Prospect Info: Quinton Byfield (2nd Overall 2020 Draft) Discussion part II

  • Work is still on-going to rebuild the site styling and features. Please report any issues you may experience so we can look into it. Click Here for Updates
Glad to see he's progressing but on a 6-goal pace over 82 games, especially considering he's locked onto Anze's wing is concerning.

I'm not worried about it in the slightest. We all know he's not a career 3% shooter. This is simply a guy deferring to two other shooters, one who is suddenly on pace for 40g.

He'll need to work on his shot but this is part of the progression, not his fate.
 
I'm not worried about it in the slightest. We all know he's not a career 3% shooter. This is simply a guy deferring to two other shooters, one who is suddenly on pace for 40g.

He'll need to work on his shot but this is part of the progression, not his fate.

Of course it doesn't mean he's doomed as a goal scorer, but 2 EV goals in 42 games playing with the guys he's playing with is very underwhelming no matter how optimistic you want to be.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BigBrown
Not too shabby:

During 5v5 play since December 31, Byfield ranks fifth in the NHL in assists per 60 minutes with 2.2 among players with at least 200 minutes played, according to Natural Stat Trick. Just ahead of superstars Nathan MacKinnon (2.19) and Sidney Crosby (2.19)...

Prior to Quinton Byfield joining them on the LA Kings’ top line, Kopitar scored at a rate of 0.65 goals per 60 minutes during 5v5 (8th on the team) and Kempe at a rate of 0.93 (4th on the team). Now with Byfield on the left side, Kopitar has seen his 5v5 scoring rate improve to 1.32 goals per 60 minutes (2nd on the team) and Kempe to 1.53 (1st on the team).

The trio is one of the best lines in the NHL since their inception, outscoring their opponents 26-9 when on the ice. That 74.3% goal share is good enough for second among lines with at least 200 minutes played together, according to MoneyPuck.com.
 
It's no coincidence that Kempe doubled his scoring once he started playing with Kopitar. He was playing with him about 20% of the time prior to 2021-2022. That year and this year he's playing with him over 80% of the time.

You're starting to see similar outcomes with Byfield.

For another example of this phenomenon see the following: Brown, Dustin

Until QB is the one driving the play and the one mostly responsible for the results of that 1st line, I'd be cautious about heaping the results on his shoulders. His play has improved, but he still has a long ways to go.
If you look at the recent article I just posted, it is actually Byfield that is driving a lot of the chances and elevating the games of Kopitar and Kempe. Look at their stats before Byfield joined that line. You're right about Kopitar, though. He's such a strong all-around player and Kempe is obviously the biggest scoring threat on the ice again this season for the Kings.
 
If you look at the recent article I just posted, it is actually Byfield that is driving a lot of the chances and elevating the games of Kopitar and Kempe. Look at their stats before Byfield joined that line. You're right about Kopitar, though. He's such a strong all-around player and Kempe is obviously the biggest scoring threat on the ice again this season for the Kings.
Exactly, QB is not a passenger on that line. All of the numbers overwhelmingly show that he's a catalyst. Of course, there's synergy of Kopi elevating QB, but Kopi and Kempe's numbers without QB aren't anywhere near as good than with him.
 
Not too shabby:

During 5v5 play since December 31, Byfield ranks fifth in the NHL in assists per 60 minutes with 2.2 among players with at least 200 minutes played, according to Natural Stat Trick. Just ahead of superstars Nathan MacKinnon (2.19) and Sidney Crosby (2.19)...

Prior to Quinton Byfield joining them on the LA Kings’ top line, Kopitar scored at a rate of 0.65 goals per 60 minutes during 5v5 (8th on the team) and Kempe at a rate of 0.93 (4th on the team). Now with Byfield on the left side, Kopitar has seen his 5v5 scoring rate improve to 1.32 goals per 60 minutes (2nd on the team) and Kempe to 1.53 (1st on the team).

The trio is one of the best lines in the NHL since their inception, outscoring their opponents 26-9 when on the ice. That 74.3% goal share is good enough for second among lines with at least 200 minutes played together, according to MoneyPuck.com.
Do you all think some of this is that 2nd line is getting the harder defensive assignments? Remember what TM said after that game in Carolina...Edit: and btw, I think that is the wise move, because Danault is a shutdown center, and Kopi legs were wearing out.. best use of the resources I say
 
Last edited:
Of course it doesn't mean he's doomed as a goal scorer, but 2 EV goals in 42 games playing with the guys he's playing with is very underwhelming no matter how optimistic you want to be.

Sure I'd like to see a better ratio, but you initially said it's 'concerning.' Underwhelming, I can stomach. But now that the production is happening and it's overwhelmingly funneling goals to Anze and Adrian while assists (primary, too) to QB. I just don't see the current's low goal #s as a harbinger of the future is all.

if Kopi wouldn't have whiffed on an empty net last night, QB is looking at a 3 assist game and we're still here going "man, he's just scratching the surface." I see that as it bodes well rather than any sign of trouble. It gives him something to clearly work on--shot and release and assertiveness pertaining to both.
 
Sure I'd like to see a better ratio, but you initially said it's 'concerning.' Underwhelming, I can stomach. But now that the production is happening and it's overwhelmingly funneling goals to Anze and Adrian while assists (primary, too) to QB. I just don't see the current's low goal #s as a harbinger of the future is all.

if Kopi wouldn't have whiffed on an empty net last night, QB is looking at a 3 assist game and we're still here going "man, he's just scratching the surface." I see that as it bodes well rather than any sign of trouble. It gives him something to clearly work on--shot and release and assertiveness pertaining to both.
If you look at QB youth and junior history, it wasnt exactly Allison/Thornton A to G ratio.. 2 years in Sudbury: 29g 32a and 32g 50a... I would hope a similar ratio when he figures it out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JeanBlanc
I'm sure the success has a lot of factors, which includes having to be less of a shut-down role.
Yes - i dont want to take anything away from the success - but also important to factor that in.. i think that is also why Kopi may be a little fresher... but i think most of it goes to how QB has found a role on that line
 
  • Like
Reactions: King'sPawn
Even the most bitter hater can see a marked improvement in his game. It's just a question now of how much and at what pace further improvement will be.

He's going to start to get a target on him by playing more physical and being an important contributor. Will be interesting to see how he handles that because he has been prone to milking things a bit so far in his pro career (high sticks etc.).
 
He's playing the role JW used to play for the 1st line.. digging pucks out, making smart little passes. Also doing all the little things the coaches want... its pretty cool
Even better was his little Kadri accidentally, on purpose troll bump. Just his overall total game engagement is picking up and that's a really great thing to see.
 
Even better was his little Kadri accidentally, on purpose troll bump. Just his overall total game engagement is picking up and that's a really great thing to see.

he had his run in with Hedman earlier in the season as well...once he gets man strength he is going to be dominant player. I like seeing a bit of edge out of him on occasion.
 
So, I have some thoughts on the whole Byfield vs. Stutzle debate and some of them have already been brought up but bear with me as I am trying to get to a certain point.

First off, I was in the camp that had a very difficult time choosing which one I would rather have for the Kings in 2020. I think it is safe to say that Stutzle was seen to be the one that has a good upside and is likely to be more productive in the shorter term whereas Byfield had higher upside with bigger bust potential and the upside would be theoretically reached on a longer timeframe. I was quite ok with the pick considering where we were-a team with several remaining Cup winners that was racking up young pieces. Positionally, we had an aging Kopitar, an injured Vilardi and Turcotte who was projected to be a good piece but not clear cut #1C upside.

The issue I see behind this whole debate has to do with the selection, trajectory, team objective and development. I still don't have a problem with the selection and how this has progressed. It's quite understandable for people to be satisfied having a player that has progressed quite nicely like Stutzle and to be envious of that when their player is progressing slowly. To be clear, I do see Stutzle outproducing what people may have originally expected and Byfield may be coming along a bit slower. With that said, I don't see the path for the 2 deviating to far from the mean from what was expected when also considering the deployment.

The area I find to be most troublesome is the team objective and deployment. As much as people talk about taking the BPA in the draft, I think there is a time when that might not necessarily be the best answer. Putting together a team has become a lot more complex with salary cap, age/timeframe, drafting, trading, etc. Teams need a good mix of ELCs/pre-breakout players to compliment the veterans on higher AAVs which has created a greater trend for early draft picks to make the NHL earlier-and thereby putting more value on draft picks in trades. With Blake's messaging regarding the core 4, the main courses were going to be 1. Try to contend with the core before they taper off 2. Let them be the mentors to the younger group until they ride off into the sunset and have a bit more of a deliberate torch passing. From my view, it looks like we were on course 1 and diverted to course 2 which I sense a bit of an unclear direction-to be fair, the pandemic didn't help and Drew's comments about wanting to get back to playing meaningful games may do that (but did you expect him to just sit along for a long rebuild?).

The beginning of the 2020/21 season had us thrust Vilardi into the 2C. Instead of letting him have more than a year to grow into the position, Blake goes out and gets Danault and puts Vilardi in Ontario and changes him from C to W. Surely that was a good boost to his confidence /sarcasm. Not only do we get Danault but we also get Arvidsson plugging 2 top 6 spots in one offseason. The 2 have been good players for us and has contributed greatly but it was a quick turn on the youth gathering process-which I also understand is not necessarily meant to be all used directly for the roster. The success of these 2 combined with a breakout year for Kempe and a resurgence from Quick leads us into the playoffs and here we are this season, with expectations to compete and we bring in Kevin Fiala to add further to the top 6 (I know he doesn't always play there). If we had this type of timeframe and agenda, it might have made more sense to draft a guy like Stutzle but we also have an inherent problem.

So, where I am getting at is: 1. we have a bunch of young promising players who can't crack the lineup 2. for those that have cracked the lineup, the spot that they would be suited for is unavailable 3. we are not at a stage to nurture nor have we been very good at developing. I believe that this is in large part because of a lack of a clear plan. Prospects retain value for a couple years but beyond that, if the players hasn't made it yet, they start to depreciate. Todd is expected to win games at this point and he leans on veterans. Blake is not really forcing Todd to use some of the younger players either-clear case in point Sean Walker. It doesn't really make a lot of sense for the team to help retain value on veterans at the expense of the prospects because they lose development years and value too if using for trades but Blake hasn't addressed this. Depth is great but after a certain point, it's poor asset management. The deployment issue roots from the thought that unless you're Connor McDavid, AHL is good for you. That's almost like saying only Einstein is fit to skip a grade in school (I'm using Einstein as the symbol of genius and not for his prowess in school). And what are we developing at the AHL level? 2-way play and being hard on pucks? That is important but it's essentially a requirement to see any NHL action with the Kings (props to Kaliyev for adding that element-definitely was not his game). It feels like we are trying to create a puzzle that has all square pieces. Fiala is possibly an exception but this is a player that was developed elsewhere. We can highlight some of the hits but I question whether we have really gotten the best out of our prospects.

We haven't had massive hits with our own offensive prospects. Kopitar is probably the only one. If you look at how he developed, he came into the league with Marc Crawford as coach. He was not the most defensive minded coach. Some of his former players in Vancouver and Colorado really blossomed offensively during his time. It's probably not coincidence that Kopitar, Brown, Cammalleri and Frolov had one of their best offensive outputs during the Crawford years. The defense would come later under Terry Murray. Kopitar was probably talented enough to have flourished under either an offensive minded coach or a defensive minded coach but it might have been quite beneficial for a guy like Brown. Just dominating juniors or the minors isn't exactly the way to produce an offensive player. Need to let them try to do that at the NHL level too but it almost feels like we tame that before they get there.

I've written for too long. But the question is 1. Was Byfield what we needed at the time of the draft? 2. Would Stutzle have been what he is with the Kings? 3. Do we have an issue with development? 4. Do we have a plan?
 
  • Like
Reactions: King'sPawn
So, I have some thoughts on the whole Byfield vs. Stutzle debate and some of them have already been brought up but bear with me as I am trying to get to a certain point.

First off, I was in the camp that had a very difficult time choosing which one I would rather have for the Kings in 2020. I think it is safe to say that Stutzle was seen to be the one that has a good upside and is likely to be more productive in the shorter term whereas Byfield had higher upside with bigger bust potential and the upside would be theoretically reached on a longer timeframe. I was quite ok with the pick considering where we were-a team with several remaining Cup winners that was racking up young pieces. Positionally, we had an aging Kopitar, an injured Vilardi and Turcotte who was projected to be a good piece but not clear cut #1C upside.

The issue I see behind this whole debate has to do with the selection, trajectory, team objective and development. I still don't have a problem with the selection and how this has progressed. It's quite understandable for people to be satisfied having a player that has progressed quite nicely like Stutzle and to be envious of that when their player is progressing slowly. To be clear, I do see Stutzle outproducing what people may have originally expected and Byfield may be coming along a bit slower. With that said, I don't see the path for the 2 deviating to far from the mean from what was expected when also considering the deployment.

The area I find to be most troublesome is the team objective and deployment. As much as people talk about taking the BPA in the draft, I think there is a time when that might not necessarily be the best answer. Putting together a team has become a lot more complex with salary cap, age/timeframe, drafting, trading, etc. Teams need a good mix of ELCs/pre-breakout players to compliment the veterans on higher AAVs which has created a greater trend for early draft picks to make the NHL earlier-and thereby putting more value on draft picks in trades. With Blake's messaging regarding the core 4, the main courses were going to be 1. Try to contend with the core before they taper off 2. Let them be the mentors to the younger group until they ride off into the sunset and have a bit more of a deliberate torch passing. From my view, it looks like we were on course 1 and diverted to course 2 which I sense a bit of an unclear direction-to be fair, the pandemic didn't help and Drew's comments about wanting to get back to playing meaningful games may do that (but did you expect him to just sit along for a long rebuild?).

The beginning of the 2020/21 season had us thrust Vilardi into the 2C. Instead of letting him have more than a year to grow into the position, Blake goes out and gets Danault and puts Vilardi in Ontario and changes him from C to W. Surely that was a good boost to his confidence /sarcasm. Not only do we get Danault but we also get Arvidsson plugging 2 top 6 spots in one offseason. The 2 have been good players for us and has contributed greatly but it was a quick turn on the youth gathering process-which I also understand is not necessarily meant to be all used directly for the roster. The success of these 2 combined with a breakout year for Kempe and a resurgence from Quick leads us into the playoffs and here we are this season, with expectations to compete and we bring in Kevin Fiala to add further to the top 6 (I know he doesn't always play there). If we had this type of timeframe and agenda, it might have made more sense to draft a guy like Stutzle but we also have an inherent problem.

So, where I am getting at is: 1. we have a bunch of young promising players who can't crack the lineup 2. for those that have cracked the lineup, the spot that they would be suited for is unavailable 3. we are not at a stage to nurture nor have we been very good at developing. I believe that this is in large part because of a lack of a clear plan. Prospects retain value for a couple years but beyond that, if the players hasn't made it yet, they start to depreciate. Todd is expected to win games at this point and he leans on veterans. Blake is not really forcing Todd to use some of the younger players either-clear case in point Sean Walker. It doesn't really make a lot of sense for the team to help retain value on veterans at the expense of the prospects because they lose development years and value too if using for trades but Blake hasn't addressed this. Depth is great but after a certain point, it's poor asset management. The deployment issue roots from the thought that unless you're Connor McDavid, AHL is good for you. That's almost like saying only Einstein is fit to skip a grade in school (I'm using Einstein as the symbol of genius and not for his prowess in school). And what are we developing at the AHL level? 2-way play and being hard on pucks? That is important but it's essentially a requirement to see any NHL action with the Kings (props to Kaliyev for adding that element-definitely was not his game). It feels like we are trying to create a puzzle that has all square pieces. Fiala is possibly an exception but this is a player that was developed elsewhere. We can highlight some of the hits but I question whether we have really gotten the best out of our prospects.

We haven't had massive hits with our own offensive prospects. Kopitar is probably the only one. If you look at how he developed, he came into the league with Marc Crawford as coach. He was not the most defensive minded coach. Some of his former players in Vancouver and Colorado really blossomed offensively during his time. It's probably not coincidence that Kopitar, Brown, Cammalleri and Frolov had one of their best offensive outputs during the Crawford years. The defense would come later under Terry Murray. Kopitar was probably talented enough to have flourished under either an offensive minded coach or a defensive minded coach but it might have been quite beneficial for a guy like Brown. Just dominating juniors or the minors isn't exactly the way to produce an offensive player. Need to let them try to do that at the NHL level too but it almost feels like we tame that before they get there.

I've written for too long. But the question is 1. Was Byfield what we needed at the time of the draft? 2. Would Stutzle have been what he is with the Kings? 3. Do we have an issue with development? 4. Do we have a plan?
With all due respect, I think you are putting way too much thought into it.

I don't find it complicated...the Kings saw an opportunity to draft a potential, elite center. Knowing Kopitar is getting close to hole 18, I would imagine the org was frothing at the mouth to have this chance to replace him.

I also doubt ANYONE was predicting Stutzle was going to be a 90+ point player within a couple years of being drafted.
 
  • Like
Reactions: olli and Mcsorley47

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad