Gurglesons
Registered User
Depends. Maybe you get Hoglander for Poulin and a 3rd.
I dunno. I would be willing to offer some young piece for him and take the risk. He easily slots into the hole that will be created when we move DOC.
Salary Cap: Pens '24-'25 Salary Thread: The Crosbicles Volume XIX
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Depends. Maybe you get Hoglander for Poulin and a 3rd.
I dunno. I would be willing to offer some young piece for him and take the risk. He easily slots into the hole that will be created when we move DOC.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
I don't really care about Poulin enough to say no to that, but I think that's about as high as I'd go. I agree with your take of a 3rd and Nieto/Puljujarvi/Acciari/Poulin/ect.
Gurglesons
Registered User
I would probably also give them DOC for him straight up.
Which is IMO a 2nd round pick of value.
This is just straight up erasure of how much Dominik Simon annoyed everyone on this forum other than me. The disrespect!
Blueger also arguably falls under this and so, in a minor way, does Bjorkqvist considering AHL numbers to NHL appearances.
Tbh, once accounting for Sullivan's preference for guys who play hard and don't take big risks with the puck, and for siding with big investments made by the org, I've never really got the anti-European/pro-American narrative.
If you take Dubas' reload statements seriously, they'd absolutely jump on a difference making top line forward with the hope of accelerating things.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
Yeah Blueger is another good example of it, that was a guy that slipped my mind. Like I said, I think it's a playstyle bias that just happens to align with American grinders/go against Euro finesse offensive players. I think Sullivan's lineup decisions have been consistent, albeit frustrating.
When I hear people here complain about guys like Puustinen, Riikola and Zohorna as proof that Sullivan hates Euros, it just confuses me because all of those guys weren't good in the first place anyway. Zohorna put up 7 points in 33 games last year, which included him putting up 1 point in his last 20 games. Puustinen put up an 8 goal, 25 point pace in his last 50 NHL games before getting waived this year (5 goals and 15 points in 50 games). Riikola regularly had defensive gaffes while producing at Chad Ruhwedel levels offensively. Like what did Sullivan miss there with those guys? They all stunk.
Even with Puljujarvi, he had a similar situation to Zohorna and Puustinen in that he produced a lot at first but then his production fell off significantly. He had 5 points in his first 6 games, but since has only 3 points in 15 games. It's the same thing Puustinen did (7 points in the first 10 games, 13 points in 42 games after) and Zohorna did (5 points in first 9 games, 2 points in 24 games after) last year.
I don’t want to see MPets be apart of any Hoglander/Robertson trade. That’s where Dubas f***ed up last year and got some iffy returns in the Guentzel trade.
Would rather see Hoglander for a 3rd+ player we don’t need. Then sell Pets off to some desperate for him at the trade deadline.
Would rather see Hoglander for a 3rd+ player we don’t need. Then sell Pets off to some desperate for him at the trade deadline.
Randy Butternubs
Registurd User
I'm sad that Blueger is gone but am glad he got a Cup.
DesertPenguin
Registered User
- Apr 22, 2015
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You might want them to be in a full rebuild, but Dubas wants to go on the fly and compete within the bounds of Sid's contract. In any case, what's the point of adding Hoglander if you don't have room to play him?
Go get the Hoglander equivalent of a LHD, especially if Pettersson is going the other direction.
Malkinstheman
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- Aug 12, 2012
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Ryder71
Registered User
- Nov 24, 2017
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It depends on the other pieces. If they're not fairly significant I'd agree. But let me ask you something, what team values Petts more than the Canucks would? Their brain trust thinks very highly of him. And while JR doesn't directly call the shots, he does have influence. They'd likely be pretty generous with the return we'd garner. Just not real sure about the Canucks wanting to go all in, or further in with their current team.
Both DOC and Puljujarvi are currently guys that should be considered up for sale at the deadline unless they're signing new contracts, and they shouldn't hesitate to listen on Bunting, Rust, and Rakell either (particularly Bunting). As such, I'd expect them to have space to play Hoglander and don't see that an issue if the price and fit is right.
- Jun 13, 2010
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Lol, be careful - if you use logic like that HandShakeLine is going to accuse you of defending JJ.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
They would have room to play him, though. O'Connor and Puljujarvi likely won't be back next year and they should absolutely be exploring trading Rust, Rakell and/or Bunting for futures if they can.
Honestly their only top-9 winger who should absolutely be here next year is Tomasino.
Gurglesons
Registered User
I think people expecting a tear it down to the studs rebuild are going to be very disappointed the next two years.
Not sure how much that even matters any more when the Pens are bad even without doing that.
pistolpete11
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2013
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I don't know about others, but when I say Sullivan is anti-Euro and pro-NA, I'm not saying he's actually xenophobic. So, sure, call it a preferred play style, but that doesn't make it any better when it leads to the Matt Nieto's, Noel Acciari's, and Jansen Harkins's of the world consistently getting played over guys who at least have the potential to score. It's not exactly like Acciari and Nieto are shutting things down defensively either.
The fourth line and Graves-Grz are costing the Pens games…this was posted on another site after the game last night lol:
Hayes, Beauvillier, and Acciari were the only 3 Penguins below 50% in Corsi, all in the 33-37% range.
Matt Nieto, 50%+ in Corsi 3 out of 9 games played.
Noel Acciari, 50%+ in Corsi in 12 out of 30 games played.
Kevin Hayes, 50%+ in Corsi in 9 out of 22 games played.
Jesse Puljujarvi, 50%+ Corsi in 13 of 21 games played.
Blake Lizotte, 50%+ Corsi in 8 of 14 games played.
Anthony Beauvillier, 50%+ Corsi in 15 of 30 games played.
Cody Glass, 50%+ Corsi in 11 of 17 games played.
PLAY THE YOUNGER GUYS.
DesertedPenguin
Registered User
- Mar 11, 2007
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This was shared in a different thread, but looks like Filip Hallander may be returning next season.
www.expressen.se
Hållander allt närmre NHL – Pittsburgh erbjuder avtal
Filip Hållander har varit en av SHL:s främsta spelare i höst och Timråtränaren Olli Jokinen tycker att forwarden spelar i fel liga. Mycket pekar nu också på att han är förlorad för klubben. Enligt uppgifter till Expressen kommer Hållander allt närmare spel i NHL den kommande säsongen, då...
www.expressen.se
Empoleon8771
Registered User
Hallander coming back would be terrific for the bottom-6, I really hope that ends up being true. I'd be curious to see where he plays, I think they already have Lizotte at 3C and Ponomarev at 4C for next year but they could likely move one of those guys to the wing as well.
I think I'd be advocating for trading Bunting and running with a 3rd line of Lizotte-Hallander-McGroarty if Hallander comes back next year. Hallander's SHL performance suggests he'd be a 3C caliber player in the NHL right now, it's similar to what Soderberg was doing in the SHL before jumping into Boston's middle-6 as a center.
I think I'd be advocating for trading Bunting and running with a 3rd line of Lizotte-Hallander-McGroarty if Hallander comes back next year. Hallander's SHL performance suggests he'd be a 3C caliber player in the NHL right now, it's similar to what Soderberg was doing in the SHL before jumping into Boston's middle-6 as a center.
molon labe
Registered User
Team needs scoring in the worst way. This dead horse being revitalized - but for, what, 4 straight years now, we (some of us) have argued about the lack of overall goal totals and desperate need to revitalize the top 6.
Counter points were either that this blueline would increase the goal throughput of our bottom 9 (l.o.l.) or that none of it mattered because Sullivan was responsible for our bottom 6 underproducing.
Flat out, without TWO strong top 6 NHL forwards, this team will be dead in the water even with an entirely new front office and better defensive corps. Sid looked straight up trash last night - lazily flipping backhanded passes all night - and Geno had some moves but they're just not all that strong anymore. When they were on the same line, happenstance (Rakell) had the puck turn over - but you had the feeling we might actually score. If people woke up, thought for a second, you might remember that's what it's like to have legitimate top 6 scoring in the NHL. Sid and Geno are good to above good - together they could form a great top line. .....well....great teams usually have a great top line and pretty good second line. We have nothing. So, we're going to continue to lose and lose and lose and lose - if nothing else to averages because this teams' offense might be its' single worst attribute, and that's saying something because our defense is putrid, goaltending awful, and coaching staff a future case study in front office insanity.
No other team would be shelling DOC in top 6 minute over and over like he belongs there. Not even other bottom feeders. For some reason - maybe it's Sid obsesses with his own brand of 'elevating players', maybe it's dummy Dubas who only watches junior hockey, maybe it's Sullivan who looks like he should be a loan shark - we continually put out these trash ass line combos with forwards who would all be fighting for 13th on other clubs. We freaking stink top to bottom and it's yet another year where we're arguing whether Hexta...Sulli...Dubas.... will grant us some overrated bottom feeder like Hoglander.
Shit or get off the pot. This isn't an NHL team at this point.
Counter points were either that this blueline would increase the goal throughput of our bottom 9 (l.o.l.) or that none of it mattered because Sullivan was responsible for our bottom 6 underproducing.
Flat out, without TWO strong top 6 NHL forwards, this team will be dead in the water even with an entirely new front office and better defensive corps. Sid looked straight up trash last night - lazily flipping backhanded passes all night - and Geno had some moves but they're just not all that strong anymore. When they were on the same line, happenstance (Rakell) had the puck turn over - but you had the feeling we might actually score. If people woke up, thought for a second, you might remember that's what it's like to have legitimate top 6 scoring in the NHL. Sid and Geno are good to above good - together they could form a great top line. .....well....great teams usually have a great top line and pretty good second line. We have nothing. So, we're going to continue to lose and lose and lose and lose - if nothing else to averages because this teams' offense might be its' single worst attribute, and that's saying something because our defense is putrid, goaltending awful, and coaching staff a future case study in front office insanity.
No other team would be shelling DOC in top 6 minute over and over like he belongs there. Not even other bottom feeders. For some reason - maybe it's Sid obsesses with his own brand of 'elevating players', maybe it's dummy Dubas who only watches junior hockey, maybe it's Sullivan who looks like he should be a loan shark - we continually put out these trash ass line combos with forwards who would all be fighting for 13th on other clubs. We freaking stink top to bottom and it's yet another year where we're arguing whether Hexta...Sulli...Dubas.... will grant us some overrated bottom feeder like Hoglander.
Shit or get off the pot. This isn't an NHL team at this point.
BusinessGoose
Registered User
Just re-name them the Pittsburgh Ice Pirates
That's the trajectory
Crap owners, crap managers
Struggling aging stars
Ineffective stop gaps
A few bright prospects... Sorta...
That's the trajectory
Crap owners, crap managers
Struggling aging stars
Ineffective stop gaps
A few bright prospects... Sorta...
Well he is -13 5 on 5, the others over -10: DOC -14, Tanger -10, Hayes -11, Rust -12, Acciari -15
I think Rakell is the only + player of significant playing time… telling
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