Post-Game Talk: | Pens vs Nucks | win | Shake 'n Bake with Zuck and Geno

[ChrisKuuuunitz]

that steal by Malkin and the give and go was nice, and Zucker's shot off the faceoff was sick.

but I just watched the highlights, I think I gave up watching regular season hockey

 

[Ugene Magic]

Tristan Jarry is not the bulwark between being... whatever the Penguins are... and the Flyers. Sorry.

The two teams have done what with average to above average goaltenders and you want to go forward with a clear well below average goaltender leveling the playing field.

 

[SomeDude]

The entire goalie position is such a shit show right now. The number of truly elite goalies is extremely small and the occurrence of good goalies getting big deals and falling apart is happening a lot. But you combine that with a very bleak market for talent and it's like...what the hell do you do?

Realistically, Jarry is one of the best, if not THEE best, Canadian goalies in the league right now. He's going to have leverage. Even if it's weak leverage.

I think there is a combination of needing to alter expectations for what is considered great/elite with how much scoring has been up. Also, I think we're finally seeing the fruits of the restriction of pad size coming into affect. I think the more athletic goalies benefited from the change while the guys who rely solely on positioning and "letting the puck hit them" are having troubles. This is also why I think MAF has had some of his best years and won a Vezina once the restrictions were in place. The guy has always been top tier in terms of skill and athleticism, but that wasn't the best way to play when you could just wear couch sized pads and worry about your angles. Lastly, I think the team in front of them has a lot more to due with the stats/perception of a goalie than a lot of people admit. That's why I wouldn't rule out John Gibson having a renaissance if he ever decides to leave Anaheim.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The two teams have done what with average to above average goaltenders and you want to go forward with a clear well below average goaltender leveling the playing field.

The Flyers entire roster is a giant laugh before you even get to goaltending. Hell Hart is like the best thing they have going for them probably.

Not a comparable situation IMO.

Nothing in Jarry's resume says he's the key to the castle. The Penguins should have their eggs in the playoff basket and he's come up small or question marks, there. So really the impetus is on you and other fans of this idea to show your work. Not mine.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I don't give a single f*** about Jarry as a goalie. I think he's overrated by a lot of people, and nothing more than a mediocre goalie who has durability issues, who happens to get hot for a bit now and then and it skews his stats a bit higher than how good I think he actually is across the course of a season/series.

I just don't think this team's gonna let him walk and sift through the bargain bin of UFA goalies. Not with CDS as the backup and no Matt Murray-esque stud prospect waiting for his chance to jump to the NHL.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Something tells me that there are plenty of teams out there willing to talk potential trade regarding their goaltenders.

I promise you the league and the GMs in it understand that the position is turn-and-burn at best. Unless you are one of the lucky like... four or five teams that has a guy actually worth it. I mean until he isn't because he's a goaltender and you don't trust them for shit.

Didn't the Avs win the Cup with some half-shlub last year? Why do people obsess over this? It's not the 90s anymore.

 

[Ugene Magic]

The Flyers entire roster is a giant laugh before you even get to goaltending. Hell Hart is like the best thing they have going for them probably.

Not a comparable situation IMO.

Nothing in Jarry's resume says he's the key to the castle. The Penguins should have their eggs in the playoff basket and he's come up small or question marks, there. So really the impetus is on you and other fans of this idea to show your work. Not mine.

That was a broad statement, the Flyers were not always that way, think from the time this era started.

The work is, there's none to be had, he's had 8 games over 3 playoffs.

Foolish is to worry about money or term, there's clearly no better option. To sabotage a team because you are worried about something out of anyone's control and does nothing to hamper this teams future is just an overreaction.

And. Yes. With Tokarski at the helm, the Pens will be even worse than the Flyers. They are just about that without him at the helm.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

that steal by Malkin and the give and go was nice, and Zucker's shot off the faceoff was sick.

but I just watched the highlights, I think I gave up watching regular season hockey

I think that for myself I plan on watching till we aren't going for it anymore.

Like Crosby + Malkin are done.

Would be a nice break watching 70+ pens games a year is a lot of time for other stuff.
I figure I should wait till the product isn't a product to consume.

Go to 1 or 2 games a month.

 

[Power Surge]

I don't give a single f*** about Jarry as a goalie. I think he's overrated by a lot of people, and nothing more than a mediocre goalie who has durability issues, who happens to get hot for a bit now and then and it skews his stats a bit higher than how good I think he actually is across the course of a season/series.

I just don't think this team's gonna let him walk and sift through the bargain bin of UFA goalies. Not with CDS as the backup and no Matt Murray-esque stud prospect waiting for his chance to jump to the NHL.

I agree on all points here. Much depends on their willingness to trade for a goalie that'll decide on Jarrys future. Which I think they should. Bob is available because Florida has that other guy waiting in the wings. Gibson may be available if he wants to. These are 2 quality guys right here and both can put up better numbers on this team than Jarry AND stay healthy.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I'm um... not serious about actually starting Tokarski. That was intentional hyperbole to illustrate a point.

And I think the stance that "clearly there is no better option" is just the kind of mentality I'd like to see less of on this team. It's like the whole organization has gone fat, soft and lazy.

Why are we so sure of that? Especially at such a volatile position? Seems extremely presumptuous.

Also as much as we don't want to have "some scrub" starting... Tristan Jarry has played plenty of games where he looked like some scrub. Because that's how the position is for like 95% of the players who play it. Because they are goaltenders. And you don't trust or pay them.

 

[vodeni]

Lol…

Mark Madden: Penguins are stale, and it's time to call things into question

The Pittsburgh Penguins need change. They too often come out flat. There’s a sense of familiarity about their mistakes, almost comfort. Little gets solved. Good teams don’t have long losing streaks. But the Penguins recently lost six in a row and had lost seven in a row before that. Bad

triblive.com

Lol…

Mark Madden: Penguins are stale, and it's time to call things into question

The Pittsburgh Penguins need change. They too often come out flat. There’s a sense of familiarity about their mistakes, almost comfort. Little gets solved. Good teams don’t have long losing streaks. But the Penguins recently lost six in a row and had lost seven in a row before that. Bad

triblive.com

he just can't forgive them signing Geno, thats what this is all about, God forbid if Geno is not playing well, the whole thing would be about him, when he speaks about core he speaks about him...anyways, no shit genius about Sully and Hextal, but for all his bravado he had a chance to ask Sully at the press conference yet he comes up with a softball about only positives that he can ask...

 

[Power Surge]

I'm um... not serious about actually starting Tokarski. That was intentional hyperbole to illustrate a point.

And I think the stance that "clearly there is no better option" is just the kind of mentality I'd like to see less of on this team. It's like the whole organization has gone fat, soft and lazy.

Maybe Tokarski as a back up though?

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Maybe Tokarski as a back up though?

I'm just fine with that. He's a journeyman and has been around. His numbers aren't terrible. Just as good as most other options.

 

[SomeDude]

Maybe Tokarski as a back up though?

He's been a career journeymen depth/AHL goalie for a reason. I'm sure the more that we see him play the more we will realize that.

 

[vodeni]

He's been a career journeymen depth/AHL goalie for a reason. I'm sure the more that we see him play the more we will realize that.

don't need to. Saw it last night.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

He's been a career journeymen depth/AHL goalie for a reason. I'm sure the more that we see him play the more we will realize that.

Holy shit I didn't realize he had played SO few NHL games.

...

Meh... I'd still do it. It's a really stupid position TBH and frankly I have a tough time figuring out who the good and bad players really are for the vast majority of that position. It seems to change weekly and of course is incredibly team-dependent.

 

[Icarium]

Ever heard fans of other teams waxing lyrical about Jarry? I certainly haven't. I wonder why. He is a decent starter, yes, He is also replaceable. Not easily but replaceable nevertheless.

The work is, there's none to be had, he's had 8 games over 3 playoffs.

Foolish is to worry about money or term, there's clearly no better option.

You can't know that for sure. Teams like Vegas and Toronto seem to be doing just fine despite scorning the supposedly safer goalie options they had at their disposal.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yeah like... what team is clamoring to swoop in and steal Tristan Jarry out from under the Penguins' noses?

f***in' nobody guys. I promise. There's a reason for that and no that isn't a "lol Jarry sux" statement it's a "this position is ridiculous lets not sink money into it because that would be dumb" statement.

 

[vodeni]

Something tells me that there are plenty of teams out there willing to talk potential trade regarding their goaltenders.

I promise you the league and the GMs in it understand that the position is turn-and-burn at best. Unless you are one of the lucky like... four or five teams that has a guy actually worth it. I mean until he isn't because he's a goaltender and you don't trust them for shit.

Didn't the Avs win the Cup with some half-shlub last year? Why do people obsess over this? It's not the 90s anymore.

because other teams play defense and isolate their goalie who than need to come up with some regular saves, our goalies are staring down the barrell way too many times, and you need them to stand on their head to squeeze somekind of win

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

because other teams play defense and isolate their goalie who than need to come up with some regular saves, our goalies are staring down the barrell way too many times, and you need them to stand on their head to squeeze somekind of win

That is very often not untrue!

But what is the solution here in Pittsburgh? I mean besides change the system because we aren't doing that because Sullivan is working-retired.

 

[SomeDude]

because other teams play defense and isolate their goalie who than need to come up with some regular saves, our goalies are staring down the barrell way too many times, and you need them to stand on their head to squeeze somekind of win

This is pretty much this franchise's historic view on the position of goaltending. "We'll score some goals, you're on your own after that."

 

[Andy99]

I think Jarry will be asking for 6.5-7 mil at minimum with term.

Big difference between giving that out or taking on Bob or Grub with hopefully some retention.

Not to mention one of the few areas this team actually has depth at the prospect level is in net.




Yohe and Rossi are saying Zucker is a must resign too. Just to make you feel good.

on the other hand, there’s Gretz…much more rationale lol…

What would a Jason Zucker contract look like, and would it be worth it?

He is having a great season, but there would be a lot of risk there.

www.pensburgh.com

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I gotta say, just seeing Bob's name brought up makes me physically recoil. I think that dude sucks and is a pretty colossal fraud. Even at half of what he's currently making, I'd be real gun-shy about giving him any kind of a deal.

Whoever ends up being the starter is probably gonna run this team north of $5 million, pretty much without question. I think they just hand Jarry a market competitive deal and that's that. I'd like them to maybe get a different look behind him other than CDS. I think CDS is a whatever backup, but with how injury prone Jarry is, I'd like a bit more insurance. Cap's tough though.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I gotta say, just seeing Bob's name brought up makes me physically recoil. I think that dude sucks and is a pretty colossal fraud. Even at half of what he's currently making, I'd be real gun-shy about giving him any kind of a deal.

Whoever ends up being the starter is probably gonna run this team north of $5 million, pretty much without question. I think they just hand Jarry a market competitive deal and that's that. I'd like them to maybe get a different look behind him other than CDS. I think CDS is a whatever backup, but with how injury prone Jarry is, I'd like a bit more insurance. Cap's tough though.

But then you get yourself into a spot where you are paying your goaltending tandem possibly north of like 7-10M?

That seems... not smart.

 

[SEALBound]

Yeah like... what team is clamoring to swoop in and steal Tristan Jarry out from under the Penguins' noses?

f***in' nobody guys. I promise. There's a reason for that and no that isn't a "lol Jarry sux" statement it's a "this position is ridiculous lets not sink money into it because that would be dumb" statement.

I think there would 100% be a market for Jarry if we elected not to sign him.

on the other hand, there’s Gretz…much more rationale lol…

What would a Jason Zucker contract look like, and would it be worth it?

He is having a great season, but there would be a lot of risk there.

www.pensburgh.com

The handy excuse for not keeping Smith is that the Penguins are tight against the salary cap.

GM Ron Hextall created that problem by signing Jeff Carter and Kasperi Kapanen to stupid contracts.

So Hextall needs to fix it. That’s the GM’s job.

It’s also the GM’s job to make the team better. But Hextall has been the Penguins’ GM for nearly two years, and his imprint on the franchise is absolutely minimal. Somebody should hold a mirror in front of Hextall’s face to make sure he’s still breathing.

Hextall has done little besides maintain the status quo, and that’s led to what seems a slow and steady decline.

You can choose whether or not to like Madden and you'd probably be right but he's spot on here.

This is where I get very nervous with Hextall steering the ship. He's not known for making trades that make teams better...unless it's the other team. The exception to that rule is Rakell.

This team screams 2015 Penguins and that took a lot of doing by JR to fix it. The big issue right now may be - does Hextall even have the WILLINGNESS to fix it?