Salary Cap: Pens Summer Salary Thread: We Hayes Dubas's offseason moves so far

[3ladesof5teel]

Speaking for myself... didn't like much of anything Smith did here outside of the first like month of the season. And he just seemed... a little off. Like dude's body language was pretty poor. Then again I would have been pretty disappointed going from Vegas to this clownshow, too. And what does that even mean anyway? Like... maybe he's just kind of a quiet, awkward guy that was half checked out because he got here and immediately realized this team wasn't serious at all.

All that said if anyone actually wants to buy in to what Josh Yohe is peddling that's on them. In most ways he's probably the worst of a decidedly awful bunch.

And that's absolutely fair, he was already on the decline that's why he was demoted to the 3rd line in Vegas.

I disagreed with many who felt he was a Zucker replacement, he was already showing signs of decline. I would have liked him on the 3rd line if we had a competent one that could move up in a pinch but Sully doesn't utilize the 3rd line like he should imo

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Smith should have seen more time with Sid imo. The OG Vegas line all played similar to how Sid plays, and yet he was rarely played with Sid at all. Smith’s early success with Geno and Raks probably caused that.

Same shit that happened with Zucker. At least Zucker started with Sid, had a two goal game and still got pushed down.

Tells me it’s our dumbass coach thinking he knows all.

This coaching staff does a terrific job of taking an already-suspect top six and making it even worse with their complete inflexibility and want to satisfy preferences and pet projects over results.

 

[Jacob]

Smith started out playing awesome then kinda fell off a bit, then started to look absolutely terrible at times where like everything he was trying to do wasn't working at all. I don't really care if he liked it here or not and the trade was a no-brainer even though we had and still have the cap room to keep him.

I had him penciled into the 3rd line but as, like, a spread-the-offense type of situation. Could've moved up or down. But someone like Beauvillier could possibly provide almost as much offense and equal defense at 1/5th the cap hit. 12 ES goals in a middle-6 role is very replaceable.

Just checked his start to make sure I wasn't nuts.. 6+5 in his first 10 games.

 

[Trade]

This coaching staff does a terrific job of taking an already-suspect top six and making it even worse with their complete inflexibility and want to satisfy preferences and pet projects over results.

At least we’ll never have to complain about Sully trotting out GCR anymore. Can’t wait to see the new iteration!

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

At least we’ll never have to complain about Sully trotting out GCR anymore. Can’t wait to see the new iteration!

I'm actually genuinely curious about this.

I'm sure Sid is thrilled to be tentatively lined up next to like... Beauvillier and Rust.

This team's top six was already kinda ass BEFORE they traded the 40 goal scorer.

 

[eXile3]

I don’t blame Smith. Just like I don’t blame Rakell, Malkin, EK or the long line of players that underperformed.

An entire team outside one player doesn’t underperform under good coaching.

 

[Pancakes]

I'm actually genuinely curious about this.

I'm sure Sid is thrilled to be tentatively lined up next to like... Beauvillier and Rust.

This team's top six was already kinda ass BEFORE they traded the 40 goal scorer.

Sid will probably get Rust and Rakell. Malkin will be given whatever scraps are left and then Sully will constantly berate him in press conferences saying that Geno needs to play smarter hockey.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Sid will probably get Rust and Rakell. Malkin will be given whatever scraps are left and then Sully will constantly berate him in press conferences saying that Geno needs to play smarter hockey.

But I thought Malkin was treated perfectly normal and as expected here and I'm just a big ol drama queen super fan or something?

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I have to believe we will start training camp with O'Connor-Crosby-Rust. Not that Sullivan is beyond doing non-smart things, but they did look quite good down the stretch. SO, if you are not bringing in someone to replace Guentzel, well then O'Connor did a solid job at replacing him last season.

I actually like Rakell more with Crosby than Malkin, so Rakell-Crosby-Rust would be fine with me. I also like the idea of putting Rakell on the third line to balance things out.

Where Sullivan chooses to play Hayes could be the key to everything we do.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I have to believe we will start training camp with O'Connor-Crosby-Rust. Not that Sullivan is beyond doing non-smart things, but they did look quite good down the stretch. SO, if you are not bringing in someone to replace Guentzel, well then O'Connor did a solid job at replacing him last season.

I actually like Rakell more with Crosby than Malkin, so Rakell-Crosby-Rust would be fine with me. I also like the idea of putting Rakell on the third line to balance things out.

Where Sullivan chooses to play Hayes could be the key to everything we do.

L2C, baby.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

"Who are WE to deny a repulsive man who was never all that good at his job but has the right last name a second... third... or even fourth chance? Let those who HAVEN'T participated in the aiding and abetting of a sexual predator cast the first stone!"

Again, I don't want to come off defending Bowman but it appears he went through some training program about harassment, reporting, etc. Furthermore, Sheldon Kennedy endorsed his return.

https://www.respectgroupinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/my-work-with-stan-bowman-sk.pdf

Former player Sheldon Kennedy, who went public about being sexually abused as a coach and has since co-founded the Respect Group to train people to help prevent bullying, harassment and abuse, wrote a lengthy letter endorsing Bowman and explaining the work he has done in recent years.


"I believe Stan would be a valuable asset to an organization due to his acknowledgment of past mistakes and his relentless efforts to make the locker room/game safer for everyone," Kennedy wrote. "He possesses the insights, knowledge, and confidence needed to lead in this area. I feel building a strong and healthy culture within an organization and practicing it on an ongoing basis will be a top priority for Stan. I also believe Stan will carry this message within the hockey eco system, which can only help."

 

[Deport Ogie]

Yohe just tweeted that Nepo Pryor is gonezo, headed to run the amateur scouting for Colorado.

Yes, it is Yohe but when it comes to the chance to shit from a mighty height over anyone involved with the Hextall years I trust ole Josh to be gleefully first in line.

 

[ThosePuckingPenguins]

Yohe just tweeted that Nepo Pryor is gonezo, headed to run the amateur scouting for Colorado.

Yes, it is Yohe but when it comes to the chance to shit from a mighty height over anyone involved with the Hextall years I trust ole Josh to be gleefully first in line.

Yohe has broken some news this offseason. Believe a couple signings.

Anyways, with the hiring of Wes Clark, this was probably inevitable.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Again, I don't want to come off defending Bowman but it appears he went through some training program about harassment, reporting, etc. Furthermore, Sheldon Kennedy endorsed his return.

https://www.respectgroupinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/my-work-with-stan-bowman-sk.pdf

Former player Sheldon Kennedy, who went public about being sexually abused as a coach and has since co-founded the Respect Group to train people to help prevent bullying, harassment and abuse, wrote a lengthy letter endorsing Bowman and explaining the work he has done in recent years.


"I believe Stan would be a valuable asset to an organization due to his acknowledgment of past mistakes and his relentless efforts to make the locker room/game safer for everyone," Kennedy wrote. "He possesses the insights, knowledge, and confidence needed to lead in this area. I feel building a strong and healthy culture within an organization and practicing it on an ongoing basis will be a top priority for Stan. I also believe Stan will carry this message within the hockey eco system, which can only help."

I'd like to believe that Bowman was truly somehow in the dark and genuinely feels catastrophically horrible about the entire thing and will be using the rest of his days to advocate for change and protecting the vulnerable. But I dunno... maybe I'm just cynical but most of the time in these cases (particularly involving privileged-from-the-cradle guys like Bowman) it seems like they are only sorry they got caught and everything else is just spin.

I just have no idea why Edmonton would tie themselves to this guy with all that kind of baggage when he wasn't even a particularly great GM.

 

[Pancakes]

I'd like to believe that Bowman was truly somehow in the dark and genuinely feels catastrophically horrible about the entire thing and will be using the rest of his days to advocate for change and protecting the vulnerable. But I dunno... maybe I'm just cynical but most of the time in these cases (particularly involving privileged-from-the-cradle guys like Bowman) it seems like they are only sorry they got caught and everything else is just spin.

I just have no idea why Edmonton would tie themselves to this guy with all that kind of baggage when he wasn't even a particularly great GM.

It's an old boys club and always has been.

Bowman parachuted into the Hawks right when their core was already in place. He did manage to win with it so good for him but I mean who wouldn't have managed to win with that core? A blind squirrel could have done so.

And then the work Bowman did near the end of his time there wasn't especially good.

It is stupid and tone deaf for the Oilers to do this when there's plenty of qualified candidates out there who don't have Bowman's baggage, but NHL orgs are gonna do what they do.

The Edmonton media is horrifically bad/homerish too so my bet is they'll write a bunch of puff pieces about Bowman and generally whitewash the whole thing.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The Bowman situation is tough because I don't think he really "paid the price" for his egregious actions, but:

1. If people who are actually aware of the work he has done since support him coming back, why should I not? That Sheldon Kennedy endorsement is significant IMO.
2. I think people online are far too eager to ruin people's careers as retribution for any sort of mistake they make, which I find repulsive. It's the same thought as I have with ex-convicts: if they pay the price for their mistakes and improve as a person, their past actions should be forgiven.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The Bowman situation is tough because I don't think he really "paid the price" for his egregious actions, but:

1. If people who are actually aware of the work he has done since support him coming back, why should I not? That Sheldon Kennedy endorsement is significant IMO.
2. I think people online are far too eager to ruin people's careers as retribution for any sort of mistake they make, which I find repulsive. It's the same thought as I have with ex-convicts: if they pay the price for their mistakes and improve as a person, their past actions should be forgiven.

I think that at least in THEORY I agree with you. I want to believe in redemption.

But to your last point at least... I mean... that might be a tough sell to Beach, his family etc. Sometimes what you've done cannot truly be forgiven.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I don't think someone should get a second chance to hold one of the most prestigious positions in sports once you've been deemed to be complicit in covering up for a rapist. /shrug

Nobody's saying Bowman should be exiled to live in a cave for the rest of his life (though, really, no loss there), just that he shouldn't be given another opportunity to make millions as the GM of an NHL team.

This isn't cancel culture, get that fake centrist bullshit outta here. Dude's a nepo baby who sucked at his job and made heinous decisions, and he should live with the consequences for the rest of his days--the consequences being that he should be banned for life. Let him rehabilitate his image by working with charities, etc., without privelege.

 

[Pancakes]

The Bowman situation is tough because I don't think he really "paid the price" for his egregious actions, but:

1. If people who are actually aware of the work he has done since support him coming back, why should I not? That Sheldon Kennedy endorsement is significant IMO.
2. I think people online are far too eager to ruin people's careers as retribution for any sort of mistake they make, which I find repulsive. It's the same thought as I have with ex-convicts: if they pay the price for their mistakes and improve as a person, their past actions should be forgiven.

I believe in redemption and the chance for it but I also think that working in the NHL is one of the biggest privileges someone can have. I don't have anything against Stan Bowman finding employment somewhere but should he really get a chance to work in the NHL?

I'm also not certain that sitting out for a couple of years is much of a punishment either. Maybe if Bowman had waited half a decade or a decade to get back into the NHL I'd be a bit more forgiving, but this makes the whole thing with him feel like he got a light slap on the wrist.

But even putting aside the ethical issues at play here, isn't there an issue of public safety here too? If you're the Oilers how you can justify putting someone in place who has a history of not taking care of their employees? The hope I guess would be that he's learned his lesson and would never let it happen again, but if I'm any player or employee of the Oilers I would have serious concerns about putting a guy in place who failed his previous employees so thoroughly.

 

[BusinessGoose]

The Bowman situation is tough because I don't think he really "paid the price" for his egregious actions, but:

1. If people who are actually aware of the work he has done since support him coming back, why should I not? That Sheldon Kennedy endorsement is significant IMO.
2. I think people online are far too eager to ruin people's careers as retribution for any sort of mistake they make, which I find repulsive. It's the same thought as I have with ex-convicts: if they pay the price for their mistakes and improve as a person, their past actions should be forgiven.

In a way. People who do time in jail should be reset in terms of how society views them.

Bowman can go work at a home depot. He doesn't need to be making millions in the same role he was in.

Celebs and sports people 100% do not deserve to continue their, arguably, pointless careers of privilege after being outed as shitbags. Regardless of their own personal journey to change.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Bowman can go work at a home depot. He doesn't need to be making millions in the same role he was in.

I believe in redemption and the chance for it but I also think that working in the NHL is one of the biggest privileges someone can have. I don't have anything against Stan Bowman finding employment somewhere but should he really get a chance to work in the NHL?

I don't think someone should get a second chance to hold one of the most prestigious positions in sports once you've been deemed to be complicit in covering up for a rapist. /shrug

This is the argument I flat out do not agree with. To me, being a part of the NHL isn't a "privilege", it's a job. If someone wants to hire Bowman after Bowman has "served the time" for his crime (which I honestly don't think he did, but whatever), I think it doesn't make any sense to deny him because they view the NHL as some special luxurious job. It's all entertainment, that's it. It's not this castle of morality that only the most pure people get to access.

Hell, you can easily argue that a ton of athletes are pieces of shit that get away with things that normal people would never get away with.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yeah I mean... that's the other thing, here. We're not talking about some everyday shlub like me that made some bad choices and is working hard to make that right so I can live my little life and look myself in the mirror every day. It's an individual born into wealth, privilege and power who was complicit in covering up a sexual predator for years and as a result had to disappear for a handful of seasons before getting to come back to his millionaire, high powered job without missing a beat.

There is a distinction, there.

 

[Avs44]

Sorry to jump in, but it appears that the Avs are stealing your Director of Amateur Scouting; any info on the guy? Is he any good? The Avs' drafting has been a catastrophe for some time.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1816171076394598424

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Tough to say. He was hired almost entirely because of his dad.

I figure if the Avs are interested enough to hire him he can't be all bad. I wouldn't put much blame on the Penguins lack of success at the draft table at his feet as they haven't had much to work with and he wasn't really here long enough to measure results.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yeah I mean... that's the other thing, here. We're not talking about some everyday shlub like me that made some bad choices and is working hard to make that right so I can live my little life and look myself in the mirror every day. It's an individual born into wealth, privilege and power who was complicit in covering up a sexual predator for years and as a result had to disappear for a handful of seasons before getting to come back to his millionaire, high powered job without missing a beat.

There is a distinction, there.

But like I said, I just don't view this to be a factor. I don't view being a part of a professional sports team as a "luxury" that has a morality based element that needs to be maintained. It's entertainment, that's it. I don't view professional sports as different than actors, musicians or anything like that.