Potential Atlanta NHL Expansion Team Thread

[sneakytitz]

I can't see that happening. There's no way NHL Atlanta would cannibalize their own ticket sales by putting their much more reasonably priced AAA affiliate in the same market.

The NHL team isn't going to have trouble selling tickets and the ability to quickly move talent would be far more advantageous to the franchise than this "risk". GSA is roughly the same drive time distance from SFA as it is from the Gathering and neither the Thrashers nor Glads had attendance issues while the two were operating concurrently.

You also have to consider that the Gladiators aren't reasonably priced in this market by any stretch of the imagination. You can buy face value tickets to Hawks, Braves, and Falcons games for less. I paid less, at the box office, to go to a Carolina Hurricanes game this season than what I paid to go see a Gladiators game. I can go about 15 minutes up the road and pay $9 to watch a AAA baseball team that frequently hosts major league talent on rehab assignments. Whatever the case, no one is going to say, "I want to save $10-20 a ticket to go see the Gladiators instead of the NHL team" but they're very likely to say "Who are the Gladiators?" I mean that's why there is gonna be 9,000+ there tomorrow night and they'll struggle to get 4,000 on subsequent Saturdays.

 

[dj4aces]

I know he kept quiet and only did ASG's bidding, so as not to burn any future bridges within the larger hockey fraternity. However, I can't imagine that a person of integrity wouldn't have quietly shopped around for opportunities elsewhere, once it became clear to him that ASG had no intentions of running the team in good faith. If it was me, and I was as connected as Waddell was, I'd do everything in my power to avoid getting that ASG stank on me.

He's done fine in Carolina, so it's not like he's bad at the job when actually given adequate resources.

I'm with ya... and honestly, I never saw myself in the unenviable position of defending Waddell, but here we are, I guess. All this time has given me a different perspective on his time here

Could he have sought employment elsewhere? Sure. After the Thrashers moved, if I recall correctly, he was hired on in Pittsburgh for a time. But if he had actually resigned his position like that here, the magnifying glasses would've come out from even the most staunch of relocationist media types to find out exactly *why*, and it's very likely he wouldn't have any hope of being an NHL executive again. We've all just kinda tolerated a bad employer before until we could get out of there cleanly, and I think this was him doing the same.

One of the stories shared in that podcast was of the first team plane. I've said before that the team was doomed from the start, and "the trash can" is just another symbol of that.

 

[nhlfan79]

neither the Thrashers nor Glads had attendance issues while the two were operating concurrently.

You also have to consider that the Gladiators aren't reasonably priced in this market by any stretch of the imagination. You can buy face value tickets to Hawks, Braves, and Falcons games for less. I paid less, at the box office, to go to a Carolina Hurricanes game this season than what I paid to go see a Gladiators game. I can go about 15 minutes up the road and pay $9 to watch a AAA baseball team that frequently hosts major league talent on rehab assignments. Whatever the case, no one is going to say, "I want to save $10-20 a ticket to go see the Gladiators instead of the NHL team" but they're very likely to say "Who are the Gladiators?" I mean that's why there is gonna be 9,000+ there tomorrow night and they'll struggle to get 4,000 on subsequent Saturdays.

My recollection was that the fanbases of the ECHL Gladiators and the NHL Thrashers did not overlap all that much because they're wildly different products. People who could afford to go to NHL games weren't interested in saving money to watch a plainly inferior product, while people on more modest budgets (and those suburban folks who tried to avoid going downtown at all costs) were perfectly happy getting their hockey fix in Duluth.

Personally, I enjoy all live hockey. I had Thrashers season tickets, but also went to every Glads game that didn't conflict with a Thrashers home game. I assume I was in a very small minority in that respect.

I admit that I have no idea what Glads games cost. Not to be a snob about it, but I've been credentialed since Year One, so ticket prices are not something I've consciously thought about. Yes, I'm grateful for that.

I went to my first AHL game last season (Abbotsford Canucks), and the quality was really pretty good, especially at minor league prices. The players obviously didn't have the polish of NHL regulars, but it was noticeably faster, harder hitting, and skilled than an ECHL game. The difference between ECHL and AHL is far larger than between the AHL and the NHL.

In fact, I also went to a WHL major junior game a few years back, and even that was a better product than the ECHL because that game featured multiple future NHL regulars in it. I recently went back and looked at the roster sheets, and Bowen Byram (COL) and Connor Zary (CAL) had played, along with a handful of other recognizable names.

 

[dj4aces]

I admit that I have no idea what Glads games cost. Not to be a snob about it, but I've been credentialed since Year One, so ticket prices are not something I've consciously thought about. Yes, I'm grateful for that.

I just took a look at their tickets page. Looks like they run between $25 and $40, depending on where you sit, if the tickets are resale, etc.

Not exactly cheap, but not NHL-level pricing either.

 

[nhlfan79]

I just took a look at their tickets page. Looks like they run between $25 and $40, depending on where you sit, if the tickets are resale, etc.

Not exactly cheap, but not NHL-level pricing either.

...unless you're talking about Jets tickets. Sorry, not sorry.

 

[JMCx4]

Just got that targeted ad today too. I would've loved to have minor league hockey in college. Cheap tickets and cheap beer. I bet it does well. ...

Those two conditions are no longer a given, no matter what level of minor pro hockey is in the building. Ticket & concession prices are driven by the arena management and their 3rd-party ticketing agent contracts, and by the going (and growing) prices for the consumables. My wife & I travel the U.S. regularly to attend minor pro games at all levels, and it is no longer the bargain entertainment product it was even 5 years ago.

 

[Headshot77]

I can't see that happening. There's no way NHL Atlanta would cannibalize their own ticket sales by putting their much more reasonably priced AAA affiliate in the same market.

Why not? It's advantageous to have your AHL team close by for call ups.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

I can't see that happening. There's no way NHL Atlanta would cannibalize their own ticket sales by putting their much more reasonably priced AAA affiliate in the same market.

Why not? It's advantageous to have your AHL team close by for call ups.

What's the hockey situation in Chattanooga? Only 90 minutes north...would be a great compromise, however they may not have an arena.

 

[GrumpyKoala]

Yes it is. Our tax dollars should go towards public services and not into the pockets of NHL owners. Here in Calgary we have higher priorities (even though our council and management have yet to realize it) than making billionaires even richer. If we can't recover our investment from an arena project we shouldn't participate. The people of Atlanta should be telling their leaders the same thing. If the NHL wants an arena they should build it and pay taxes on it themselves.

I agree on the principle that the point is not to make already rich people richer.

When you pay taxes, let's say to build a road, then it make the contractor richer, the other industry using it richer then as a citizen you can, if you own a car pay again through a lot of other taxes use it.

A government owned rink, is not really different.

And it's a bit sad but true.

 

[Mike Jones]

I agree on the principle that the point is not to make already rich people richer.

When you pay taxes, let's say to build a road, then it make the contractor richer, the other industry using it richer then as a citizen you can, if you own a car pay again through a lot of other taxes use it.

A government owned rink, is not really different.

And it's a bit sad but true.

Roads are a common good. Not everybody can access events in an arena. Most of us can't afford what's going on there so why should our taxes pay for them? Let the rich people pay for their toys.

Our tax dollars are better used on infrastructure like roads where at least most, if not all taxpayers can access.

 

[dj4aces]

What's the hockey situation in Chattanooga? Only 90 minutes north...would be a great compromise, however they may not have an arena.

The only serious mentions of hockey I found in Chattanooga are of the inline skating variety.

Near as I can tell, the closest minor league teams to Chattanooga are currently the Knoxville Ice Bears (SPHL) and our Gladiators (ECHL).

While the city wouldn't be a bad place to put an AHL team, they'd definitely need a building that can support a team. The only arena I can find listed in Chattanooga is McKenzie Arena at the University of Tennessee's Chattanooga campus, and it seats ~10k for basketball.

Seems to me, this arena development in Athens would be the best hope for either an ECHL team should the Gladiators get moved up to the AHL, or to host the prospective Atlanta AHL affiliate. Reason being, it sounds like it's already in development.

 

[tucker3434]

The Gladiators would move up to the AHL. Makes too much sense not to. I don't know that ECHL location matters all that much. Until recently the Glads were affiliates of teams like Arizona and Ottawa. Huntsville might be a good spot though. Good amount of hockey fans there for a city that size in Alabama. Birmingham wouldn't be terrible either, though I haven't set foot in the BJCC in 20 years. South Carolina maybe? No idea what's going on over there of if they really buy into Carolina really representing both states.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

 

[GrumpyKoala]

Roads are a common good. Not everybody can access events in an arena. Most of us can't afford what's going on there so why should our taxes pay for them? Let the rich people pay for their toys.

Our tax dollars are better used on infrastructure like roads where at least most, if not all taxpayers can access.

Both a road and a state arena are common goods

The state decide when and how you get acces to it, and will decide if you need to pay extra to the use of it. Going to my "national museum" isn't exactly free

You can say roads or parks are better use or your dollars and be right but the momment the state decide otherwise, that park is close for an event or repurposed forever for whatever they feel like.

Common goods is a very loose definition. We have plenty of allocated resources that target different demographic with all kinds of associated cost and restrictions.

 

[dj4aces]

The Gladiators would move up to the AHL. Makes too much sense not to. I don't know that ECHL location matters all that much. Until recently the Glads were affiliates of teams like Arizona and Ottawa. Huntsville might be a good spot though. Good amount of hockey fans there for a city that size in Alabama. Birmingham wouldn't be terrible either, though I haven't set foot in the BJCC in 20 years. South Carolina maybe? No idea what's going on over there of if they really buy into Carolina really representing both states.

It seems logical to me that the Gladiators would move up, but it all depends on ownership and whether they want that.

But if not, I could definitely see the AHL affiliate in Huntsville or Birmingham. Growing the game being more of a regional goal, rather than local. That could be cool to see. Would be pretty cool to see some Georgia and Alabama youth drafted together, side-by-side.

But if we wanna keep the team more local *and* reduce the risk of the AHL drawing fans away from the NHL product (a thing that I personally feel doesn't even come close to happening, but supposing if...), the potential AHL franchise could also be located in either McDonough or Peachtree, assuming they build an arena in one of these two places. There was previously interest in putting a CHL team in McDonough, after all. While that league is now defunct, it's an idea that has kinda sat with me since I first read about it in 2009.

All in all, there are many options.

 

[GreenHornet]

The Gladiators would move up to the AHL. Makes too much sense not to. I don't know that ECHL location matters all that much. Until recently the Glads were affiliates of teams like Arizona and Ottawa. Huntsville might be a good spot though. Good amount of hockey fans there for a city that size in Alabama. Birmingham wouldn't be terrible either, though I haven't set foot in the BJCC in 20 years. South Carolina maybe? No idea what's going on over there of if they really buy into Carolina really representing both states.

As a point of info., I believe Birmingham currently has an SPHL team (the latest incarnation of the Bulls) that plays in in a 4,100-seat rink out in the 'burbs (I think Pelham). Don't know that they'd want to move to the ECHL, but even if they did, I don't think they'd want to move back downtown to the BJCC.

Now, if Birmingham ever got an AHL team, then I could see that team wanting to play in the BJCC, which, from what I've seen in photos on Twitter (or X or whatever the hell people want to call it) of the current Alabama state high school basketball championship games being played there, still looks in good shape.



Now, to @dj4aces. About the possibility that the Athens will be an ECHL team, is that still being talked about? Most of the chatter I've heard lately has left me with the impression that Athens was going to be an SPHL team.

 

[Mike Jones]

Both a road and a state arena are common goods

The state decide when and how you get acces to it, and will decide if you need to pay extra to the use of it. Going to my "national museum" isn't exactly free

You can say roads or parks are better use or your dollars and be right but the momment the state decide otherwise, that park is close for an event or repurposed forever for whatever they feel like.

Common goods is a very loose definition. We have plenty of allocated resources that target different demographic with all kinds of associated cost and restrictions.

Well, I still think arenas are an ugly use of tax dollars because they can't be accessed by most people because of sheer cost. It's best to invest in infrastructure we can all use. Let the rich people pay for their toys.

 

[dj4aces]

Now, to @dj4aces. About the possibility that the Athens will be an ECHL team, is that still being talked about? Most of the chatter I've heard lately has left me with the impression that Athens was going to be an SPHL team.

I haven't the slightest idea. The article I linked a page or two back said ECHL. I suppose that all depends on the prospective owners and what they want, as well as the two leagues and whether they're in a position to expand. It should be noted that the ECHL is an affiliate league, and only has 28 active teams presently, with expansion teams in Tahoe and Bloomington, and a stated goal to expand to 32 "to match the NHL", it would make sense to look at Athens when the NHL expands to Atlanta..

 

[tucker3434]

It seems logical to me that the Gladiators would move up, but it all depends on ownership and whether they want that.

But if not, I could definitely see the AHL affiliate in Huntsville or Birmingham. Growing the game being more of a regional goal, rather than local. That could be cool to see. Would be pretty cool to see some Georgia and Alabama youth drafted together, side-by-side.

But if we wanna keep the team more local *and* reduce the risk of the AHL drawing fans away from the NHL product (a thing that I personally feel doesn't even come close to happening, but supposing if...), the potential AHL franchise could also be located in either McDonough or Peachtree, assuming they build an arena in one of these two places. There was previously interest in putting a CHL team in McDonough, after all. While that league is now defunct, it's an idea that has kinda sat with me since I first read about it in 2009.

All in all, there are many options.

I can understand keeping costs low while you’re the only pro option in town. If NHL comes and they do what everyone else is doing and want AHL nearby, that bumps the Glads down to 3rd place. Low costs might not be the priority anymore. But I guess we’ll see.

As a point of info., I believe Birmingham currently has an SPHL team (the latest incarnation of the Bulls) that plays in in a 4,100-seat rink out in the 'burbs (I think Pelham). Don't know that they'd want to move to the ECHL, but even if they did, I don't think they'd want to move back downtown to the BJCC.

Now, if Birmingham ever got an AHL team, then I could see that team wanting to play in the BJCC, which, from what I've seen in photos on Twitter (or X or whatever the hell people want to call it) of the current Alabama state high school basketball championship games being played there, still looks in good shape.



Now, to @dj4aces. About the possibility that the Athens will be an ECHL team, is that still being talked about? Most of the chatter I've heard lately has left me with the impression that Athens was going to be an SPHL team.

They play in the Pelham Civic Compex which was brand new when I played youth hockey there growing up. It was very nice for Alabama youth hockey. It is not built to host true pro hockey which is why I mentioned the BJCC. But that’s enormous for these purposes and I don’t even know if they still do ice. The arena situation and general hockey support are why I’d lean towards Huntsville, although I know nearly nothing about their arena situation.

 

[GrumpyKoala]

Well, I still think arenas are an ugly use of tax dollars because they can't be accessed by most people because of sheer cost. It's best to invest in infrastructure we can all use. Let the rich people pay for their toys.

I agree

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Well, I still think arenas are an ugly use of tax dollars because they can't be accessed by most people because of sheer cost. It's best to invest in infrastructure we can all use. Let the rich people pay for their toys.

I think all sports teams should be owned by fans or the city, so these nice shiny stadiums profits can be used for good.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

Vegas has its AHL team in town with no problem.

 

[nhlfan79]

Atlanta hates hockey, apparently. That's why the ECHL team sold out their Atlanta Thrashers tribute night tonight...

 

[Mike Jones]

I think all sports teams should be owned by fans or the city, so these nice shiny stadiums profits can be used for good.

Investment coops would be cool - kind like credit unions.

 

[BMN]

Atlanta hates hockey, apparently. That's why the ECHL team sold out their Atlanta Thrashers tribute night tonight...

I'll give the Gladiators full marks because they committed to this: if you go to their website right now, the audio stream is listed as "Atlanta Thrashers vs. Greenville Swamp Rabbits" and the pbp man is fully referring to them as the Thrashers as though that's their ordinary name.