Player Discussion: Drew Doughty Thread

[KINGS17]

The argument could be made that Doughty is the best player in the league, something Toews or Kane never were.

I agree a case can be made for Doughty being the best player in the NHL.

A case can also be made for how every team with one or more of these high cap hit, long term deals has suffered in the standings after handing them out.

I'll grant you this. It's an interesting experiment in Edmonton where they have spent huge money on max term contracts for McDavid and Draisaitl. In these two cases the players are very young and definitely locked up for their prime production years. Not the same as doing it on the third contract where the back half term of the contract is likely to not be pretty at all.

I think the Oilers have the best chance of it working out.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

 

[Rorschach]

I don't think it's overpayment, if it's $10M thats going to be below the value set by the market. Whether it's smart or not is a different matter and it depends on what path the Kings choose. If they are just doing it to maintain ticket sales, it's beyond stupid. If they have a short term re-tool plan then by all means do it. I think most here just want them to commit one way or the other.

Both Kopitar and Doughty could certainly be traded in 3-4 years. Yes, they'll have big contracts but the cap will be increased so they will be a smaller percentage. Neither of their play is going to fall off a cliff, they both have attributes of guys who are effective late in their careers.

Personally, I resign Doughty and have a target of the 19-20, 20-21, and 21-22 seasons as a window to be back into contention. If things aren't looking like they are going to work out by 2021 trade Kopitar and Doughty, who will still hold solid value. Brown and Carter will only have a year or two left, Toffoli will likely have moved on, and Pearson will be hitting UFA. As long as the price isn't outlandish I don't think Doughty signing will hurt the rebuild as he's not going to be playing out that entire contract with the Kings anyways.

The main reason I think a retool is the best option right now is it's going to be difficult to completely wipe the slate clean compared to a few years down the road because of the reasons above. At that point you turn the team over to a young Vilardi, Clague, or whoever gets drafted/traded for and work towards a core of similar ages peaking around 2025-2029. Might as well take one last shot rather than have a few guys around that will do nothing but make draft positions worse.

A re-tool...with a re-signed Doughty, agreed.

 

[SFKingshomer]

I’d trade him

 

[Little Psycho]

Doughty shouldn't win cos he has a great supporting cast!- East coast fans

And what kind of supporting cast does Hedman????

So many idiots.

 

[kovacro]

Hoven was on NHL radio and guaranteed Doughty will stay in LA. He said their camp wants 14 million over 8 years and the Kings would like to be in the 12-12.5 range. He also mentioned having to trade Muzzin/Martinez or Toffoli/Pearson to make room.

Give Drew his cake.

Package Muzzin and Toffoli for a cost controlled scoring forward. Would not happen but a guy like Teravainen would be real nice or maybe a multi player swap adding a couple guys up front that are relatively cheap (Connor Brown +Kasperi Kapanen +?)

Try to offload Clifford for anything just to clear out his cap number.

Don’t qualify Reider, waive/bury Andreoff in the minors.

Maybe Voynov comes back to fill the void left by trading Muzzin. Not sure what cap number Voynov comes back on.

 

[johnjm22]

It's an interesting experiment in Edmonton where they have spent huge money on max term contracts for McDavid and Draisaitl. In these two cases the players are very young and definitely locked up for their prime production years. Not the same as doing it on the third contract where the back half term of the contract is likely to not be pretty at all.

I think the Oilers have the best chance of it working out.

It's not an experiment. What the Oilers did with McDavid and Draisaitl is what teams have been doing with their good young players on second contracts for a long time.

Kings did a similar thing with Kopitar and Doughty: Second contracts, that are long term, that take up about 11%-15% of the cap at the time of signing.

 

[Fishhead]

$14M is obviously too much, no way is DD's camp expecting that even if it is moneybags Meehan. If they did ask for that, they are just starting high. 12-12.5 actually sounds about right, the Kings should be able to gauge his interest of staying right there. He's the best at what he does, but he's not McJesus. I hate the hype around that guy but it's warranted, he creates like no other player right now and is barely old enough to drink.

 

[KINGS17]

Doughty shouldn't win cos he has a great supporting cast!- East coast fans

And what kind of supporting cast does Hedman????

So many idiots.

I agree, Doughty deserves to win the Norris this season. I think Hedman will take it though.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Try to sign John Carlson for around 9 and trade Doughty for a young D prospect and winger if you can

 

[KopitarFAN]

Mayor’s Minutes on NHL Radio: LA Kings Summer Moves and Drew Doughty Contract Situation

The interview mentions $14M at least as a starting point.

He also talks about buying out Phaneuf next summer as a way to clear the space (this would also be beneficial for the 2021 expansion draft, he has an NMC).

 

[DryIslandBartender]

$14M is obviously too much, no way is DD's camp expecting that even if it is moneybags Meehan. If they did ask for that, they are just starting high. 12-12.5 actually sounds about right, the Kings should be able to gauge his interest of staying right there. He's the best at what he does, but he's not McJesus. I hate the hype around that guy but it's warranted, he creates like no other player right now and is barely old enough to drink.

Doughty and his representatives must think they can get that in the open market. They are 15-16 million apart in terms of total numbers of the contract. Remember, you have to factor in Karlsson (also a Meehan Client) who will benefit from a massive Doughty contract.

Also, Meehan isn’t dealing with Lombardi anymore so he knows he’s got leverage in this against Luc/Blake who aren’t familiar/experienced with contract showdowns, from the front office side.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Doughty and his representatives must think they can get that in the open market. They are 15-16 million apart in terms of total numbers of the contract. Remember, you have to factor in Karlsson (also a Meehan Client) who will benefit from a massive Doughty contract.

Also, Meehan isn’t dealing with Lombardi anymore so he knows he’s got leverage in this against Luc/Blake who aren’t familiar/experienced with contract showdowns, from the front office side.

The difference this time around being the Kings aren't an up-and-coming team of which Doughty may be the most crucial piece--if they don't like it they can tell him to kick rocks and rebuild.

 

[SFKingshomer]

A player that wants to win every year doesn't handcuff his team and ask for the moon. I don't get selfish, greedy athletes. 12 million, 14 million, who gives a shit. Maybe I'm in the minority but I'd sign the same contract as Kopitar and say "go get us some help and lets win more cups"

 

[WHOneedsSOX]

Try to sign John Carlson for around 9 and trade Doughty for a young D prospect and winger if you can

Pass. Rather wait a year and sign Ellis for $6 million.

 

[johnjm22]

It's human nature to want to get what you're worth.

 

[johnjm22]

I wonder what uncle Phil thinks about this, or if he even cares.

Phil/AEG paid Kopitar 14M, had the highest payroll in the NHL, and missed the playoffs. Now the Kings just got swept, and management is going to go to him and ask for ~100M for Doughty. Including an upfront bonus payment of about 13M, for total of about 16M in year one.

I know the dude is mega rich, but that's still alot of money, especially when his team hasn't been getting results. Contrary to what's been said about him, I do think he cares about winning.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I wonder what uncle Phil thinks about this, or if he even cares.

Phil/AEG paid Kopitar 14M, had the highest payroll in the NHL, and missed the playoffs. Now the Kings just got swept, and management is going to go to him and ask for ~100M for Doughty. Including an upfront bonus payment of about 13M, for total of about 16M in year one.

I know the dude is mega rich, but that's still alot of money, especially when his team hasn't been getting results. Contrary to what's been said about him, I do think he cares about winning.

Depends--how much revenue did they get from those two home playoff games?

 

[KINGS17]

It's not an experiment. What the Oilers did with McDavid and Draisaitl is what teams have been doing with their good young players on second contracts for a long time.

Kings did a similar thing with Kopitar and Doughty: Second contracts, that are long term, that take up about 11%-15% of the cap at the time of signing.

McDavid's cap hit is 15.6% next season if the cap is $80M, 16% if the cap is $78M.

Kopitar's cap hit in the first year of his second contract in 2009-10 was $6.8M and 12% of the cap.

Big difference in my opinion between the McDavid and Kopitar contracts. I don't think the cap is going to $100M anytime soon, so McDavid's deal will take up a higher cap percentage than the initial year of Kopitar's second contract for at least 4-5 years, maybe longer.

 

[KINGS17]

I wonder what uncle Phil thinks about this, or if he even cares.

Phil/AEG paid Kopitar 14M, had the highest payroll in the NHL, and missed the playoffs. Now the Kings just got swept, and management is going to go to him and ask for ~100M for Doughty. Including an upfront bonus payment of about 13M, for total of about 16M in year one.

I know the dude is mega rich, but that's still alot of money, especially when his team hasn't been getting results. Contrary to what's been said about him, I do think he cares about winning.

I think Uncle Phil cares about winning, and he expects his experts to get results.

 

[johnjm22]

McDavid's cap hit is 15.6% next season if the cap is $80M, 16% if the cap is $78M.

Kopitar's cap hit in the first year of his second contract in 2009-10 was $6.8M and 12% of the cap.

I consider that to be about the same neighborhood; the percentage difference makes the contracts on par with eachother considering the caliber of player McDavid is compared to Kopitar. McDavid's and Drai's contracts average to about 14%. I think Malkin's and Crosby's 2nd deals were around 15% and 17%, although they were 5 year deals. Point is, big 2nd contracts are nothing new.

Big difference in my opinion between the McDavid and Kopitar contracts. I don't think the cap is going to $100M anytime soon, so McDavid's deal will have take up a higher cap percentage than the initial year of Kopitar's second contract for at least 4-5 years, maybe longer.

That's certainly possible. The economy is past due for a recession. There is however another expanision team coming in which should raise revenue.

 

[KINGS17]

The difference this time around being the Kings aren't an up-and-coming team of which Doughty may be the most crucial piece--if they don't like it they can tell him to kick rocks and rebuild.

I think the last four years have shown the Kings weren't an "up and coming" team when they signed Kopitar to his $80M deal. Luc certainly had a big influence on that deal, as it went from Dean saying they weren't even in the same ballpark to Kopitar getting almost exactly what he wanted.

Luc is good time Charlie. He can't spin if he doesn't pay Doughty. It's going to come down to whether or not Doughty wants to win right away.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Also worth noting that Drew plays in tax hell, he could take less elsewhere and net more. He's going to wring out every penny he can get. LA is not a place where you take a hometown discount. It's already a myth among fans and essentially nonexistent in places like LA where you getting pounded by the tax man.

This is where Vegas can really pounce on the 3 California teams, especially for lower level players where every dollar counts.

 

[KINGS17]

Also worth noting that Drew plays in tax hell, he could take less elsewhere and net more. He's going to wring out every penny he can get. LA is not a place where you take a hometown discount. It's already a myth among fans and essentially nonexistent in places like LA where you getting pounded by the tax man.

This is where Vegas can really pounce on the 3 California teams, especially for lower level players where every dollar counts.

 

[LAKings88]

Take a lot of guts and the right deal to move away from Drew.

I have an uneasy feeling going very north of 10 million a year for 8 years.