Proposal: Proposals Thread: Fix this broken club

[BleedingOil]

Grabo was never coming west and Gags wouldnt fetch Myers. Tell me why Buffalo would do that? You seem to have all the answers. Also Grabs was awful last year, would be a very questionable fit. We dont need guys half the has 0 interest in.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yeah, so lets trade Hall and Eberle and lose those deals too. Because that's all that will happen here if/when we deal those players. Smarter GMs will read that situation and jump all over it, taking advantage of us.

With regards to Myers, since teams aren't exactly offering us Shea Webers, you move on young d-men that have the chance to grow into a top pairing guy when you have the chance.

This management group sits there with their thumb up their rear end thinking that Oscar Klefbom might make the team out of camp and gambling on Denis Grebshkov.

Tyler Myers has at least proven he can play at an fairly elite level in this league for a stretch of time and is still young in his development curve.

If Hall gets you Weber or someone similar, you don't even think about it. And if you do you're a moron.

But the thing I don't understand with your line of thinking is... This team needs established players, especially on the back end... And you want to buy on a guy that "might" be good. I get that defensemen are hard to come by but there's a very large gap between playing defense in the East and playing defense in the West. We already have enough guys that "might" be good.

Look at Myers' point totals since his rookie year. 48 in 82, 37 in 80, then 33 in 55 then... 8 in 37? Yes he's having a better year this year (despite a horrendous +/-), but not only were his point totals declining but so were his games played. You don't buy on a guy that's declining so early in his career. I don't consider getting 8 points in 37 games against the defensive powerhouses of the eastern conference "proven" in any light.

If you're going to get a defenseman, get someone who you KNOW is good, not someone who "might" be good. Even if it means sacrificing one of Hall or Eberle. Watching Doughty last night, he was exactly what this team needs, not a Myers.

 

[Soundwave]

Look at the job Jim Nill (an actual competent exec who got hired based on merit, not based on being best friend's with the boob of hockey operations) has done in Dallas.

Saw the Seguin situation in Boston and took full advantage of it. Bought low on Seguin and that trade is going to pay dividends for that franchise for years and years to come.

Shrewdly takes Nichushkin, who is an impact player from the draft despite not being a top 5 pick (hey Oilers front office, y'know you can pick a player who impacts the team without having to choose no.1, right?).

That is sharp GM who is going to take that team places. This franchise is run by a bunch of clowns who react to situations three steps after they've already happened.

 

[Soundwave]

If Hall gets you Weber or someone similar, you don't even think about it. And if you do you're a moron.

But the thing I don't understand with your line of thinking is... This team needs established players, especially on the back end... And you want to buy on a guy that "might" be good. I get that defensemen are hard to come by but there's a very large gap between playing defense in the East and playing defense in the West. We already have enough guys that "might" be good.

Look at Myers' point totals since his rookie year. 48 in 82, 37 in 80, then 33 in 55 then... 8 in 37? Yes he's having a better year this year (despite a horrendous +/-), but not only were his point totals declining but so were his games played. You don't buy on a guy that's declining so early in his career. I don't consider getting 8 points in 37 games against the defensive powerhouses of the eastern conference "proven" in any light.

If you're going to get a defenseman, get someone who you KNOW is good, not someone who "might" be good. Even if it means sacrificing one of Hall or Eberle. Watching Doughty last night, he was exactly what this team needs, not a Myers.

We're not getting a Shea Weber or Drew Doughty unless we draft one. Why in the world would Shea Weber even accept a trade here? Especially with no Taylor Hall?

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Look at the job Jim Nill (an actual competent exec who got hired based on merit, not based on being best friend's with the boob of hockey operations) has done in Dallas.

Saw the Seguin situation in Boston and took full advantage of it. Bought low on Seguin and that trade is going to pay dividends for that franchise for years and years to come.

Shrewdly takes Nichushkin, who is an impact player from the draft despite not being a top 5 pick (hey Oilers front office, y'know you can pick a player who impacts the team without having to choose no.1, right?).

That is sharp GM who is going to take that team places. This franchise is run by a bunch of clowns who react to situations three steps after they've already happened.

If the Oilers drafted another ****ing forward last year they all should've been fired. Why the **** do we need more forwards? Seriously anyone who thinks we should've drafted a forward last year is stupid, not to mention throwing him in the line-up again. That wouldn't have helped us in the slightest.

We. Need. Defense. Not more flashy forwards. And for all the accolades Nichuskin is collecting, he has fewer points than local whipping boy Sam Gagner. Big miss there, I guess.

Plus Nill signed Gonchar to a stupid contract that he hasn't even come close to living up to. If you're going to praise him for the Seguin deal (and Dallas has players that are more desirable around the league than we do), then criticize him for other things.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

We're not getting a Shea Weber or Drew Doughty unless we draft one. Why in the world would Shea Weber even accept a trade here? Especially with no Taylor Hall?

I agree but you can't tell me we can't get a Weber/Doughty unless we draft one then say we should've drafted Valeri Nichuchskin instead of Nurse.

 

[Soundwave]

If the Oilers drafted another ****ing forward last year they all should've been fired. Why the **** do we need more forwards? Seriously anyone who thinks we should've drafted a forward last year is stupid, not to mention throwing him in the line-up again. That wouldn't have helped us in the slightest.

We. Need. Defense. Not more flashy forwards. And for all the accolades Nichuskin is collecting, he has fewer points than local whipping boy Sam Gagner. Big miss there, I guess.

Plus Nill signed Gonchar to a stupid contract that he hasn't even come close to living up to. If you're going to praise him for the Seguin deal (and Dallas has players that are more desirable around the league than we do), then criticize him for other things.

And where is Dallas in the standings? And where are the Oilers? Out of the playoffs before Halloween even rolls around.

I don't expect a GM to be perfect. I expect them to be sharp though, and we're not. The only really great move Mac T has made was Perron, but we were already loaded on the wing positions and its the easiest position to fill.

 

[BleedingOil]

Myers can play but hes not the world beater some make him out to be. He has regressed without a doubt. I wouldnt give up what Buffalo would be asking.

 

[Soundwave]

Myers can play but hes not the world beater some make him out to be. He has regressed without a doubt. I wouldnt give up what Buffalo would be asking.

That why it helps to have a GM who understands when to buy low and move on a player. Outside of the one Perron deal we haven't been able to do this for the last 5 years, we lose pretty much every trade we've been a part of and generally speaking we sit on the sidelines when other teams take advantage of situations.

In "Oil Country" winning a trade now means simply off loading the salary of the latest ****** contract we got suckered into signing.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

And where is Dallas in the standings? And where are the Oilers? Out of the playoffs before Halloween even rolls around.

I don't expect a GM to be perfect. I expect them to be sharp though, and we're not. The only really great move Mac T has made was Perron, but we were already loaded on the wing positions and its the easiest position to fill.

Then why not be open to trading Hall? He could fetch a pretty decent return.

Also if you're not counting Scrivens as a great move then I'm sorry but I can't help you.

 

[BleedingOil]

And where is Dallas in the standings? And where are the Oilers? Out of the playoffs before Halloween even rolls around.

I don't expect a GM to be perfect. I expect them to be sharp though, and we're not. The only really great move Mac T has made was Perron, but we were already loaded on the wing positions and its the easiest position to fill.

You realize that isnt Nills team right?

 

[Soundwave]

Then why not be open to trading Hall? He could fetch a pretty decent return.

Also if you're not counting Scrivens as a great move then I'm sorry but I can't help you.

I need to see Scrivens play for more than 40 games as a starter with all the pressure on him before I can make a judgement on that, but it doesn't help that move was made months after the worst goaltending duo in the NHL basically tanked any hope of this season being anything other than a disaster.

Go ahead and trade Hall. I would bet money the Oilers would lose that trade. The thing every team would think is either there's something wrong with him or he's asked for a trade out, in either case, we'd get taken to the cleaners.

You're not getting Shea Weber back, you're getting 2-3 OK pieces back for him while the other team laughs all the way to the playoffs.

 

[BleedingOil]

That why it helps to have a GM who understands when to buy low and move on a player. Outside of the one Perron deal we haven't been able to do this for the last 5 years, we lose pretty much every trade we've been a part of and generally speaking we sit on the sidelines when other teams take advantage of situations.

In "Oil Country" winning a trade now means simply off loading the salary of the latest ****** contract we got suckered into signing.

Buffalo was never going to just give Myers away.

 

[Soundwave]

Buffalo was never going to just give Myers away.

Gagner's value was high last summer, Myers' was low.

But hey, we can always wait 5 years for Darnell Nurse to develop into a top pairing d-man. No rush.

 

[BleedingOil]

Gagner's value was high last summer, Myers' was low.

But hey, we can always wait 5 years for Darnell Nurse to develop into a top pairing d-man. No rush.

Look at the depth charts, Buffalo wouldnt do that.

 

[Soundwave]

Look at the depth charts, Buffalo wouldnt do that.

People always say this stuff, but it happens all the time in the NHL. If a year ago I posted on the main boards that Boston would trade Tyler Seguin for Loui Erikkson, most people would say "Boston would never do that in a thousand years".

You just have to have a management group that knows when to pounce on situations like that. We don't have that however.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I need to see Scrivens play for more than 40 games as a starter with all the pressure on him before I can make a judgement on that, but it doesn't help that move was made months after the worst goaltending duo in the NHL basically tanked any hope of this season being anything other than a disaster.

Go ahead and trade Hall. I would bet money the Oilers would lose that trade. The thing every team would think is either there's something wrong with him or he's asked for a trade out, in either case, we'd get taken to the cleaners.

You're not getting Shea Weber back, you're getting 2-3 OK pieces back for him while the other team laughs all the way to the playoffs.

He wasn't made available by the Kings until Martin Jones came up and played out of his mind.

You might not win a trade with Hall right away, but since you're praising Nill, let's look at the Seguin trade. Dallas got the best player in the trade, but the Bruins got some good players in return too. Erikkson has been limited by injuries but Reilly Smith has 45 points this year! That's a pretty nice prospect the Bruins got in return. You want the GM to get good players, well you gotta give something up to get something. If you can get a top pairing D (doesn't even have to be of Weber quality) and a good prospect or two, do you really think that long and hard about a trade?

This core isn't going to win anything, Soundwave. It needs to be shaken up.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Gagner's value was high last summer, Myers' was low.

But hey, we can always wait 5 years for Darnell Nurse to develop into a top pairing d-man. No rush.

We should've drafted Nichuchskin because we needed more highly skilled forwards.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

People always say this stuff, but it happens all the time in the NHL. If a year ago I posted on the main boards that Boston would trade Tyler Seguin for Loui Erikkson, most people would say "Boston would never do that in a thousand years".

You just have to have a management group that knows when to pounce on situations like that. We don't have that however.

Or, you know, we could've just drafted Seguin and saved ourselves a bunch of trouble.

 

[Soundwave]

We should've drafted Nichuchskin because we needed more highly skilled forwards.

How many skilled forwards do we have that are 6'4 and over 200 pounds again?

But that's just an example of one franchise not needing three no.1 picks gift wrapped to them and being able to make due with regular assets and make something decent out of it. Dallas took some modest assets and turned them into impactful driver's of their immediate team success. And no, they weren't dumb enough to trade Jamie Benn to have to get good, they shrewdly made some good moves in the off-season without really giving up a huge amount.

Reilly is having a freak season, but no way did Boston anticipate that, otherwise they would've just snatched him up for a prospect or a pick.

Contrast the situation here, where this franchise can somehow pick no.1 for three straight years, take three offensive forwards, and then can't even run a decent powerplay with all that talent.

If we aren't picking no.1 chances are the player we take is going to suck, because as you'd guess our scouting sucks as bad as our management brain trust.

I'm just saying I admire teams like Dallas that can build a respectable looking NHL franchise by making wise use of lower draft picks and jumping on great opportunities when they arise.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

How many skilled forwards do we have that are 6'4 and over 200 pounds again?

But that's just an example of one franchise not needing three no.1 picks gift wrapped to them and being able to make due with regular assets and make something decent out of it.

Unlike say the situation here, where this franchise can somehow pick no.1 for three straight years, take three offensive forwards, and then not can't even run a decent powerplay with all that talent.

If we aren't picking no.1 chances are the player we take is going to suck, because as you'd guess our scouting sucks as bad as our management brain trust.

How many forwards do we have under the age of 24? What's one more? Maybe that'll fix it. Shove another rookie into the lineup, what's the harm? Dude's got less points than Gagner for God's sake.

Sorry Soundwave, but you tell me we can't get a Doughty/Weber without drafting them and then tell me we should've drafted another forward last year? Why don't we just draft another forward this year and completely ignore the defense? That seemed to work under the Tambo regime, did it not?

 

[Oil In My Veins]

I keep getting psyched out thinking there's something new to read in here, but it's just the two of you arguing

 

[Soundwave]

How many forwards do we have under the age of 24? What's one more? Maybe that'll fix it. Shove another rookie into the lineup, what's the harm? Dude's got less points than Gagner for God's sake.

Sorry Soundwave, but you tell me we can't get a Doughty/Weber without drafting them and then tell me we should've drafted another forward last year? Why don't we just draft another forward this year and completely ignore the defense? That seemed to work under the Tambo regime, did it not?

I'm not saying they should or shouldn't have taken Nichushkin. I'm saying that's an example of one franchise using moderate assets to get a great bang for their buck.

Whereas the Oilers can't even ice something that looks like an NHL team, even after three straight no.1 overall picks, *SIX* top 10 selections in the last several years, and being gift wrapped Justin Schultz for free. I mean we're not even a "fun to watch, high scoring" team that loses a lot. We just lose a lot.

When's the last time Dallas even picked in the top 5? Do they have a Drew Doughty on their blueline? Or a Shea Weber? Do they make excuses for it? Nope. Just go to work, build around what you got, and augment that with smart trades and smarter drafting.

It must be a coincidence that Dallas did their due diligence in selecting their GM, whereas the Oilers just hired someone for being best friends with probably the biggest blow hard in the NHL management business (and no, that ain't Brian Burke ... Burke actually gets results).

 

[BleedingOil]

People always say this stuff, but it happens all the time in the NHL. If a year ago I posted on the main boards that Boston would trade Tyler Seguin for Loui Erikkson, most people would say "Boston would never do that in a thousand years".

You just have to have a management group that knows when to pounce on situations like that. We don't have that however.

Buf got Hodgson for Kassian they're not dumb. Seguin fetched Errickson who is a 3 time 70 point guy Reilly Smith who is playing lights out and a top prospect dman in Morrow.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I'm not saying they should or shouldn't have taken Nichushkin. I'm saying that's an example of one franchise using moderate assets to get a great bang for their buck.

Whereas the Oilers can't even ice something that looks like an NHL team, even after three straight no.1 overall picks, *FIVE* top 10 selections in the last several years, and being gift wrapped Justin Schultz for free.

So what about the other teams that passed on him? Canucks and Sabres both took a pass. I think you're nitpicking a bit here. We needed a defenseman and we took one. And if they don't take Ekblad this year if they have the chance then they really are dumb.

I think the major problem for this team is lack of desire. They just don't care and it shows on the ice. MacT could add Prime Pronger and Weber and the players would still float. Hell he added a goalie that's stopping almost everything and the players still can't get up for him.

There's something extremely rotten with this team and I don't think it's just Eakins. Never mind that we picked the absolute worst years to tank.