Panarin: Yes or No?

[NYSPORTS]

Glen Sather would offer $19 million per year

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Glen Sather would offer $19 million per year

I mean he is a Tort's Kinda guy ...

 

[Ghost of jas]

If the Rangers were going hard after Panarin, he'd be a Ranger. They're not, so here we sit.

 

[Priorae]

I agree with what the Rangers are doing. I don't want Panarin at 11 million, let alone 13. But to argue that they went hard after him is just ridiculous. The Rangers offered him a contract, well below market value, and said take it or leave it. While 11 million is still a lot of money - it's 14 million less over 7 years. 14 million is a lot of money.

I think you're hitting on what is causing some delay. Pretty easy to envision a scenario where the Rangers low bid, he wanted to come play for them, and now he's trying to decide between competitive bids and the team he wants to play for. (Ala Shattenkirk).

The truth is if he signs with NYR for 10-111 it'll be seen as a win, but I still think its wrong place / wrong time.

 

[Crease]

The numbers floating around Panarin are terrifying.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

I think you're hitting on what is causing some delay. Pretty easy to envision a scenario where the Rangers low bid, he wanted to come play for them, and now he's trying to decide between competitive bids and the team he wants to play for. (Ala Shattenkirk).

The truth is if he signs with NYR for 10-111 it'll be seen as a win, but I still think its wrong place / wrong time.

Completely agree.

Although it seems far-fetched how much Panarin could truly want to play here. Shatty grew up in NY. He was a diehard. Tavares wore Toronto pajamas. Panarin grew up in Russia. It just can't be the same connection. Maybe he is attracted by all the young, Russian pieces we have, even more so than the team.

 

[chosen]

And...

And what?

 

[chosen]

Each one is entitled to their opinion. Mine varies. For reasons state over and over again.

No one is debating that. However, if you say that he is going to be a very good first liner in his rookie year (one that he does not turn 19 until February) history tells you that is a very, very long shot.

He is supposed to be a franchise player. Which other franchise players are you comparing him with?

 

[chosen]

I

Until you can look with a straight face (via computer) and tell yourself who is replacing the production of
Hayes and Zucc, they are not going to be a better team this year. As constituted, if ALL goes incredibly well, they can be a bubble team. That presumes A LOT. If all goes according to natural accretion, they are a lottery team.

I find it odd that you are omitting the vastly improved defense in your analysis.

I also believe that Kakko will be an immense improvement over either Hayes or Zucc.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

I


I find it odd that you are omitting the vastly improved defense in your analysis.

I also believe that Kakko will be an immense improvement over either Hayes or Zucc.

An immense improvement? So you are penciling Kakko in for what, 70-80 points? Even at that, his production won't replace Hayes and Zucc combined. Not to mention if we end up losing Kreider.

Also, I don't see how our defense is dramatically improved. That left side is still absolutely atrocious. And there is little that can be done to fix it this off-season.

 

[ModryJazyk]

No.

I'm where I was a week or so ago.

Just can't see paying $10, $11, $12 million a year for this player.

We're gonna need some it to pay for perhaps Kakko, Kravstov, Shesty, Miller, Fox, etc.

I'd rather put it there.

Panarin didnt score 30 goals since he played w/o Patrick Kane, now some teams are ready to pay that 28 goal scorer Panarin more money than actually 44 G Kane gets per season.I dont get it.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Panarin didnt score 30 goals since he played w/o Patrick Kane, now some teams are ready to pay that 28 goal scorer Panarin more money than actually 44 G Kane gets per season.I dont get it.

It’s a free agency bloodlust and lack of patience. People running from the reality of the situation.

 

[bbny]

I mean, I agree - they understand their limit - which also, in turn, means they didn't go hard after him.

The fact is, if the Rangers really wanted Panarin, he would almost certainly be a Ranger. It's so obvious he wants to be here. So why wasn't he announced already? Because the Rangers haven't 'gone hard' after him. They've offered him nearly 2 million less than other teams.

I agree with what the Rangers are doing. I don't want Panarin at 11 million, let alone 13. But to argue that they went hard after him is just ridiculous. The Rangers offered him a contract, well below market value, and said take it or leave it. While 11 million is still a lot of money - it's 14 million less over 7 years. 14 million is a lot of money.

The Blue Jackets' last ditch offer is not the baseline for other teams. The GMs all know he wants out of Columbus. They would have to be suckers to up their offer. Going hard does not mean being stupid. The Ramgers have made a very strong offer and pitch, or they wouldn't be one of the final teams involved.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

The Blue Jackets' last ditch offer is not the baseline for other teams. The GMs all know he wants out of Columbus. They would have to be suckers to up their offer. Going hard does not mean being stupid. The Ramgers have made a very strong offer and pitch, or they wouldn't be one of the final teams involved.

There are multiple teams offering more than the Rangers. If they were going hard, they would be offering at least close to what those other teams were.

Basically, your definition of 'going hard' is putting in about 75% effort.

 

[bbny]

There are multiple teams offering more than the Rangers. If they were going hard, they would be offering at least close to what those other teams were.

Basically, your definition of 'going hard' is putting in about 75% effort.

No, for the same reason getting an A- instead of an A doesn't mean you didn't try hard. Semantics at this point.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

No, for the same reason getting an A- instead of an A doesn't mean you didn't try hard. Semantics at this point.

No, it's not semantics. And this argument is bad. The end result does not illustrate the amount of effort. A student who gets an A- may have tried twice as hard as a student who receives an A. Thus, the student with a lower grade 'went harder' than the student who scored higher.

The same can be said of the situation here. According to reports, all 3 teams involved are offering better deals than the Rangers. Thus, they are exerting more of an effort to sign him. CBJ 'went hard,' if their reported offer was true. The Islanders are 'going hard.' The Rangers are giving 75% and saying 'take what we offer or walk.'

Now, they may very well come up and sign him at 12 or 13 and I will change my tune. But if they miss out on him, it seems quite clear that it's because they didn't 'go hard' after him. From all accounts, it appears that if they matched any of the better offers dollar for dollar (even despite the tax impacts), he would be on his way here.

 

[bbny]

No, it's not semantics. And this argument is bad. The end result does not illustrate the amount of effort. A student who gets an A- may have tried twice as hard as a student who receives an A. Thus, the student with a lower grade 'went harder' than the student who scored higher.

The same can be said of the situation here. According to reports, all 3 teams involved are offering better deals than the Rangers. Thus, they are exerting more of an effort to sign him. CBJ 'went hard,' if their reported offer was true. The Islanders are 'going hard.' The Rangers are giving 75% and saying 'take what we offer or walk.'

Now, they may very well come up and sign him at 12 or 13 and I will change my tune. But if they miss out on him, it seems quite clear that it's because they didn't 'go hard' after him. From all accounts, it appears that if they matched any of the better offers dollar for dollar (even despite the tax impacts), he would be on his way here.

If go hard == sign at all costs sure. I just disagree. And again, the initial comment I made about winning a poll was facetious in the first place lol. Are you that upset about being on the wrong end of the poll?

 

[chosen]

An immense improvement? So you are penciling Kakko in for what, 70-80 points? Even at that, his production won't replace Hayes and Zucc combined. Not to mention if we end up losing Kreider.

Also, I don't see how our defense is dramatically improved. That left side is still absolutely atrocious. And there is little that can be done to fix it this off-season.

If we accept the premise of Kakko being a franchise player, he will be far superior to either Hayes or Zucc, neither of whom is a very good 1st-liner.

I would rather have Kakko and Kravtsov this season than Hayes and Zucc.

Anytime you add a very good top-pairing defenseman you greatly improve your entire defense. If Fox makes the top 6, the D is up another notch.

I also expect next season's Chytil to take a nice step forward, else he probably won't amount to much.

Howden and Anderson should also be better.

I have been negative about this team for years. This team is trending way up. They aren't a Cup contender, but they are a Playoffs contender.

For them to be a lottery team, it will either be caused by injuries or the Rangers having vastly overrated young assets.

No comment on Kreider because right now he's a Ranger.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

If go hard == sign at all costs sure. I just disagree. And again, the initial comment I made about winning a poll was facetious in the first place lol. Are you that upset about being on the wrong end of the poll?

I really don't understand comments like this. It's what leads to friction on these boards. Obviously I'm not upset. Like anything, it's a standard board disagreement that is being debated ad nauseam because it's summer.

If we accept the premise of Kakko being a franchise player, he will be far superior to either Hayes or Zucc, neither of whom is a very good 1st-liner.

I would rather have Kakko and Kravtsov this season than Hayes and Zucc.

Anytime you add a very good top-pairing defenseman you greatly improve your entire defense. If Fox makes the top 6, the D is up another notch.

I also expect next season's Chytil to take a nice step forward, else he probably won't amount to much.

Howden and Anderson should also be better.

I have been negative about this team for years. This team is trending way up. They aren't a Cup contender, but they are a Playoffs contender.

For them to be a lottery team, it will either be caused by injuries or the Rangers having vastly overrated young assets.

No comment on Kreider because right now he's a Ranger.

So basically you're expecting all of our rookies and second year players to either step-in and perform enormously well, or regarding the latter, take huge steps forward.

I'm sorry, but there is just no way that Kakko, Kravtsov, Fox, Chytil, Lias, and Howden are all having great seasons next year. A few are bound to disappoint.

Add to that the fact that you are placing seemingly unrealistic expectations on KK and Kravtsov, that you are almost sure to face disappointment.

The team is trending up, but next year is hardly the year that will show any sort of legitimate results in my opinion.

I also think it's kinda frustrating to see the pressure that is being heaped upon these kids to perform when they haven't even played a game on NA ice yet.