TSN: Pearson traded to Pittsburgh

[KingsFan7824]

Pearson should have been swapped for a pick or for a player of similar age who needs a change of scenery, like Ryan Strome (for example).

You have to find a team that wants to trade their problem for your problem. Maybe nobody else wanted Pearson for their own problem. Maybe nobody else wanted to trade a pick for $3.75m on the cap until 2021. Maybe Blake should've held onto Pearson and watched him do nothing for the rest of the season. Maybe Pearson could've turned it around and had a great 2nd half.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Yeah, that's what happened, and I never said back in 2010 to be patient because Lombardi was on the right track and the Kings would be cup contenders soon. I just kept saying it until I was right. Truly the most obtuse arguments ever presented on this site are by GBH, and sometimes by RJ.

There I fixed it for Technical Ted, because GBH and RJ are both wrong in this case.

Actually my argument is that even with foresight NO ONE predicted THIS level of suckage, and the level of suckage DOES in fact matter (which is what SettlementRichie disagrees with) because it affects how a whole lot of people view the state of the organization, player value, etc.

THAT is why you can't pretend anyone 'saw this coming,' and why I take issue with people being lectured about it. You even said above that this team should be a 'black hole' team. Long way between that and deal last.

You and I simply disagreed before, I know you remember our conversations. I said retool. You said rebuild. Different philosophies, and that's fine. Had I seen anything like this coming at all? I would have said rebuild a year ago when Sutter was canned, as I'm sure many others would have as well.

Go ahead and tell me which part is wrong or just disagreeable on opinion.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Actually my argument is that even with foresight NO ONE predicted THIS level of suckage, and the level of suckage DOES in fact matter (which is what SettlementRichie disagrees with) because it affects how a whole lot of people view the state of the organization, player value, etc.

THAT is why you can't pretend anyone 'saw this coming,' and why I take issue with people being lectured about it. You even said above that this team should be a 'black hole' team. Long way between that and deal last.

You and I simply disagreed before, I know you remember our conversations. I said retool. You said rebuild. Different philosophies, and that's fine. Had I seen anything like this coming at all? I would have said rebuild a year ago when Sutter was canned, as I'm sure many others would have as well.

Go ahead and tell me which part is wrong or just disagreeable on opinion.

The level of suckage is absolute key to the argument.....if there's no suckage....then there's on argument, a little bit...Kings are still playing much better hockey....and it goes on incremently,

That's why I said, if Winnipeg had THIS level of suckage, would he be advocating blowing that up?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

The level of suckage is absolute key to the argument.....if there's no suckage....then there's on argument, a little bit...Kings are still playing much better hockey....and it goes on incremently,

That's why I said, if Winnipeg had THIS level of suckage, would he be advocating blowing that up?

If there's no suckage, I think you still have to keep one eye of the future with aging vets, but with higher values, you start your retool. I fully expected them to be around where they were last year. I was horribly wrong. I don't see how that opinion--evidence-based, as well--can be utterly mocked.

If it were WPG, they'd probably just finally fire their coach, and they actually might do the opposite--trade some potential for some stable vets.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

If there's no suckage, I think you still have to keep one eye of the future with aging vets, but with higher values, you start your retool. I fully expected them to be around where they were last year. I was horribly wrong. I don't see how that opinion--evidence-based, as well--can be utterly mocked.

If it were WPG, they'd probably just finally fire their coach, and they actually might do the opposite--trade some potential for some stable vets.

Agree, let's say they come FLYING out of the gate this year, everyone running on full cyclinders, we are at 14-5-3 or whatever etc, YOU WOULD STILL HAVE TO MAKE MOVES, be it at the TDL, be it off-season, 6M cap space next year, 14 rostered players, something has to give.

The only thing this level of suckage DOES, is that the broken clock in the room gets to say, see, I told you so, but it accelerates the moves that HAD to be made, we still have to move a Toffoli, Muzzin, Martinez or Carter, 2 of the 4 have to go to make room for everything else....

 

[riznat]

The level of suckage is absolute key to the argument.....if there's no suckage....then there's on argument, a little bit...Kings are still playing much better hockey....and it goes on incremently,

That's why I said, if Winnipeg had THIS level of suckage, would he be advocating blowing that up?

Have not seen “much better hockey” we just lost 5-1.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Have not seen “much better hockey” we just lost 5-1.

LOL hypothetical, I was going down the scale......no, Kings haven't played much better hockey....for a sustained amount of time at all this season, they have had spurts...almost like a gas engine sputtering to go full tilt.....they just never got there

 

[KINGS17]

Actually my argument is that even with foresight NO ONE predicted THIS level of suckage, and the level of suckage DOES in fact matter (which is what SettlementRichie disagrees with) because it affects how a whole lot of people view the state of the organization, player value, etc.

THAT is why you can't pretend anyone 'saw this coming,' and why I take issue with people being lectured about it. You even said above that this team should be a 'black hole' team. Long way between that and deal last.

You and I simply disagreed before, I know you remember our conversations. I said retool. You said rebuild. Different philosophies, and that's fine. Had I seen anything like this coming at all? I would have said rebuild a year ago when Sutter was canned, as I'm sure many others would have as well.

Go ahead and tell me which part is wrong or just disagreeable on opinion.

I expected the Kings to tread water again this season much as they did last season. I think where our difference in philosophy lies in the "retool" vs "rebuild" argument. No organization should want to stay in the black hole, and I think you would agree. When I look at this roster I don't see a retooling as being successful because the age of the most highly compensated players and/or their sporadic production doesn't support it. I have advocated moving Carter for at least two years now and was told it wasn't necessary because he was going to be great for many years to come.

All players fade eventually. I see no reason to keep the vets when the Kings are a black hole team. My concern now is the team will start playing well enough to get out of DFL when they are about to get an opportunity in the lottery to draft an extremely talented and entertaining player.

In my opinion the odds of an aging black hole team of regaining prominence are small. If that's where an NHL organization finds itself, it's time to admit the window is closed and start working on the next window.

In response to the Winnipeg argument, it's a non-sequitur because they aren't DFL. It's a BS hypothetical. The Jets are a good young team, so of course you wouldn't blow it up even if they are struggling, just as Lombardi didn't blow it up when the Kings were struggling early in the 2011-12 season.

Comparing the Jets today to the Kings today is an asinine exercise.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I expected the Kings to tread water again this season much as they did last season. I think where our difference in philosophy lies in the "retool" vs "rebuild" argument. No organization should want to stay in the black hole, and I think you would agree. When I look at this roster I don't see a retooling as being successful because the age of the most highly compensated players and/or their sporadic production doesn't support it. I have advocated moving Carter for at least two years now and was told it wasn't necessary because he was going to be great for many years to come.

All players fade eventually. I see no reason to keep the vets when the Kings are a black hole team. My concern now is the team will start playing well enough to get out of DFL when they are about to get an opportunity in the lottery to draft an extremely talented and entertaining player.

In my opinion the odds of an aging black hole team of regaining prominence are small. If that's where an NHL organization finds itself, it's time to admit the window is closed and start working on the next window.

In response to the Winnipeg argument, it's a non-sequitur because they aren't DFL. It's a BS hypothetical. The Jets are a good young team, so of course you wouldn't blow it up even if they are struggling, just as Lombardi didn't blow it up when the Kings were struggling early in the 2011-12 season.

Comparing the Jets today to the Kings today is an asinine exercise.

I can agree with that, but here's where we disagree, I can understand what they were looking at this past off-season, defense strong, offense needed help, add Kovalchuk, they SHOULD have been competitive, etc....you just disregard that as...I dunno...wishful thinking? When if you look around the league, it's simply not, it doesn't add up....last year the #1 thing the Kings needed to add, was offense, they added that offense...that should have provided the spark, and pushed people in the right position etc....you can't fault them for being optimistic about a team featuring Kopitar, Doughy, Quick, Kovalchuk, Carter, Toffoli etc....

 

[Mats26]

I heard on local radio this morning that Rutherford was asking about Tanner weeks ago and RB finally came around and pulled the trigger on this deal. I think it was the only solid deal he had for Tanner at the time.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Wish we could have pulled Sprong. He's intriguing. Don't blame them for holding him though.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

The degree of suckage only matters if it affects one’s argument as to the direction of the franchise: rebuild v. retool v. staying the course.

In the specific context of this debate, “black hole v. last place” doesn’t matter, because either way we are advocating for a rebuild. If the Kings were in a playoff position, we would be saying the exact same thing: this team is not a contender; we need to rebuild. Just like last year. No one in the rebuild camp has changed their tune, even when we made the playoffs again last year, especially when we made the playoffs again last year.

The team’s current position only further reinforces the argument for a full rebuild. That’s the only reason the “hindsight” retort is coming up. Those in the retool or stay the course camps have lost all footing for their positions.

 

[AlphaBravo]

The lines between retool and rebuild are sort of blurred. My personal opinion is that the Kings should keep Kopitar, Doughty and Brown, get valuable prospects and picks for players like Carter, Muzzin or Martinez, and Toffoli, and try to dump Clifford, Lewis, Phaneuf, Thompson (although this is unlikely).

With respect to goaltending, if Quick is back and gets hot, I would try to find a trade partner for him at the deadline. Not sure anyone would take him because of his injury history, but there might be a desperate team looking for a cup run with a hot proven goalie who would take a chance. Next year, I feel comfortable running with Campbell and Peterson. We can get a vet backup as well on a one year deal if Peterson needs more time to develop.

 

[AlphaBravo]

The degree of suckage only matters if it affects one’s argument as to the direction of the franchise: rebuild v. retool v. staying the course.

In the specific context of this debate, “black hole v. last place” doesn’t matter, because either way we are advocating for a rebuild. If the Kings were in a playoff position, we would be saying the exact same thing: this team is not a contender; we need to rebuild. Just like last year. No one in the rebuild camp has changed their tune, even when we made the playoffs again last year, especially when we made the playoffs again last year.

The team’s current position only further reinforces the argument for a full rebuild. That’s the only reason the “hindsight” retort is coming up. Those in the retool or stay the course camps have lost all footing for their positions.

The best thing that can happen to this franchise is if we finish last. Get a top 3 pick would do wonders to jump start the retool/rebuild (whatever you want to call it). Barely missing out on the playoffs because the team went hot does nothing for this team's short or long term future.

 

[KingsFan7824]

The degree of suckage only matters if it affects one’s argument as to the direction of the franchise: rebuild v. retool v. staying the course.

In the specific context of this debate, “black hole v. last place” doesn’t matter, because either way we are advocating for a rebuild. If the Kings were in a playoff position, we would be saying the exact same thing: this team is not a contender; we need to rebuild. Just like last year. No one in the rebuild camp has changed their tune, even when we made the playoffs again last year, especially when we made the playoffs again last year.

The team’s current position only further reinforces the argument for a full rebuild. That’s the only reason the “hindsight” retort is coming up. Those in the retool or stay the course camps have lost all footing for their positions.

The issue with wanting a real rebuilding project is that most teams don't do it unless forced by circumstance. Be it players leaving willingly, or the team going down the toilet. Hell even the Rangers are currently in a playoff spot after a huge letter to fans about rebuilding 6 months ago.

 

[domaug]

Wish we could have pulled Sprong. He's intriguing. Don't blame them for holding him though.

i think Sprong is still on the table if not getting shopped around secretly. just wouldn't have worked in a deal like this without adding a piece or two from the Kings and salary from the Pens.

 

[YP44]

after sleeping on this deal for a day....I do not like it. I am going to miss Pearson and think he will do really well in Pittsburgh. Sounds like he will be part of another that 70's line.

I get why the deal was made and I am glad Blake is doing something. Just the emotional part of me does not like it. I hope Hagelin gets hot and then is flipped for a pick better than what we could have got for Pearson. Nice thing about Hagelin is LA should have no issues retaining 50% of his remaining 3.75 if a team needs.

 

[ncm7772]

he can easily be flipped at the deadline. how about a scouting report for us pen fans?

I'm sure someone has beaten me to it, but here goes.

I think you guys will like Hagelin. We did. Dude is fast, absolutely busts his butt and is a heck of a penalty killer. Is decent to solid in his own zone. Has an ability to generate off the forecheck. Can be a menace in the offensive zone when he's on his game.

Now for the negatives. Has horrible hands. Regularly flubs shots, sometimes missing the net by a hilarious margin. Sometimes has trouble accepting passes. Streaky player - has streaks where he looks great, then has streaks like he's had this year. Also, not a spring chicken at 30.

There, a brief, non-biased scout from a Pens fan!

Anyone willing to give me the same for Pearson? Can be brief. Thanks in advance!

 

[The Old Master]

I'm sure someone has beaten me to it, but here goes.

I think you guys will like Hagelin. We did. Dude is fast, absolutely busts his butt and is a heck of a penalty killer. Is decent to solid in his own zone. Has an ability to generate off the forecheck. Can be a menace in the offensive zone when he's on his game.

Now for the negatives. Has horrible hands. Regularly flubs shots, sometimes missing the net by a hilarious margin. Sometimes has trouble accepting passes. Streaky player - has streaks where he looks great, then has streaks like he's had this year. Also, not a spring chicken at 30.

There, a brief, non-biased scout from a Pens fan!

Anyone willing to give me the same for Pearson? Can be brief. Thanks in advance!

thanks, but I was referring to pearson should of said hags can be flipped, and a scouting report on pearson for us pen fans

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I'm sure someone has beaten me to it, but here goes.

I think you guys will like Hagelin. We did. Dude is fast, absolutely busts his butt and is a heck of a penalty killer. Is decent to solid in his own zone. Has an ability to generate off the forecheck. Can be a menace in the offensive zone when he's on his game.

Now for the negatives. Has horrible hands. Regularly flubs shots, sometimes missing the net by a hilarious margin. Sometimes has trouble accepting passes. Streaky player - has streaks where he looks great, then has streaks like he's had this year. Also, not a spring chicken at 30.

There, a brief, non-biased scout from a Pens fan!

Anyone willing to give me the same for Pearson? Can be brief. Thanks in advance!

Like this, but with better hands and slower feet Can play on any line.

I posted this in the trade board thread a few moments ago:

He plays a very simple, effective north south game when he's at his best. Excellent forechecker and disruptor, much better vision than he'll get credit for. If Hagelin played well with Malkin, I don't see why Pearson couldn't, he just makes life simple. This year obviously he wasn't doing that and I think the ongoing question mark will be his recovery from the leg injury as it affected his speed. At worst, he's a reliable top-9 guy. not going to put extra emphasis on his struggles this year because the entire Kings team looks like they forgot hockey.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Go Kings, Go!

Can finally forever delete this mantra::::

As long as the Kings have: Quick, Kopitar and Doughty, Cups are possible!

They've had those 3 since 2008-09 season. 9+ years. All King drafted. They had 9 years to draft just ONE more star player and if so,
possibly could still be contenders. If they had Quick, Kopitar, Doughty and just one more star forward (as in 80 point perennial
player) drafted in 9 fricking years, could have probably been contending still. Piss poor drafting is one of the main reasons
the Kings are where they are. Then crazy shtt like Voynov and Richards things didn't help. Poor drafting the last 9 years
has cost the Kings dearly and a main reason why they are what they are.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I'm sure someone has beaten me to it, but here goes.

I think you guys will like Hagelin. We did. Dude is fast, absolutely busts his butt and is a heck of a penalty killer. Is decent to solid in his own zone. Has an ability to generate off the forecheck. Can be a menace in the offensive zone when he's on his game.

Now for the negatives. Has horrible hands. Regularly flubs shots, sometimes missing the net by a hilarious margin. Sometimes has trouble accepting passes. Streaky player - has streaks where he looks great, then has streaks like he's had this year. Also, not a spring chicken at 30.

There, a brief, non-biased scout from a Pens fan!

Anyone willing to give me the same for Pearson? Can be brief. Thanks in advance!

When he's on, he's got some speed, will stand in front of the net, maybe dig a puck out. Every now and then, he'll show some hands. He won't drive the play though. Nothing exceptional about him. He's a dependent winger, which isn't necessarily a bad thing on Pittsburgh. Not all that different from Hagelin in the general type of player they are. Basically a dude, and if he gets on the right team, at the right time, in the right circumstance, he can make some kind of difference.

If he doesn't get a bump of energy being traded to the Pens, then he's really off this year. But over time, he'll probably settle into what he is, which is a lower end 2nd line guy/solid 3rd liner. Crosby/Malkin is a bit different than Kopitar/Carter though, so picking up a few more points is certainly possible. Taking the 2 extra years, I'm sure the Pens are banking on that happening.

Now everything can be colored by the fact that he's been a King in the Lombardi/Sutter throw everything at the net years. There might be a hidden 30 goal guy in there somewhere who will be considered underpaid.

 

[KingsHockey24]

Wish we could have pulled Sprong. He's intriguing. Don't blame them for holding him though.

Brodzinski 2.0

 

[Steve Zissou]

Hagelin was one of the last players I've would have wanted to don a Kings uni.

Dude is fast but all flash in the pants with absolutely zero finish.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

after sleeping on this deal for a day....I do not like it. I am going to miss Pearson

LOL, why? Oh, I know...it's the 1 assist in 17 games this season?