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Other Sports: Philadelphia Phillies: The Road To .500 (2023 Edition)

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Hollywood Cannon said:
Be honest, what's the nuttiest public spreadsheet in sports that you know?

Has to be the Quackverse, right?
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If you allow me to get a little loose with the definition of public, it's related to the NFL draft.

It tracks who designs draftable QB throwing sessions and tries to see if anyone influences draft props.
 
wankstifier said:
Ohtani has nothing to prove but a clean physical. I’d be the ass hole for an extra $100MM+. f*** some toxic sense of pride.

If Ohtani needs another TJ, who’s still paying for a pitcher? He’s basically a DH. How does the 2nd TJ affect performance? I’m guessing the results are pretty mixed
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I always wondered at some point if you'd see Ohtani as DH/RF and then a closer.
 
DancingPanther said:
Oh no, 400 mil vs 650 mil. He's still a 400mil hitter. He's a triple crown threat on a good team. With Harper coming back so quickly and effectively you know he is not at risk to skip any beats as a hitter. There is precedent as a pitcher that he can rebound into form also.

I get what you're saying, seriously. It makes perfect sense, but it's just not really the reality of pro sports
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It seems ridiculous for us poors to squabble over money after the first $100MM, true. But the less billionaire owners can hoard, the better. When's the last time a DH was given $400MM? I'd comp Ohtani with recent UFA ~30 YO elite hitters. I think the starting point is $300MM. Anything beyond that seems like a lottery ticket for his pitching arm.
DancingPanther said:
I get what you're saying, seriously. It makes perfect sense, but it's just not really the reality of pro sports
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Yeah, it's frustrating.

Flybynite said:
I always wondered at some point if you'd see Ohtani as DH/RF and then a closer.
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I suspect that reliever/hitter is an even less feasible full-time niche in MLB than starter/hitter.
 
PDX Flyer said:
I figured considering the technology these days. Is there any track record for maintaining effectiveness after a second surgery or is this still new waters?
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Definitely a mixed bag. Eovaldi is having a great year this year but ironically is injured right now. His surgeries came in 2016 and 2007.

Important to remember the procedure is wildly less invasive nowadays, which means recovery is cleaner and the prospects of tendon integrity are more reliably stronger for longer. This is part of the reason why we're seeing more surgeries: because it's safer and more effective than it was even a decade ago, definitely 2+.

Beuhler just had his second literally 3 days ago. His first one was in 2015. So I'd say he and Ohtani are going to be followed very closely as important case studies as the lead roles in a second "modern" approach TJ. DeGrom too, but he's kind of old which makes him a little different.
 
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wankstifier said:
It seems ridiculous for us poors to squabble over money after the first $100MM, true. But the less billionaire owners can hoard, the better. When's the last time a DH was given $400MM? I'd comp Ohtani with recent ~30 YO hitters. I think the starting point is $300MM. Anything beyond that seems like a lottery ticket for his pitching arm.

Yeah, it's frustrating.



I suspect that reliever/hitter is an even less feasible full-time niche in MLB than starter/hitter.
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Realistically I think if Ohtani stopped pitching he'd also stop being a fulltime DH and be play the OF. He was a RF in Japan when he didn't pitch. There are two leagues in Japanese baseball similar to AL/NL in MLB. The Central League has a DH, the Pacific league does not. Ohtani played in the Pacific league so he played the OF while pitching once a week.

He was by all accounts a plus-defensive outfielder. Obviously a rocket arm, but also very good speed.

It definitely wouldn't be in his first year post-TJ though.
 
JojoTheWhale said:


One of the nuttiest public spreadsheets of which I know in any sport. It's all the TJ info you could possibly want.
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The Rockies sure had a day on 7/26 lol

Needs to be updated, Beuhler had TJ #2 and flexor tendon repair a few days ago.

This is my fav btw. You can see how the tech has changed by the revision requirement. Just very cool. Dr. ElArttache did Painter's reconstruction

Fa4Ij1xUIAIO7Y5
 
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Our old friend Kyle Drabek with 2 TJs back in the day.

I listed Beuhler and Ohtani off the top of my head earlier as leading case studies but you can absolutely include McClanahan and Dustin May in that too after perusing T H E S P R E A D S H E E T

Teams are definitely going to be watching those 4 cases closely.
 
CutOnDime97 said:
Buehler's about to make a rehab start in the next few weeks. He had the surgery last year
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Oh shit, thanks. My bad. They must have been breaking that news a few days ago, I had seen it in passing and figured he was going under the knife, not rehabbing.

I might also be confusing his path with Dustin May who came back earlier this season for a hot minute, only to need TJ again.
 
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Not even in Franchise his
Sombastate said:
Harper is the best. Is it possible he's the greatest free agent signing in Philly history?
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Not even for his team. Pete Rose bringing the first championship in Franchise history has to be number one.

Dr J?
Tim Kerr?
Malcom Jenkins?
 
swami24 said:
Not even in Franchise his

Not even for his team. Pete Rose bringing the first championship in Franchise history has to be number one.

Dr J?
Tim Kerr?
Malcom Jenkins?
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Dude, what?

Mr Black said:
That spreadsheet tho... There's few things worse for your body than rocketing a baseball.
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Smashing your helmeted head into other helmeted heads for 20 years is one of them though that's for sure.
 
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Rose as a Phillie is a weird animal because the arguments invariably go places that have nothing to do with him as a player. He basically had 3 years of post-prime effectiveness left when they signed him and his worst season by far of those 3 was the year they won.

1980 doesn't look that bad by raw numbers, but he was a league average offensive player at 1B.

Erving wasn't technically a free agent, but no players or picks changed hands, so YMMV.
 
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Pete Rose changed the attitude and approach of players that could not figure out how to win. He turned runner ups into a winner for the first time. You have to remember how pathetic Phillies history was before 1980.
 
swami24 said:
Pete Rose changed the attitude and approach of players that could not figure out how to win. He turned runner ups into a winner for the first time. You have to remember how pathetic Phillies history was before 1980.
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So you're saying he's a difference maker as manager? That's difficult to argue.
 
The Phillies went to 3 consecutive NLCS, signed Rose, and immediately dropped to 84 Wins and 4th in their Division. Sometimes you can't fit things into a neat bundle. The Phillies were a good team for quite a few years there. They happened to win it one year when Cartlon went supernova.
 
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