Post-Game Talk: Rangers @ Canes

[mas0764]

99 percent of coaches let their star player play with who they are comfortable with.

Even when it’s not working?

 

[mas0764]

Plenty of people here have likened the Rangers to cup contenders this season.

It’s their entire basis for giving up prime assets to rent.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Wasn't referring to your predictions, but your demeanor. You're two different posters, one during the GDTs & another the morning after. Nobody can deny your passion or your fandom & I find it entertaining.

I used to get as emotional as you do in my early 20s. There was no forum for me to advertise my insanity for all to see at that point in time, luckily.

Thanks. Too bad I'm in my mid 30s and still get emotional.

 

[chosen]

Who influences that, though? Panarin. Hea a fun scorer. Plays fun hockey. Fun guy. Enigmatic personality. Attempts a backhand 50-foot pass from the blue line on a cycle play against a good defensive team last night. Not the guy I'd go to war in the playoffs with.

Panarin was by far the best player on the ice when Columbus swept Tampa Bay in the playoffs in 2019.

When Columbus lost in 7 to Washington, Panarin was easily the best player in that series.

In 30 playoff games. He has 28 points.

Yeah, he really sucks in the playoffs.

 

[will1066]

Panarin was by far the best player on the ice when Columbus swept Tampa Bay in the playoffs in 2019.

When Columbus lost in 7 to Washington, Panarin was easily the best player in that series.

In 30 playoff games. He has 28 points.

Yeah, he really sucks in the playoffs.

I'd rather focus on the here-and-now than look back at history. Also convenient of you to leave out the play-in round performance if you are using historical references.

 

[chosen]

Kreider has been, by far, our best forward. That line has been held back by Zibs. Zibs, like the rest of the team, just isn't engaged. He's been better, as of late but he's not where he needs to be or where he has been in the past. Everyone is slow, watches the puck and reactive.. which leads to us chasing the play. Our forecheck is just as bad as our transition/puck movement/puck support. There's so many things wrong with this team 5v5.

We can't get the puck out of our own zone with possession and/or, god forbid, speed. Even if the player has talent like Fox, there is literally no where to go with the puck to maintain possession and spring the breakout. We do not use the middle of the ice. We do not support the puck. There is so much wrong with this team 5v5. It beyond personnel. We have some of the best talent in the world and they have been atrocious 5v5. This isn't something relegated to 1 or 2 lines.

We need to re-evalutae the X's and O's. There needs to be a better plan put in place. There needs to be some for of tactics and system to propel the players. 'Just play and work harder' is half of it. A team like Carolina does that in spades AS WELL as being light years ahead of us tactically. Everyone knows their roles and what their teammates are doing at any given time.

It was AV's fault.

It was Quinn's fault.

Now, it's Gallant's fault.

Some fans are consistent.

 

[chosen]

What did we expect, Quinn didn’t even give them PP time when we were out of the POs?

Ask me 5 years ago what would happen if you drafted a player 1-2 overall, brought them to the NHL but didn’t give them any PP minutes, and I would have said yiikes that is risky, yada yada yada. Why? Because it’s super obvious that it is if you have followed the NHL for three decades.

Why didn’t Gorton react? Why didn’t JD react? Not acceptable.

Kakko and Laf are underperforming because of coaching?

The excuses served up for players are utterly amazing.

 

[chosen]

I'd rather focus on the here-and-now than look back at history. Also convenient of you to leave out the play-in round performance if you are using historical references.

So, your one example is more important than his career performances? That's an absurd way to pass judgment on a player.

Who on the Rangers in the play-ins overachieved or even achieved?

That team got destroyed.

 

[will1066]

So, your one example is more important than his career performances? That's an absurd way to pass judgment on a player.

Who on the Rangers in the play-ins overachieved or even achieved?

That team got destroyed.

I'm basing on what I'm seeing of his style of play in his three years here so far. I offered the most recent example since you're looking to play historical references with me. I've also read other people's comments that Panarin in Columbus or Chicago didn't play the way he plays now. Why is his game/style evolving in such the way that exists today when most teams' recipe for success in today's league is play heavy and attack the net? When was the last time Panarin even attempted a shot inside the dots? It's all three pointers from long range.

 

[chosen]

I'm basing on what I'm seeing of his style of play in his three years here so far. I offered the most recent example since you're looking to play historical references with me. I've also read other people's comments that Panarin in Columbus or Chicago didn't play the way he plays now.

Why not just admit that that entire Rangers team got smoked by Carolina?

No one player can elevate a shit team.

That's Panarin's total Rangers post-season experience and from that your conclusion is that he is now a crappy playoff performer. That makes zero sense.

 

[chosen]

I'm basing on what I'm seeing of his style of play in his three years here so far. I offered the most recent example since you're looking to play historical references with me. I've also read other people's comments that Panarin in Columbus or Chicago didn't play the way he plays now. Why is his game/style evolving in such the way that exists today when most teams' recipe for success in today's league is play heavy and attack the net? When was the last time Panarin even attempted a shot inside the dots? It's all three pointers from long range.

First you said it was about the playoffs. Now, it's about how he has played as a Ranger.

He has had the best stats of his entire career in a Rangers uniform, but his performance has deteriorated as a Ranger?

That makes no sense.

 

[will1066]

Why not just admit that that entire Rangers team got smoked by Carolina?

No one player can elevate a shit team.

That's Panarin's total Rangers post-season experience and from that your conclusion is that he is now a crappy playoff performer. That makes zero sense.

What to Make of Artemiy Panarin’s Early-Season Struggles

My point is he's trending the wrong way. That doesn't mean he can't, and hopefully he does as the season continues toward the playoffs.

 

[will1066]

First you said it was about the playoffs. Now, it's about how he has played as a Ranger.

He has had the best stats of his entire career in a Rangers uniform, but his performance has deteriorated as a Ranger?

That makes no sense.

It's fine with me if you refuse to see what's in front of as you continue to rely on previous year perfomance. Good day to you.

 

[Cmox]

I think Geo played fine but like others my issue is the team holds back a ton when he’s starting. Its like they’re scared. Its a complete mental fault and they're all to blame. I wonder if this has been brought up privately? Is it a confidence issue? Whatever it is definitely needs to be addressed.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

To be fair to Gallant, he tried Kakko with Strome and Panarin. He tried Chytil. It wasn't Hunt there all game. There was still no spark whoever was there in that spot.

And the best he played all season was with Strome and Panarin. Then an injury or COVID forced him to switch it up and he refuses to go back to it.

 

[leetch99]

That’s why coaches should be in charge and players shouldn’t be.

BINGO !

 

[CLW]

It's heavily sided to the system or the execution of it. Yes, there's room for improvement when you have Hunt in your top6 but this team is so bad at 5v5.

It's predominantly a teamwork/teamplay issue. No one creates space/lanes. No one supports the puck. No one attacks. No one gets to scoring areas. If I had to guess our gameplan is be slow, react and chase the play. This might be the worst Rangers team that I can remember 5v5. It's a failure because the 'system' or the execution of the system is a failure. There's a major disconnect. I get Gallant is not a major X's and O's guy but that is what we need.

If the personnel is not executing the gameplan, something drastic needs to change. Our front office needs to get their head out of their asses and take the necessary steps. It's been the same song since covid hit... Prior to covid, this team and our 'stars' were playing a relentless and aggressive brand of hockey that Quinn preached.... WTF is going on

There was one play where a D deep in the Rangers' zone played a puck up to Kakko on the boards who had made himself available for an out pass, Kakko immediately had a checker on him but managed to get the puck out 3 feet to Zib who was IN SUPPORT of the puck carrier - Zib sprang Kreider who had speed to take the puck up the ice and shoot. Krieder hit the bar, but that play showed what the Rangers need to do as a group. Play with speed in transition, support the puck carrier and find space for the puck.

The winger supported the D, the C supported the winger, the C set up the other winger for a fast counter attack. Too often the forwards are just milling around aimlessly in the D zone, and the D are too slow to pick up where to move the puck - this is one area where Florida and the Canes are miles and miles ahead in execution on a nightly basis. Fix this and a lot of the 5v5 problems will go away. Watch Florida and you see the forwards are keeping their feet moving in the D zone as much as possible so they can spring the transition WITH SPEED & SUPPORT as soon as the team gets the puck.

The team needs to organize the D zone, have an understanding how to move the puck through the neutral zone and a plan for offense in the o-zone. The Canes were far superior in all three of those areas last night. It's annoying to me because I had hoped Gallant would fix these issues that are lingering from the Quinn days. It's an X and O issue because other teams, with similar or lower talent level, are able to execute them. As a Florida fan told us, the Panthers' players LOVED Quenneville because he fixed those issues for them.

 

[Larrybiv]

f*** you Gorton for getting rid of TDA, you utter cancer to this organization. And f*** you Gallant for starting Georgiev you f***ing imbecile. The average 5 year old would have started Shesterkin.

Gorton got rid of a "cancer" and a good 5v5 when teams didnt know how to defense the Rangers with either Fox or Tony on.
(Pick one to really defend against)
Gorton's cure for cancer is clearly one metro teams loss and another metro teams GAIN! He did well with trades and player moves in general......but ruling with an IRON HAND doesnt always work in your favor. (Tony, Vitali & even Lias) C'mon!!!

Hurricane interviews POSTGAME......teammates made it a POINT to mention what a good player Tony is, that sees the ice and a tenacity for being sneaky, and what a GREAT GUY and TEAMMATE who is funny and keeps things light IN THE LR and they're so lucky to have him.

Jesper does what he does and has 9 goals! Who on our 3rd line has 9 goals? Did we EVER see Jesper blast from the red line? NO!
Brady is top 2 pairing (albeit with a GREAT Jacob Slavin)
And......who wouldn't prefer Smitty over Nemeth? Who?

The Canes are such a pathetic organization that they exumed our "leftovers and cancers" to help produce a very POSSIBLE CUP oriented team. Also, I would take Raanta anyday over the REAL CANCER in Georgiev.

Yeah, what a CANCER. We found out that GEORGIEV was really the CANCER by not supporting Shesty, now........didn't we?
But, we wouldn't have been able to afford Tony now right? So, that was equivalent to a "last chance" for Tony. Turned out it was Gorton & J.D's "last chance. And they blew it, big time.
Answer the phone next time. Haba. Tony got the last laugh when they got fired, now didn't he?

 

[Larrybiv]

Honest to God, short of raping/killing someone I don't give a f*** what TDA does. these guys aren't role models to me, I want to win.

Super like and couldn't have said it better. Some of the BEST teams in sports history were a bunch of bad ass misfits that were jettisoned because they didnt toe the line.
Look at the Mets best winning era. A bunch of party'ers, cokeheads, throw em' down fighters.
The Steelers......hate them, but.....etc. etc.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Super like and couldn't have said it better. Some of the BEST teams in sports history were a bunch of bad ass misfits that were jettisoned because they didnt toe the line.
Look at the Mets best winning era. A bunch of party'ers, cokeheads, throw em' down fighters.
The Steelers......hate them, but.....etc. etc.

Lots of virtue signaling because he said something bad in juniors. I can't find single f*** to give. Also, even if he is a racist shithead, he shouldn't ever play in the NHL again? He's not burning crosses on lawns. Oh and everyone loved Avery who was a far bigger shithead and a far worse player.

 

[Ned Braden]

The team is still riddled with holes. No top 6 rws, no 3c, no 5d.

I get your point, but "riddled" with holes is probably a bit too far. As I see it, the team has two holes that need to be upgraded. One of them will require a bit of a decision on philosophy...and some people aren't going to like it if it happens.

The first hole is easy. Nemeth isn't a terrible defenseman, but the rangers need a puck mover in that spot. Either trade for one or give it to Jones.

The other upgrade is two parts and kind of requires the rangers to make the decision that the core of Shesterkin, Fox, Panarin, Zib, Kreider, and Trouba is good enough to build around to win a cup now...future be damned. And let's face it, every other truly contending team is thinking now...not 3 years from now.

First, Laf needs to go down. He's quite simply the least valuable player on the team (even when McKegg plays). The kid does nothing particularly well, and you can't have that type of player on a contending team just for optics or experience...not if this is about winning now. Maybe he'll find his game in the AHL.

Second, Kakko needs to be in a bottom six, defensive forward role. While this would be disappointing viewed through the lens of the second overall pick, he is a good defensive forward and can offer value there to a contending team.

Obviously, the Laf hole in the lineup needs to be plugged. I would try to do that with someone like JT Miller, and use him below as an example of what the lineup could look like if the rangers do this.

Kreider Zib Chytil
Panarin Strome Miller
Kakko Goodrow Gautier
Reaves Rooney Hunt

Lindgren Fox
Miller Trouba
Schneider Jones

I realize this puts Kakko on his off wing. I think he can do that...if he can't, welcome to the third line Morgan Barron. The top two lines are dangerous, difficult matchups. The bottom two lines are heavy, defensively responsible, and have enough offensive talent to pop some goals in the games that matter. Miller and Jones massively upgrade the second power play.

 

[duhmetreE]

There was one play where a D deep in the Rangers' zone played a puck up to Kakko on the boards who had made himself available for an out pass, Kakko immediately had a checker on him but managed to get the puck out 3 feet to Zib who was IN SUPPORT of the puck carrier - Zib sprang Kreider who had speed to take the puck up the ice and shoot. Krieder hit the bar, but that play showed what the Rangers need to do as a group. Play with speed in transition, support the puck carrier and find space for the puck.

The winger supported the D, the C supported the winger, the C set up the other winger for a fast counter attack. Too often the forwards are just milling around aimlessly in the D zone, and the D are too slow to pick up where to move the puck - this is one area where Florida and the Canes are miles and miles ahead in execution on a nightly basis. Fix this and a lot of the 5v5 problems will go away. Watch Florida and you see the forwards are keeping their feet moving in the D zone as much as possible so they can spring the transition WITH SPEED & SUPPORT as soon as the team gets the puck.

The team needs to organize the D zone, have an understanding how to move the puck through the neutral zone and a plan for offense in the o-zone. The Canes were far superior in all three of those areas last night. It's annoying to me because I had hoped Gallant would fix these issues that are lingering from the Quinn days. It's an X and O issue because other teams, with similar or lower talent level, are able to execute them. As a Florida fan told us, the Panthers' players LOVED Quenneville because he fixed those issues for them.

Exactly how I see it. Carolina and Florida are relentlessly moving but with a purpose and a plan. There's a scheme/system they are following and they understand their roles and what comes next. Almost what you'd expect a professional hockey team to look like.

I do not see our team moving with purpose or intent. There's no structure to our movements and/or thought process. It's infuriating to watch especially when it's contrasted with teams like Florida and Carolina.

 

[CLW]

Exactly how I see it. Carolina and Florida are relentlessly moving but with a purpose and a plan. There's a scheme/system they are following and they understand their roles and what comes next. Almost what you'd expect a professional hockey team to look like.

I do not see our team moving with purpose or intent. There's no structure to our movements and/or thought process. It's infuriating to watch especially when it's contrasted with teams like Florida and Carolina.

Yep, I was watching those teams during the Quinn days and wondering why the Rangers were so lacking. I hoped Gallant would fix that. It's still early days but Gallant saying he would use the same 'system' used by Quinn is not encouraging. Improvement is a must.

Time for an X and O upgrade for the front office and coaches. X & O 2.0 please. Running Win 95 isn't cutting it anymore.