GDT: Quarterfinal • Finland vs. Canada • Part V

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Pretty crazy game. Both teams were kind of sloppy and bad at times and individuals made a lot of mistakes. It was entertaining but not especially high quality hockey.

I was a bit surprised to read after the game that some thought Canada was so much better in the first. It felt like an even period with Finns making awful defensive mistakes which resulted in scoring chances for Canada. We were down 0-2 way too easily compared to the flow of the game. Canada was good in the forecheck but outside of that I thought our team was playing relatively well. I wasn't too worried about being down 0-2 because our guys have shown so much offensive flair this year and I thought Canada was completely beatable judging by the previous games. That Laine goal at the end was a major boost for us. It made Blackwood a bit shakier and obviously helped Finland get a boost right before the brake.

Another huge moment was pulling Vehviläinen. I don't want to dump on him too much but he looked shaky and I think it might have had an effect on the skaters too. Then Kähkönen came in and made some huge saves right away and everyone looked more confident. Then we got some lucky brakes like that D falling in Kalapudas' goal and Blackwood's sloppyness in Saarela's goal. But you have to earn your luck and I thought Finland was playing well enough to get the occasional bounce. Not to mention that some of the goals scored in our end were soft or unlucky too (especially 0-2 and 2-3 goals).

It felt like Finland was making this game more difficult than it should have been with the constant defensive mistakes. Almost all goals had someone to blame, like a bad turnover or something. That's usually how it is on this level but I was fairly confident with out ability to create offense if we could just minimize the defensive blunders.

I didn't think Canada was that dangerous in creating offense and scoring chances. In tournaments past we have been steamrolled and dominated at times by Team Canada but that wasn't at all the case today. Something was lacking, like there wasn't a clear leader or identity in this year's TC. They weren't very physical or intimidating like some past teams but they didn't really have an elite offensive leader like an "Eberle" out there either. I don't know what kind of team they were supposed to be... Marner was close to winning it for Canada but you shouldn't be giving up six goals to begin with, and I don't think it was all on Blackwood either. Discipline was clearly an issue towards the end too, but it was mostly on a couple of individuals.

I thought the refereeing was pretty even. There were a couple of soft calls on both sides but neither team benefited significantly, it's just that at times some calls might en up costing more than others, like the Virtanen penalties did. At first I was afraid the Laine hit might be a five but since Strome wasn't injured then 2 should be enough. The Marner penalty was soft, I hink the ref just felt the pressure not to give a pp that late in the game so he made it a 4 on 4 when Marner gave the chance. Could have been avoided if Marner hadn't punched the face and instead just shoved the chest like Nättinen was doing, but there was obviously some embellishment too from Nättinen.

I felt kind of bad for Virtanen, yes they were stupid penalties but knowing the importance of this tournament in Canada I knew he would get destroyd on these boards. Some people take this way too seriously and it's kind of absurd considering these are all just teenagers.

This game could have ended either way imo. Those last penalties by Virtanen and especially the delay of game (ridiculously bad luck btw) gave Finland the momentum to win it and they didn't miss their chance.

Finland needs to tighten the D if they want to beat Sweden. I don't know how long we can keep this high power offense going on:laugh:. We're giving up huge amount of goals and are still winning. That's practically unheard of in Finnish hockey. Sweden is probably the best organized team in this tournament so it will be a big challenge to keep this offense going against them.
 
Why would they get a European coach when Canadian coaches are much better and right there for them to hire?

I'm not sure why you present this as some sort of truism. Are Canadian coaches better? Are they better in European tournaments? How are you so sure?

The NHL has never had a European head coach. Do you think this is because no European has ever been a good enough coach to do so in the NHL?

Personally, I think there's probably an untapped mine of brilliant coaches hidden in Europe that North American teams and managers are too afraid of to take a chance on.
 
I watched alot of Quebec teams play and lots of games.How Canada management came to conclusion Chabot could do more then Lauzon is a bit odd to me.
 
Congrats Finland. What a game to watch, you guys have clearly iced a fantastic team this year. I've been pretty devastated all day, but I'm hoping you guys do well in the medal round. In all honesty though, I think Canada deserved to win this game. We finally started clicking this game, but it just seemed like every call, every bounce, and every break went against us. Here's how I would break down the loss:

20% Top Finnish line
20% Blackwood
10% Overall lack of discipline
20% Virtanen
20% Poor officiating
10% The far end glass. F***. What a horrible way to decide an otherwise phenomenal game.
 
I'm not sure why you present this as some sort of truism. Are Canadian coaches better? Are they better in European tournaments? How are you so sure?

Yes they are better and yes they are better at "European" tournaments. They are better at every tournament.

The NHL has never had a European head coach. Do you think this is because no European has ever been a good enough coach to do so in the NHL?

Yes. I have no reason to think otherwise. It is by far the best paid league, by far the best talent in world. There is no reason to think the every coach in the world would aspire to coach there.

NHL teams are willing to do anything to win so if European coaches were looked at as being good enough of course someone who hire one.

Personally, I think there's probably an untapped mine of brilliant coaches hidden in Europe that North American teams and managers are too afraid of to take a chance on.

Afraid why? The league has a ton of European players that teams aren't afraid of using why would a coach be different?

Besides the point was that Canada should go with a Euro coach instead of a Canadian coach. Considering Canada has been by far the best team in junior, senior and womens hockey with Canadian coaches it makes zero sense to move to a group of less successful coaches based on one bad tournament.
 
Yes they are better and yes they are better at "European" tournaments. They are better at every tournament.



Yes. I have no reason to think otherwise. It is by far the best paid league, by far the best talent in world. There is no reason to think the every coach in the world would aspire to coach there.

NHL teams are willing to do anything to win so if European coaches were looked at as being good enough of course someone who hire one.



Afraid why? The league has a ton of European players that teams aren't afraid of using why would a coach be different?

Besides the point was that Canada should go with a Euro coach instead of a Canadian coach. Considering Canada has been by far the best team in junior, senior and womens hockey with Canadian coaches it makes zero sense to move to a group of less successful coaches based on one bad tournament.

I fear you underestimate the amount of nepotism in the NHL. It's slowly getting better, but you're kidding yourself if you think that there aren't better coaches beyond your borders. Nepotism can't exist as much when it comes to player selection, where the cream tends to rise to the top. But poor coaching / management can be much more subjective and easy to overlook. Just look at how long it took them to figure that out in Edmonton.
 
Pretty crazy game. Both teams were kind of sloppy and bad at times and individuals made a lot of mistakes. It was entertaining but not especially high quality hockey.

I was a bit surprised to read after the game that some thought Canada was so much better in the first. It felt like an even period with Finns making awful defensive mistakes which resulted in scoring chances for Canada. We were down 0-2 way too easily compared to the flow of the game. Canada was good in the forecheck but outside of that I thought our team was playing relatively well. I wasn't too worried about being down 0-2 because our guys have shown so much offensive flair this year and I thought Canada was completely beatable judging by the previous games. That Laine goal at the end was a major boost for us. It made Blackwood a bit shakier and obviously helped Finland get a boost right before the brake.

Another huge moment was pulling Vehviläinen. I don't want to dump on him too much but he looked shaky and I think it might have had an effect on the skaters too. Then Kähkönen came in and made some huge saves right away and everyone looked more confident. Then we got some lucky brakes like that D falling in Kalapudas' goal and Blackwood's sloppyness in Saarela's goal. But you have to earn your luck and I thought Finland was playing well enough to get the occasional bounce. Not to mention that some of the goals scored in our end were soft or unlucky too (especially 0-2 and 2-3 goals).

It felt like Finland was making this game more difficult than it should have been with the constant defensive mistakes. Almost all goals had someone to blame, like a bad turnover or something. That's usually how it is on this level but I was fairly confident with out ability to create offense if we could just minimize the defensive blunders.

I didn't think Canada was that dangerous in creating offense and scoring chances. In tournaments past we have been steamrolled and dominated at times by Team Canada but that wasn't at all the case today. Something was lacking, like there wasn't a clear leader or identity in this year's TC. They weren't very physical or intimidating like some past teams but they didn't really have an elite offensive leader like an "Eberle" out there either. I don't know what kind of team they were supposed to be... Marner was close to winning it for Canada but you shouldn't be giving up six goals to begin with, and I don't think it was all on Blackwood either. Discipline was clearly an issue towards the end too, but it was mostly on a couple of individuals.

I thought the refereeing was pretty even. There were a couple of soft calls on both sides but neither team benefited significantly, it's just that at times some calls might en up costing more than others, like the Virtanen penalties did. At first I was afraid the Laine hit might be a five but since Strome wasn't injured then 2 should be enough. The Marner penalty was soft, I hink the ref just felt the pressure not to give a pp that late in the game so he made it a 4 on 4 when Marner gave the chance. Could have been avoided if Marner hadn't punched the face and instead just shoved the chest like Nättinen was doing, but there was obviously some embellishment too from Nättinen.

I felt kind of bad for Virtanen, yes they were stupid penalties but knowing the importance of this tournament in Canada I knew he would get destroyd on these boards. Some people take this way too seriously and it's kind of absurd considering these are all just teenagers.

This game could have ended either way imo. Those last penalties by Virtanen and especially the delay of game (ridiculously bad luck btw) gave Finland the momentum to win it and they didn't miss their chance.

Finland needs to tighten the D if they want to beat Sweden. I don't know how long we can keep this high power offense going on:laugh:. We're giving up huge amount of goals and are still winning. That's practically unheard of in Finnish hockey. Sweden is probably the best organized team in this tournament so it will be a big challenge to keep this offense going against them.

You have summed up the game very well.
 
Yup. There goes viewership for the medal round. I was dead set on skipping classes (undergrad) on Monday and Tuesday to watch Canada contend for a medal, but that's not happening any more.

Finland is very exciting to watch, a lot more fun than Canada.

I have no idea how anyone can call themselves hockey fans and not bother with the final of one of the most exciting tournaments.
 
Hockey Canada frankly has not addressed the issues on goalie development over the last few years. It seems the only action they took was for the CHL to ban European goalies from playing in the CHL which doesn't address the problem at all.
 
Finland is very exciting to watch, a lot more fun than Canada.

I have no idea how anyone can call themselves hockey fans and not bother with the final of one of the most exciting tournaments.

The games air on Monday afternoon NA eastern time. Most fans will be at work, employers are not going to show non-Canada games in the boardroom and no one will PVR a non-Canada game.
 
Congrats Finland. What a game to watch, you guys have clearly iced a fantastic team this year. I've been pretty devastated all day, but I'm hoping you guys do well in the medal round. In all honesty though, I think Canada deserved to win this game. We finally started clicking this game, but it just seemed like every call, every bounce, and every break went against us. Here's how I would break down the loss:

20% Top Finnish line
20% Blackwood
10% Overall lack of discipline
20% Virtanen
20% Poor officiating
10% The far end glass. F***. What a horrible way to decide an otherwise phenomenal game.
I'm sorry, but the fact is Finland pretty much controlled the 5on5 game the whole game.

The only chances Canada got were mostly on personal mistakes by Finland's d-men/goalie. Canada had barely any structured breakout. Their game looked terrible.

It's sad that such a great hockey country chooses such terrible coaches sometimes.

Finland is (along with USA) clearly ahead of any other country in this tournament in terms of strategy.

So far the Finns have controlled the tempo in every game. Goaltending and special situations (such as PK and faceoffs) have been their biggest issue.

But on 5on5 play they've been superior.

Canada didn't play any kind of structured tactical team game. It was all based on individual effort and "momentum" and emotion.
 
Finland is very exciting to watch, a lot more fun than Canada.

I have no idea how anyone can call themselves hockey fans and not bother with the final of one of the most exciting tournaments.

Agreed, Finland is amazing to watch. However, nobody in Canada will be skipping work to watch a game if Canada is not in it - no matter how much better the teams are than Canada was.
 
Does anyone have a video of Strome talking to the refs after the game? People made it seem like he went after him with his stick?

I didn't think it was that bad. He just lost his composure. Same as Virtanen and Marner at the end. Marner can't be taking himself off the ice with 4 minutes left, even if it was even up. He was playing the game of his life.

Virtanen, well, he cost the team the game. Seems like just a really dumb player.
 
Finland is very exciting to watch, a lot more fun than Canada.

I have no idea how anyone can call themselves hockey fans and not bother with the final of one of the most exciting tournaments.

My first and foremost investment in this tournament is in my country. I'm sure there will be a bunch more great games, but all I'm saying is TSN's viewers will not be as interested in calling in sick for work or skipping classes with Canada out of the tourney.
 
The better team won, it's not that difficult.

Canada may dominate the Olympics with their crop of NHLers but I find it incredibly exciting to watch the Juniors and focus on how other countries are quickly and effectively improving their development programs.

The CHL is incredibly archaic and hopefully a loss like this will make HC really consider their development programs moving forward.
 
The better team won, it's not that difficult.

Canada may dominate the Olympics with their crop of NHLers but I find it incredibly exciting to watch the Juniors and focus on how other countries are quickly and effectively improving their development programs.

The CHL is incredibly archaic and hopefully a loss like this will make HC really consider their development programs moving forward.

How is the CHL archaic?
 
I fear you underestimate the amount of nepotism in the NHL. It's slowly getting better, but you're kidding yourself if you think that there aren't better coaches beyond your borders. Nepotism can't exist as much when it comes to player selection, where the cream tends to rise to the top. But poor coaching / management can be much more subjective and easy to overlook. Just look at how long it took them to figure that out in Edmonton.

Bingo.

Afraid why? The league has a ton of European players that teams aren't afraid of using why would a coach be different?
Because managers have incentive to be risk averse.


If a GM hires a European coach and it blows up, he's quite likely to be fired himself for experimenting so radically.

If a GM hires a safe, North American coach and it blows up, nobody blinks an eye.

It's the same reason NFL teams punt on fourth down far too often. There is a disincentive to experiment even if taking the risk offers the chance of great reward. If the result of failure is too great to bear, generally the managers will make the safe choice.
 
Bingo.


Because managers have incentive to be risk averse.


If a GM hires a European coach and it blows up, he's quite likely to be fired himself for experimenting so radically.

If a GM hires a safe, North American coach and it blows up, nobody blinks an eye.

It's the same reason NFL teams punt on fourth down far too often. There is a disincentive to experiment even if taking the risk offers the chance of great reward. If the result of failure is too great to bear, generally the managers will make the safe choice.

Hockey GMs get fired all the time for hiring North American coaches.

You really think Holland doesn't hire a European guys because he is scared of getting fired in Detroit?

Keikolainen or however you spell his name thinks hiring Tortarella and giving up a 2nd round pick is a safer move than hiring a European coach?

IF that is the case why bring in European players then? Why not go with the risk adverse Canadian guys and keep your job forever?
 
The NHL has never had a European head coach. Do you think this is because no European has ever been a good enough coach to do so in the NHL?

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