoming tiresome. Very few forwards become much better offensively once they are 24, so we probably have what we are going to have.

As for moving him, it's the same as it is for every player. If you get a deal you like, you do it. If not, you don't.

 

[NYRangers0723]

I'm getting what I expect from him, but people who think he's been getting bad bounces for 4 seasons make no sense to me and this evaluation is becoming tiresome. Very few forwards become much better offensively once they are 24, so we probably have what we are going to have.

As for moving him, it's the same as it is for every player. If you get a deal you like, you do it. If not, you don't.

Agreed. For a third round pick I’m very happy with Buch. But I’ve accepted this is what he is at this point

 

[Kovalev27]

Panarin Mika Chytil Kakko Kreider Kravtsov is my top 6 the next 5 to 6 years anyone else is replaceable or tradeable. If Strome wants to sign a team friendly deal by all means he can be part of that core but I’m not moving Kreider so I can give Buchy and or Strome big time raises over what they currently make

 

[kovazub94]

I’m going to pretend you aren’t comparing Kovalev to Buchnevich no no no no no.

Is this what you got from this? I was comparing the specific situation where the fanbase (and coaching staff and the player himself) experienced frustration from wanting more production based on skills exhibited. The same was happening over 20 years ago with Kovalev, unless you forgotten.

 

[Kovalev27]

By the way did you guys see Chytil defending that lead late in the game? He was tremendous. He’s going to round out to be a hell of a 2 way center. He may be better than Mika is right now defensively by age 21 or 22.

 

[Blue Blooded]

Panarin Mika Chytil Kakko Kreider Kravtsov is my top 6 the next 5 to 6 years anyone else is replaceable or tradeable. If Strome wants to sign a team friendly deal by all means he can be part of that core but I’m not moving Kreider so I can give Buchy and or Strome big time raises over what they currently make

Kreider's extension has "2016 UFA" written all over it unfortunately. I love Kreider and I think his contributions have been greatly underrated, but I'm not sure how much longer he can keep it up and as we saw at the start of this season - when he isn't 100% it can get ugly pretty fast.

 

[Kovalev27]

Is this what you got from this? I was comparing the specific situation where the fanbase (and coaching staff and the player himself) experienced frustration from wanting more production based on skills exhibited. The same was happening over 20 years ago with Kovalev, unless you forgotten.

I mean there just isn’t much comparison.

I totally understand what you mean about being frustrated by production but Buch is going to be 25 soon. He has never been able to step up as a top forward and produce. This is who he is. He’s a middle 6 winger who makes 3.5 mil and in a year will want 5 mil plus. There’s no way I’m paying him that. He is not going to be Kovalev. So if I have to trade a legit top line player in Kreider so I can accommodate Buchnevich who id be shocked if he’s still in the league with his work habits into his late 20s early 30s, I’m not doing it. That’s all I’m saying

 

[Kovalev27]

Kreider's extension has "2016 UFA" written all over it unfortunately. I love Kreider and I think his contributions have been greatly underrated, but I'm not sure how much longer he can keep it up and as we saw at the start of this season - when he isn't 100% it can get ugly pretty fast.

what part of Kreiders freak atheleticism speed strength and power do you think is going to disappear anytime soon? Honestly the guy is a friggen machine. He’s not going to fall apart in a couple years. Guys that skate like that play forever. It’s guys that have bad work habits or who barely could keep up in the first place skating wise they lose a step and fall off a cliff. Like an Andrew Ladd. That’s not Kreider. Not even close. He’ll be flying around the ice well into his mid 30s

 

[will1066]

Strome is making it very hard to trade him - the chemistry seems real - he also obviously is talented he went in the top ten in his draft.

I’ll take the win but hopefully our coaches can work on a way to lessen the shot total. Also big save by Price G right before the goal on the other end - if not this thread would be much different.

Trade Kreider, George and look to keeping Fast, Strome ADA

It's real, man.

 

[SML2]

So Buchnevich has pts in 1 of his last 15 games playing all with Panarin or Mika and he keeps getting rewarded with mins? Didn’t Kakko lose a top 6 spot for only putting up assists in those spots?

this is the guy to move.

I'm done with him. He is such a hard player to like. He always looks like his freaking dog died. One of my all time least favorite Rangers was Darren Turcotte. Every shift he comes to the bench with some grimace on his face like he's dying a painful death because he got whacked or whatever. It gets old. Whatever the hell the conversation was that forced that horrifying look on Buchnevich's face last night did it for me. Hopefully it was something along the lines of "you should have asked Santa for luggage. You are out of here."

 

[will1066]

Yup. He's got warning track power.

This is a great analogy

 

[will1066]

I'm done with him. He is such a hard player to like. He always looks like his freaking dog died. One of my all time least favorite Rangers was Darren Turcotte. Every shift he comes to the bench with some grimace on his face like he's dying a painful death because he got whacked or whatever. It gets old. Whatever the hell the conversation was that forced that horrifying look on Buchnevich's face last night did it for me. Hopefully it was something along the lines of "you should have asked Santa for luggage. You are out of here."

I find his faces amusing. They're unique to him.

 

[SML2]

Is this what you got from this? I was comparing the specific situation where the fanbase (and coaching staff and the player himself) experienced frustration from wanting more production based on skills exhibited. The same was happening over 20 years ago with Kovalev, unless you forgotten.

On his worst day Kovalev was 10 times the player Buchnevich is.

 

[will1066]

what part of Kreiders freak atheleticism speed strength and power do you think is going to disappear anytime soon? Honestly the guy is a friggen machine. He’s not going to fall apart in a couple years. Guys that skate like that play forever. It’s guys that have bad work habits or who barely could keep up in the first place skating wise they lose a step and fall off a cliff. Like an Andrew Ladd. That’s not Kreider. Not even close. He’ll be flying around the ice well into his mid 30s

Remember his blood clotting condition? He's not invincible. Pre-existing condition can manifest. He's on the best medication, I'm sure.

 

[Mac n Gs]

When something happens for 4 seasons, can it still be bad puck luck?

Is it really 4 years? Buchnevich has never played this well as an all-around player until late this year under Quinn. And besides, if he can maintain these types of impacts while scoring 45-55 points, he'll still be better than he was under AV when he was scoring 40-45 points. I still see similar offensive outputs with improved on-ice impacts as a positive development for him. I don't think he's getting enough credit for just how good he's been defensively lately. We never used to praise Buch for making good defensive plays.

 

[romba]

By the way did you guys see Chytil defending that lead late in the game? He was tremendous. He’s going to round out to be a hell of a 2 way center. He may be better than Mika is right now defensively by age 21 or 22.

You know Zbad is ALREADY an elite 2 way center, and Chytil should hopefully round out into one. Definitely not on Zbads level yet, not even close. Developing beautifully though, but we don’t need to deflate Zbad to inflate Chytil

 

[RangerLifer]

On his worst day Kovalev was 10 times the player Buchnevich is.

I'd say at least 100.

 

[Kovalev27]

You know Zbad is ALREADY an elite 2 way center, and Chytil should hopefully round out into one. Definitely not on Zbads level yet, not even close. Developing beautifully though, but we don’t need to deflate Zbad to inflate Chytil

did you read at all what I actually wrote?

I said by the time he’s 21 22 he may be better defensively than Mika is now. I only said defensively and I only said in a couple years. In no way did I say he is better than Mika.

 

[RangerLifer]

Remember his blood clotting condition? He's not invincible. Pre-existing condition can manifest. He's on the best medication, I'm sure.

That was because of the extra bone in his clavicle or whatever it was called. It's been fixed. He isn't on any blood thinners.

 

[Kovalev27]

Kreider ripped that bone out himself didn’t even need it. Decided it made him faster without it.

 

[kovazub94]

Is it really 4 years? Buchnevich has never played this well as an all-around player until late this year under Quinn. And besides, if he can maintain these types of impacts while scoring 45-55 points, he'll still be better than he was under AV when he was scoring 40-45 points. I still see similar offensive outputs with improved on-ice impacts as a positive development for him. I don't think he's getting enough credit for just how good he's been defensively lately. We never used to praise Buch for making good defensive plays.

There’s a reason why coaching staff keeps putting him on top line even with his recent productions slump. If his game or effort were suffering elsewhere as it was prior to the turnaround last February he’d be finding himself stapled to the forth line in no time.

 

[will1066]

That was because of the extra bone in his clavicle or whatever it was called. It's been fixed. He isn't on any blood thinners.

Touche.

But how do you explain his unnaturally long neck? Hmmm?