Salary Cap: Pens '24-'25 Salary Thread: The Crosbicles Volume XIX

[SEALBound]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851781525802508593

Stat watching doesn't tell you that he's giving up goals like this.

At least he gave the team the courtesy of allowing it with 7:30 left in the 2nd rather than 2min left in the 3rd. That's something to build on at least.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851781525802508593

Stat watching doesn't tell you that he's giving up goals like this.

This is why we need him to come back ASAP and help us tank!!

 

[AuroraBorealis]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851781525802508593

Stat watching doesn't tell you that he's giving up goals like this.

Terrible goals are fine. If you end up saving as much as you should throughout 60 minutes or a little more, I don't care if the goals are shots from the opposition goal line.
The scoreboard isn't gonna care when your team wins (which they did).

 

[Andy99]

Yes, as some of us have previously said lol…just terrible front office management in addition to coaching by the Pens…

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851760556698657005

 

[Empoleon8771]

Terrible goals are fine. If you end up saving as much as you should throughout 60 minutes or a little more, I don't care if the goals are shots from the opposition blue line.
The scoreboard isn't gonna care when your team wins.

Spoken as someone who has never played a team sport before.

Giving up goals like this are downright deflating to a team, as Jarry has shown time and time again for the Penguins. Not all goals are equal in terms of morale impact just because they're the same on the stat sheet.

 

[Gurglesons]

Pulju scratch?

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yes, as some of us have previously said lol…just terrible front office management in addition to coaching by the Pens…

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851760556698657005

Honestly I don't even feel that the Caps "retool" has been anything amazing, either. Pretty much all they really did was just not trade a billion futures like JR did. Hell of a lot easier to have young players in significant roles like McMichael when they've had 6 of their last 7 1sts, and the only 1st they traded was for a young Sandin. They've had 6 1sts, 8 2nds and 7 3rds in their last 7 drafts, that's absolutely great pick retention.

They did make some trades that seem like they'll be panning well (Sandin and Dubois trades) but it's mostly just keeping picks and drafting/developing well.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Pulju scratch?

That's what it's looking like if Lizotte plays

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851781525802508593

Stat watching doesn't tell you that he's giving up goals like this.

This is why I go back to stats being a very incomplete story for goalies.

How can you objectively measure a goal like this going in?
How can you measure a save on a breakaway when your team is down 3-1 and you''ve kept them in the game?

Jarry is a mental headcase. He'll never be a guy who wins a Championship (even at the AHL level).

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

They did make some trades that seem like they'll be panning well (Sandin and Dubois trades) but it's mostly just keeping picks and drafting/developing well.

And playing their youngsters instead of deferring to 30+ year old 4th liners/7th defensemen.

Part of development is giving these young guys opportunities in roles that play to their strengths, and not instantly benching them the second they make a mistake.

IMO, that's the biggest reason I think any rebuild/retool under Sullivan is doomed to failure. Unless the prospect basically comes out of the package already at his full potential, they'll never get a fair shake.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Terrible goals are fine. If you end up saving as much as you should throughout 60 minutes or a little more, I don't care if the goals are shots from the opposition goal line.
The scoreboard isn't gonna care when your team wins (which they did).

This is a flat out awful take and prioritizes results over process.

I'll give you 2 guesses to figure out which is more important when discussing performance management
a) Process
OR
b) Results

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't know that you could get a 1st as well, but it would be a dream scenario to pull off Elias Pettersson (defenseman) and a 1st from Vancouver for Pettersson as a rental. Elias is a pretty seamless replacement for Marcus based on play style and I even think Elias may have a higher upside based on his size (6'3" and 210 lbs) and offensive abilities based on his scouting report.

I think you can argue that he is very similar to Pickering in style, so maybe it's a better idea to target a different kind of player, but replacing Marcus with Elias seems like a really good swap in terms of skillsets.

 

[SEALBound]

Terrible goals are fine. If you end up saving as much as you should throughout 60 minutes or a little more, I don't care if the goals are shots from the opposition goal line.
The scoreboard isn't gonna care when your team wins (which they did).

If it's 5-0 and you let that in with 2min to go in the 3rd to make it 5-1, no big.

Up 2-1 in a hard-fought game mid-way through, and you let that in to tie it 2-2; that's a much bigger deal.

Yes, as some of us have previously said lol…just terrible front office management in addition to coaching by the Pens…

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851760556698657005

I think that's purely speculative and purely hindsight now that the consequences are well understood. Above all else, that wasn't the directive at the time. Imagine it's 2019, and the team is in a playoff spot, but JR says, "Ummm...nope, not going to focus on improving the roster, the playoffs or Cup. I'm going to retool instead so that we MIGHT be a playoff team in 2025." He would have been roasted by every hockey person in the world and promptly fired.

These are only tweets you can make with hindsight.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Spoken as someone who has never played a team sport before.

Giving up goals like this are downright deflating to a team, as Jarry has shown time and time again for the Penguins. Not all goals are equal in terms of morale impact just because they're the same on the stat sheet.

Thank you for your guesswork contribution, Professor Empoleon8771.
I only played sports religiously for 20 years. Hockey, badminton, soccer, basketball, volleyball. Probably more hours put in than almost anyone here.

You're legit one of the most unlikeable people I've ever encountered online. Can't even talk about a neutral topic for 2 minutes before you bust out personal attacks.
You refuse to mature. Every convo is loaded with tension and passive-aggression, and you never have good days.

 

[Gurglesons]

If it's 5-0 and you let that in with 2min to go in the 3rd to make it 5-1, no big.

Up 2-1 in a hard-fought game mid-way through, and you let that in to tie it 2-2; that's a much bigger deal.

I think that's purely speculative and purely hindsight now that the consequences are well understood. Above all else, that wasn't the directive at the time. Imagine it's 2019, and the team is in a playoff spot, but JR says, "Ummm...nope, not going to focus on improving the roster, the playoffs or Cup. I'm going to retool instead so that we MIGHT be a playoff team in 2025." He would have been roasted by every hockey person in the world and promptly fired.

These are only tweets you can make with hindsight.

nowhere in JFresh’s tweet does it say that.

It says competent management. We’ve been giving big contracts to moronic players like Jack Johnson, Tanev, and Graves while Washington has been making shrewd deals.

They’ve also been willing to part with pieces when they knew they were a fringe team. See last year, they traded Edmundson even though they were likely to make the playoffs.

Our management has been incompetent and our players have generally succeeded despite it.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

If it's 5-0 and you let that in with 2min to go in the 3rd to make it 5-1, no big.

Up 2-1 in a hard-fought game mid-way through, and you let that in to tie it 2-2; that's a much bigger deal.

It happened a lot in the Bylsma era, and with DeSmith. If a team has a culture of winning then it rolls off their backs and they get back to work very quickly.
If it's a mentally fragile team that sucks and you can't handle a bad goal, you got way bigger problems.

End of the day the players or coach can't complain if a goalie lets in 2 or less, even if they were horrific. They had every chance to win.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

View attachment 924374

Puljujarvi game logs. Look at his ice time and confidence get hacked away in the midst of a 5-game point streak.
Most coaches boost minutes when someone's lighting it up in your bottom-six with limited time on ice. But not this coach. He's special. He does the polar opposite.
This could be the next Heinen treatment.
This guy's such an idiot. I can't stand how he operates. We may lose JP on waivers now lol

I don't get it. I wanted him in the top 6. He is a workhorse for Malkin and Crosby I imagine. He works hard He deserves minutes to show it. I don't expect him to score a million points but the work ethic he shows out there. It's good stuff.

I don't get how Sullivan ignores it.

Terrible goals are fine. If you end up saving as much as you should throughout 60 minutes or a little more, I don't care if the goals are shots from the opposition goal line.
The scoreboard isn't gonna care when your team wins (which they did).

I always say 1 bad goal a game is allowed.

Yes to all the haters that say bad goals should never happen guess what they do.

That's what it's looking like if Lizotte plays

F

 

[AuroraBorealis]

This is a flat out awful take and prioritizes results over process.

I'll give you 2 guesses to figure out which is more important when discussing performance management
a) Process
OR
b) Results

You speak to me in this degrading, condescending tone and later in the day want me to have conversations like nothing happened?
I don't want your "two guesses". I want you to f*** off.

 

[SEALBound]

It happened a lot in the Bylsma era, and with DeSmith. If a team has a culture of winning then it rolls off their backs and they get back to work very quickly.
If it's a mentally fragile team that sucks and you can't handle a bad goal, you got way bigger problems.

End of the day the players or coach can't complain if a goalie lets in 2 or less, even if they were horrific. They had every chance to win.

If you have the ponies to race, maybe. When you don't, it's a much bigger deal.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Thank you for your guesswork contribution, Professor Empoleon8771.
I only played sports religiously for 20 years. Hockey, badminton, soccer, basketball, volleyball. Probably more hours put in than almost anyone here.

You're legit one of the most unlikeable people I've ever encountered online. Can't even talk about a neutral topic for 2 minutes before you bust out personal attacks.
You refuse to mature. Every convo is loaded with tension and passive-aggression, and you never have good days.

Lol whatever you say bud.

As someone who has played high level hockey my entire life (as a goalie), I can easily tell when my team gets deflated when I give up a bad goal. Not all goals are created equal. Giving up a bad goal when your team has all of the momentum completely kills your team's momentum, just like making an insane save when the other team has all of the momentum builds up your team's momentum.

The situation in which goals/saves happen matter.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think it's about having confidence in your teammates.

The team doesn't have faith in Jarry and Jarry doesn't have faith in the team defense.

Both are right. They are a bad team all over.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851781525802508593

Stat watching doesn't tell you that he's giving up goals like this.

Right. And then he shut it down in the third and won it for them in shootouts.

Highlight watching doesn't tell you he's battling back to win.

Lol whatever you say bud.

As someone who has played high level hockey my entire life (as a goalie), I can easily tell when my team gets deflated when I give up a bad goal. Not all goals are created equal. Giving up a bad goal when your team has all of the momentum completely kills your team's momentum, just like making an insane save when the other team has all of the momentum builds up your team's momentum.

The situation in which goals/saves happen matter.

An ex goalie and you still say the dumbest shit imaginable.

Odd.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/mike-sullivan-pittsburgh-penguins-coaching-job-pressure-building/

One could only hope that means a loss to Anaheim and the Habs are enough and Sullivan is green lit to he canned.


Seems like Werner and FSG are getting impatient.

Yohe is also a dipshit and if Crosby believes than then Crosby can go f*** off.

@Big Friggin Dummy

 

[Khelandros]

This is why I go back to stats being a very incomplete story for goalies.

How can you objectively measure a goal like this going in?
How can you measure a save on a breakaway when your team is down 3-1 and you''ve kept them in the game?

Jarry is a mental headcase. He'll never be a guy who wins a Championship (even at the AHL level).

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Yes, as some of us have previously said lol…just terrible front office management in addition to coaching by the Pens…

https://x.com/i/web/status/1851760556698657005

Caps let go Trotz in that span after a cup, said bye to Reirden and Lavi and hired Carbery (smart move). Meanwhile the Pens just grew a bigger hard on for Complete Sentences Sullivan.