Phoenix LXXX: Is there another way out?

[wunderpanda]

Apparently the Fox Sports Arizona reporter mentioned it on a radio program Friday. I don't see how the NHL actually has any leverage in this situation anymore.

http://www.xtra910.com/player/?stat...cast&program_id=BickleyandMJ.xml&mid=23285722

found where he mentioned it, around the 25 minute mark. talks about the city and league having different timelines, added that this latest deal is similar to the failed deals of years gone by.


~tippett talks about the situation near the 8 minute mark, said something about *a couple weeks*

 

[GuelphStormer]

Sale was announced May 31st and approved on June 21.

Winnipeg had to sell 13,000 season tickets to make it happen and they did that in less than an hour.

that was a decision made by chipman et al. and it was more of a PR opportunity than any sort of purchase requirement by the nhl. rather remarkable, nonetheless.

 

[JimAnchower]

http://www.xtra910.com/player/?stat...cast&program_id=BickleyandMJ.xml&mid=23285722

found where he mentioned it, around the 25 minute mark. talks about the city and league having different timelines, added that this latest deal is similar to the failed deals of years gone by.

If this deal is similar to past deals, oh my! If Jamison's deal was structured similarly, Fortress may have given him $120 million for the $300+ million AMF (give or take a few million). That means, like this proposed deal, Jamison only needed to find investors willing to part with around $50 million to complete it (depending on how much Fortress was giving for the AMF money).

Similar questions should be raised for Hulsizer as well. We know that he couldn't complete the Blues deal because he couldn't find $40 million. If he also had a similar deal to this, that means he couldn't find money to complete the Coyotes deal either.

 

[enarwpg]

... ya why not. Just freak right out. Like in 28 Days Later. Yes indeedy.



Its certainly beginning to look like it, assuming the NHL's put forth that
suggestion at all as you note.... 28 Weeks Later... 28 Months Later...
still freakin, cure didnt take....

28 Days Later. The posters have some relevant words.... "Be thankful for everything for soon there will be nothing" AND "Your days are numbered".....

 

[Revo]

This may cause the proposed to deal to collapse since it is unlikely Fortress Investments will be happy with the $6 million amount.

Unless there is something we do not know... unlikely is already too optimistic.

 

[Killion]

From the City of Glendale's perspective, it is more like 'can you spare a dime'...

Oh instead of that old hoary tune, how about something much, much better...

Ok. I'll rise to that challenge, imagining how Id feel if I was an embattled resident
of Phoenix or Glendale and all Hell Broke Luce... headphones or earbuds req'd:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Fju9o8BVJ8

 

[CasualFan]

Gary B is pressuring Glendale? What's he doing? Threatening to keep the team there?


XLS data via Follow Your Money via http://www.glendaleaz.com/FollowYourMoney/index.cfm
Note: Excludes miscellaneous revenues and Fund 1282 Reimbursed Labor.

 

[enarwpg]

So much for a team owner meeting the NHL's criteria, financial wherewithal, etc. blah, blah, blah...as long as someone with a pulse is willing to purchase the Coyotes and keep them in Glendale they have Bettman and the NHL's blessing....

You really have to wonder what some of the owners that are struggling to stay afloat think? Interest free $85 million dollar loan from the NHL, repayment after 5 years, perhaps an out clause (NHL supposedly willing to take the team back after 5 years), blah, blah, blah....

Using a Canadian mortgage am table (if this was structured like a mortgage (which it's probably not) - 5 year term, say a 2.5% contract rate but $0 paid, int calculated monthly with semi annual compounding) the balance of the $85,000,000 would grow to $96,243,020 for a loss to the NHL of $11,243,020 which would be in addition to the guaranteed annual $18,000,000 revenue sharing for a total of $20,248,604 annually..... Cripes, other owners must be livid OR mabye not....

It's really too bad the NHL imposes gag orders on owners!

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[cbcwpg]

It's really too bad the NHL imposes gag orders on owners!

Well, when the Commish has a poster on the wall of his office showing the Hues Corporation and his favourite song is "Rock the Boat" from their album "Freedom for the Stallion".... well....take it to heart....He probably starts every BoG meeting singin' this...

Don't rock the boat baby!
don't tip the boat over
Don't rock the boat baby!

 

[madhi19]

Phoenix LXXXI:I'll Gladly Pay You Tuesday for your Franchise Today!

 

[CasualFan]

Glendale?

CoG without the NHL and with a 'pro' a manager booking 10 shows a year like Foreigner, She & Him, REO Speedwagon, Monster truck pulls and bullroping for $6 million a year - they might be willing to cough up a few more for 43 NHL Arizona Panthers gigs by 2015...

j/k

Good one. I figured you were just kidding. Let's have another laugh:

FY10: July 1, 2009 - July 31, 2010

- The 09-10 Coyotes were not competitive. They struggled with attendance, which is the only figure that contributes to the Ticket Surcharge revenue.

- This was during the Bankruptcy. But the DIP/arena manager entity was still able to book 52 mostly quality Non-Hockey Events at Arena

Result: Fund 1780 - Arena Parking Fee a/k/a "Per Ticket Surcharge": $3,583,727.70.

FY12: July 1, 2011 - July 31, 2012

- The 11-12 Coyotes went to the Western Conference Finals.

- NHL Arena Newco was the arena manager. Well, in title they were the arena managers. They booked a whole 22 Non-Hockey Events at Arena , most of which were not quality events.

Result: Fund 1780 - Arena Parking Fee a/k/a "Per Ticket Surcharge": $1,980,752.39.

Crappy hockey team with bad attendance but with quality non-hockey events = $3.5MM in ticket surcharges. Crappy non-hockey events but with competitive hockey team = $1.9MM in ticket surcharges.

So, yeah, the arena looks like it would operate just fine without an NHL franchise. They just have to re-hire Jerry Moyes to manage it...

j/k

 

[aqib]

The NY Times looked at the relocation options.

Cleveland is highest city on the list that has an NHL caliber arena thats ready other than Atlanta who just failed 2 years ago. Sorry QC we're going to have to take that.

 

[TheTakedown]

Cleveland is highest city on the list that has an NHL caliber arena thats ready other than Atlanta who just failed 2 years ago. Sorry QC we're going to have to take that.

Oddly enough, Hartford has the highest percentage of fans... and I think some of these numbers are wrong...

If the Whalers came back, I think you could sell 15k tickets in a matter of a day

 

[cbcwpg]

^^^ -----

I might have missed this, but is that NY article for potential cities one of those phone at dinner time and piss everyone off surveys? How did that gather these numbers?

 

[madhi19]

^^^ -----

I might have missed this, but is that NY article for potential cities one of those phone at dinner time and piss everyone off surveys? How did that gather these numbers?

Google search analytic of keywords like NHL.

 

[cbcwpg]

Google search analytic of keywords like NHL.

OK. Thanks.

It's just some of these numbers don't make sense. Not to pick on Phoenix but if you take their number of 263,054 fans, this means that if just 1 person out of 10 of those fans actually went to games, they would sell out every game.

So to me the fact its a GOOGLE analytic kind of messy ups the numbers. Joyce Clark for example could be Google searching the NHL 24X7.

 

[WinterEmpire]

It's a a nice analytic in theory but you really do have to take into consideration some extra factors in regards to fan growth. For example how much bigger can the fan bases get in the Canadian cites? Would they really get much bigger than they are now?

Look at somewhere like Seattle and you would have a place to expand your fan base by probably more then double just by having the product in the area.

 

[Whileee]

Given how awkward and desperate the Gosbee / NHL play looks, it makes me wonder whether there might be another team that is in more desperate straits that needs to land in QC.

 

[viper0220]

Given how awkward and desperate the Gosbee / NHL play looks, it makes me wonder whether there might be another team that is in more desperate straits that needs to land in QC.

I don't think that is the case Whileee, there cannot be a team in more desperate straits than Phoenix, if there was we would know by know.

 

[Donwood]

Given how awkward and desperate the Gosbee / NHL play looks, it makes me wonder whether there might be another team that is in more desperate straits that needs to land in QC.

More desperate? is that possible?
The NHL was so desperate for Coyote investors, they tired to break Boots Del Biaggio out of prison

 

[Killion]

Given how awkward and desperate the Gosbee / NHL play looks, it makes me wonder whether there might be another team that is in more desperate straits that needs to land in QC.

There was a rumour to that affect floating around that I believe stemmed from a reporter in PQ, since pretty much all but eliminated as any kind of reality. I mean honestly, who? Certainly not the Panthers nor Tampa, Nashvilles doing just fine, New Jersey, Anaheim; not going anywhere. The only thing I could think of would be Wang going nuts, reneging on his agreements to move to Brooklyn, going rogue. I could see him doing that if PKP or whomever threw hundreds of millions at him. Bettman & the BOG's would have kittens though. So good luck with that. The Islanders come with a terrific local TV deal in the market, lots of upside & Im sure if Wang does sell, no lack of interested local buyers.

 

[MNNumbers]

If I have this right, this is the same deal that Jamison had. That means that the League was honest in saying price was not the problem. It also means the League is not more desperate now than they were last year.

My thought is it is still the same situation. They will sell to PKP as soon as Glendale tells them "We don't need you." So nothing had really changed except that Glendale is nearer than ever to telling them that.

 

[Brodie]

OK. Thanks.

It's just some of these numbers don't make sense. Not to pick on Phoenix but if you take their number of 263,054 fans, this means that if just 1 person out of 10 of those fans actually went to games, they would sell out every game.

So to me the fact its a GOOGLE analytic kind of messy ups the numbers. Joyce Clark for example could be Google searching the NHL 24X7.

nobody said they were Coyotes fans.

 

[Acesolid]

It's a a nice analytic in theory but you really do have to take into consideration some extra factors in regards to fan growth. For example how much bigger can the fan bases get in the Canadian cites? Would they really get much bigger than they are now?

Look at somewhere like Seattle and you would have a place to expand your fan base by probably more then double just by having the product in the area.

That's a ridiculous argument. The fact is that very, very few people in Quebec city and eastern Quebec regularely go to nhl games because THERE IS NO BLOODY NHL TEAM!

Even trough there are tons of hockey and nhl fans, the nhl refuses to take their money, and the nhl instead has teams in markets with very few hockey fans.

I'm not complaining, the NHL's stupidity is a huge part of why the LHJMQ and the CHL in general is so successfull. I garantee that if there were more nhl teams in Canada the the league would be much healtier, and the CHL in shambles.

 

[Llama19]

Ok. I'll rise to that challenge, imagining how Id feel if I was an embattled resident
of Phoenix or Glendale and all Hell Broke Luce... headphones or earbuds req'd:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Fju9o8BVJ8

Yeah, without funding for the fire and police, this is what it will look like in Glendale!