Ottawa 67's 2023-24 Season Thread (Part One)

[OMG67]

LOL I know OMG is going to go nuts BUT

I think this team, as it stands is good enough to stay status quo.

Here are the problems with everyone's thinking

Defence I can tell you that a few teams are looking for a top 4 RHD just look down Highway 15.

No one is going to trade us an 18-year-old LW or a center without it costing us big time. Unless we are willing to give up more than one player in a deal.

Right now due to injuries, we are at a skeleton lineup.

We can not afford to give up players and we sure as hell can not afford to give up high draft picks.

The only question is the one that OMG asked and that is what do they see for this year.

Next year Mississauga is going to be strong. Kingston should be stronger. So winning the division and conference is not a given.

I think that we have to be reasonable and realize that we do not have to be first every year just to get the playoff experience for our players. Most of these guys already have it.

Today's game is going to answer a few questions for us as to how good we are Kingson is not the cake walk that it was a month ago.

I think you have to look at it from the perspective that Mississauga will be VERY strong next season and are holding four 2nds in 2025. Those are gold from a value perspective.

that is to say the competition next season will be VERY VERY stiff. Of course, we can never say for sure but if we are truly projecting, next season should be strong for Ottawa without a doubt. I still think they can compete at the highest level next season. It is more so that the competition at the highest level is a much higher level than what we are seeing this season.

As you said, we can stay status quo and maybe even trade Stonehouse and still win the division or at least nail down home ice in a worst case scenario. So, I can definitley see where you are coming from.

Regarding the 18 year old, that spot will still likely need to be filled next year. So, if it is three 2nds and two 3rds this year for an 18 year old or two 2nds and three 3rds next year for a 19 year old (assuming that is accurate), I think the trade value difference isn’t enough to not nail down that player this year. It may be cheaper in the aggregate to do it that way.

If I use the Haight trade from last year compared to the Harrison/Zhilkin/Arcuri deals last year, the logic does make sense. That requires an 18 year old centre like Haight was last year being available though. I don’t know that trade exists. Haight scored 51 in 42 games last season and has 20 in 17 games this year. The cost was three 2nds and two 3rds. This is why I think if we are near 100% likley to add a centre next year, keep eyes open this year.

EDIT:
Pano Fimis is another example of a strong 18 year old centre that went for three 2nds and two 3rds.

 

[beastintheeast]

I agree that Mississauga will be stronger next year, but then again with the way this conference is they are strong right now without really having to do much.
I know Sudbury is supposed to be strong but have not seen it yet

If we can find a good 18-year-old CENTER at a reasonable price then sure go for it.

But again it all depends on what Boyd and Cameron see for this team this year and what the plan is down the road.

 

[frontsfan67]

I agree that Mississauga will be stronger next year, but then again with the way this conference is they are strong right now without really having to do much.
I know Sudbury is supposed to be strong but have not seen it yet

If we can find a good 18-year-old CENTER at a reasonable price then sure go for it.

But again it all depends on what Boyd and Cameron see for this team this year and what the plan is down the road.

Sudbury will be very strong. You have to realize for 1- they added a bunch of new faces so it always takes time for them to adjust



and 2- they’ve had some injury problems Both are factors to their start so far. The season is 68 games don’t worry about the teams now- worry about where they are at about Christmas. And after that where they finish the season. We will see a lot of teams rise and fall and make trades. Sudbury and London are both on paper the 2 most well put together teams in the league I’m sure they will both figure something out sooner rather than later.

 

[beastintheeast]

Sudbury will be very strong. You have to realize for 1- they added a bunch of new faces so it always takes time for them to adjust



and 2- they’ve had some injury problems Both are factors to their start so far. The season is 68 games don’t worry about the teams now- worry about where they are at about Christmas. And after that where they finish the season. We will see a lot of teams rise and fall and make trades. Sudbury and London are both on paper the 2 most well put together teams in the league I’m sure they will both figure something out sooner rather than later.

I am confused I just stated that I know they are strong but have not produced it yet.

I see Mississauga and Sudbury fighting for first which will be interesting. POnly time wil tell how good tey are off paper.

 

[dirty12]

I am confused I just stated that I know they are strong but have not produced it yet.

I see Mississauga and Sudbury fighting for first which will be interesting. POnly time wil tell how good tey are off paper.

If Miss goalies continue to be outstanding for their age, that is only position they can match the wolves

 

[PuckStop75]

We need the centre. Pinelli is not a natural centre. We tried this at the beginning of the year and his production was low and it wasn’t because he was playing with scrubs. Gardiner’s production was low because he was designated to play with the scrubs on the 3rd line.

Additionally, we have no centre depth. If we acquire a LW and shift Pinelli to the middle and one of them gets injured, we have a situation where we don’t have the centre depth to make up for it. At least if we acquire a centre and get an injury, maybe we can make due at that point shifting
Pinelli to centre for a short period.

Since Pinelli has lined up with Gardiner, the team has been clicking. You are trying to now separate them. I don’t understand why. If they are going out to acquire a forward, why get a LW? May as well get the centre. Shuffling the lines for the top 6 doesn’t make sense to me. Leave them alone. Get a 3rd line centre that can help put some teeth into the games of Gerrior and Kelly/Barlas. If/when Uronen returns, he can slide into the 3rd line with whomever that centre is and Gerrior. Or they can nudge Uronen up and pull Dever back to the 3rd line. Either/or. This allows for some depth coverage for injuries and allows for that flexibility needed over the course of a full season.

The team currently has Barlas, Gerrior and Hilton listed as LW, not sure I would call them scrubs but they are not top 6 forwards either. Pinelli has all the skills and tools to be a centre but like most 18 yo also needs players to play with at that position in the OHL. If injury strikes the team is screwed regardless, the basic principle is they need to assemble three lines to make a run in the playoffs.

The reason for separating Gardiner and Pinelli is to create depth, there is no depth created by loading up one line. The top teams in the league will isolate that line and take advantage of the mismatches further down the lineup. This is the difference between playoff hockey and regular season where once teams get to the second round they get man handled by teams with the kind of depth that Peterborough had last year.

When teams need to, the option always exists to load up one line but there is vulnerability created with that. Maybe this will make sense, Edmonton can play Draisatel and McDavid together and score lots of goals in the regular season but once they get to the playoffs they get shut down, year after year. If your a leaf fan, Matthews and Marner are another great example. People can micro analyze their situations and point at D and goaltending but ultimately it is a lack of team depth issue.

As I see it, the gap is on the wing, moving Pinelli to the wing only moves the gap to centre, the depth chart at centre is Gardiner, Pinelli, Lawrence, Foster and Whitehead, the current situation has Pinelli and Foster playing LW to shore up the top lines; Lawrence is playing 2nd line centre but is better suited to play RW or 3rd line centre on a contender. The player coming in has to be able to play LW otherwise all that is happening is Lawrence is moving to RW and there is still no depth at the LW position.

 

[beastintheeast]

If Miss goalies continue to be outstanding for their age, that is only position they can match the wolves

AGAIN I am not saying that Mississauga is the best team what I am saying is that they are one of the top teams in the conference and really do not have to do a lot to stay there,

BUT dirty how many times have the 67 done it with hot goaltending.

Sudbury has a lot to prove and may do it I hope they do so that Mississauga and them wear each other out

The power inteh conference this year is in their division.

 

[PuckStop75]

AGAIN I am not saying that Mississauga is the best team what I am saying is that they are one of the top teams in the conference and really do not have to do a lot to stay there,

BUT dirty how many times have the 67 done it with hot goaltending.

Sudbury has a lot to prove and may do it I hope they do so that Mississauga and them wear each other out

The power inteh conference this year is in their division.

Mississauga will be a hand full next year, they have an abundance of talent, depth and assets to make transactions. Their team reminds me of the 2018/19 67's who were projected to be good and contend the following year but was just simple so good that they ended up in the finals anyways. Sudbury has some systems things to sort out (coaching) to resolve before they will be in the same discussion as the top teams in the league.

 

[PuckStop75]

I think you have to look at it from the perspective that Mississauga will be VERY strong next season and are holding four 2nds in 2025. Those are gold from a value perspective.

that is to say the competition next season will be VERY VERY stiff. Of course, we can never say for sure but if we are truly projecting, next season should be strong for Ottawa without a doubt. I still think they can compete at the highest level next season. It is more so that the competition at the highest level is a much higher level than what we are seeing this season.

As you said, we can stay status quo and maybe even trade Stonehouse and still win the division or at least nail down home ice in a worst case scenario. So, I can definitley see where you are coming from.

Regarding the 18 year old, that spot will still likely need to be filled next year. So, if it is three 2nds and two 3rds this year for an 18 year old or two 2nds and three 3rds next year for a 19 year old (assuming that is accurate), I think the trade value difference isn’t enough to not nail down that player this year. It may be cheaper in the aggregate to do it that way.

If I use the Haight trade from last year compared to the Harrison/Zhilkin/Arcuri deals last year, the logic does make sense. That requires an 18 year old centre like Haight was last year being available though. I don’t know that trade exists. Haight scored 51 in 42 games last season and has 20 in 17 games this year. The cost was three 2nds and two 3rds. This is why I think if we are near 100% likley to add a centre next year, keep eyes open this year.

EDIT:
Pano Fimis is another example of a strong 18 year old centre that went for three 2nds and two 3rds.

Too bad Fimis ended up on an arm pit organization who has been caught in a cycle of spending assets foolishly for years. He'd be a great pick-up for Ottawa, but unfortunately can't play LW ;-) maybe they could look at Terrance as an alternate.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

The team currently has Barlas, Gerrior and Hilton listed as LW, not sure I would call them scrubs but they are not top 6 forwards either. Pinelli has all the skills and tools to be a centre but like most 18 yo also needs players to play with at that position in the OHL. If injury strikes the team is screwed regardless, the basic principle is they need to assemble three lines to make a run in the playoffs.

The reason for separating Gardiner and Pinelli is to create depth, there is no depth created by loading up one line. The top teams in the league will isolate that line and take advantage of the mismatches further down the lineup. This is the difference between playoff hockey and regular season where once teams get to the second round they get man handled by teams with the kind of depth that Peterborough had last year.

When teams need to, the option always exists to load up one line but there is vulnerability created with that. Maybe this will make sense, Edmonton can play Draisatel and McDavid together and score lots of goals in the regular season but once they get to the playoffs they get shut down, year after year. If your a leaf fan, Matthews and Marner are another great example. People can micro analyze their situations and point at D and goaltending but ultimately it is a lack of team depth issue.

As I see it, the gap is on the wing, moving Pinelli to the wing only moves the gap to centre, the depth chart at centre is Gardiner, Pinelli, Lawrence, Foster and Whitehead, the current situation has Pinelli and Foster playing LW to shore up the top lines; Lawrence is playing 2nd line centre but is better suited to play RW or 3rd line centre on a contender. The player coming in has to be able to play LW otherwise all that is happening is Lawrence is moving to RW and there is still no depth at the LW position.

The current forward group is:

Pinelli - Gardiner - Foster
Stonehouse - Lawrence - Dever
Gerrior - Barlas - Kelly
Hilton - Whitehead - Korbler

At this point, the Gardiner/Pinelli and Lawrence/Stonehouse combinations are really clicking. There is absolutely no need to change those first two lines. The real gap is at 3C, as Barlas hasn't consistently demonstrated that he can serve as a middle-6 centre in the OHL.

Gerrior has demonstrated he can play either wing on any line in the forward group - if you recall, he played RW on Morrison's line (with Beck) after Ottawa acquired Morrison at the trade deadline last year. Gerrior is currently the best and most productive player on the 3rd line, but a stronger centre that can distribute the puck to him would optimize his very strong skating and shooting skills. Right now he's more or less carrying the 3rd line (and providing depth to the forward group, otherwise he'd be better positioned as a top-6 RW), but in a better constructed lineup he shouldn't be.

If Boyd acquired a middle-6 centre, Cameron would have the option of moving Gerrior, Barlas, or Kelly around to optimize the bottom-6. Maybe Korbler finds his way to the press box. This is all assuming Uronen is out for an extended period of time.

 

[mianjo]

67ès down 2-0 in first. Where is Mackenzie. Donoso starting and Matthew Saari backup

 

[analyser]

67ès down 2-0 in first. Where is Mackenzie. Donoso starting and Matthew Saari backup

Mackenzie got hurt on Sunday and did not come out for the 3rd period.

 

[analyser]

Where is Marrelli?

 

[mianjo]

down 3-0

4-0

5-0 after 2

SHOTS ON GOAL

Teams	1st	2nd	3rd	Total
KGN	11	15	0	26
OTT	10	6	0	16

 

[OMG67]

Jesus. What is going on today? 5-0? I just turned the game on to watch the 3rd period. Should I even be watching it?

Is it goaltending or just poor team play today?

 

[ecraigs]

Jesus. What is going on today? 5-0? I just turned the game on to watch the 3rd period. Should I even be watching it?

Is it goaltending or just poor team play today?

Yes.

 

[zaluty]

Is it goaltending or just poor team play today?

Could it be that Kingston is playing well?

 

[PuckStop75]

The current forward group is:

Pinelli - Gardiner - Foster
Stonehouse - Lawrence - Dever
Gerrior - Barlas - Kelly
Hilton - Whitehead - Korbler

At this point, the Gardiner/Pinelli and Lawrence/Stonehouse combinations are really clicking. There is absolutely no need to change those first two lines. The real gap is at 3C, as Barlas hasn't consistently demonstrated that he can serve as a middle-6 centre in the OHL.

Gerrior has demonstrated he can play either wing on any line in the forward group - if you recall, he played RW on Morrison's line (with Beck) after Ottawa acquired Morrison at the trade deadline last year. Gerrior is currently the best and most productive player on the 3rd line, but a stronger centre that can distribute the puck to him would optimize his very strong skating and shooting skills. Right now he's more or less carrying the 3rd line (and providing depth to the forward group, otherwise he'd be better positioned as a top-6 RW), but in a better constructed lineup he shouldn't be.

If Boyd acquired a middle-6 centre, Cameron would have the option of moving Gerrior, Barlas, or Kelly around to optimize the bottom-6. Maybe Korbler finds his way to the press box. This is all assuming Uronen is out for an extended period of time.

The lineup has had guys all over the place in an effort to find some secondary scoring, Pinelli and Gardiner have maintained their production pretty consistently depending on who plays with Foster, Stonehouse and Lawrence. Barlas is non productive, he could be the 13th forward and no one would notice most nights.

This team doesn't need another middle six player they need a top 6 forward who moves the bar, otherwise it is assets wasted to get them here.

 

[mianjo]

1-5

GOAL
#27 Kaleb Lawrence (6) scores.

 

[mianjo]

FT 1-5

 

[analyser]

The lineup has had guys all over the place in an effort to find some secondary scoring, Pinelli and Gardiner have maintained their production pretty consistently depending on who plays with Foster, Stonehouse and Lawrence. Barlas is non productive, he could be the 13th forward and no one would notice most nights.

This team doesn't need another middle six player they need a top 6 forward who moves the bar, otherwise it is assets wasted to get them here.

I agree. In addition, we cannot afford to be missing a couple of key players like Mackenzie and Marrelli. We do not have the depth to overcome their absence.

Teams can concentrate on Pinelli as he is our only true sniper.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

The lineup has had guys all over the place in an effort to find some secondary scoring, Pinelli and Gardiner have maintained their production pretty consistently depending on who plays with Foster, Stonehouse and Lawrence. Barlas is non productive, he could be the 13th forward and no one would notice most nights.

This team doesn't need another middle six player they need a top 6 forward who moves the bar, otherwise it is assets wasted to get them here.

Gardiner was unproductive through the first few weeks of the season before he was moved up to 1C with Pinelli on his wing. Pinelli was less productive (I won't say unproductive) as 1C before being moved back to his natural position as 1LW, with Gardiner. Pinelli is better suited to the wing, not centre. The two players obviously have good chemistry together and have consistently executed on set plays such as long stretch passes for breakaways or icings that Pinelli beats out for breakaways. Foster is a complementary player that has the skill to play with Pinelli and Foster.

Stonehouse and Lawrence are good enough to anchor a 2nd line for this particular team. Dever has the speed to offset that of Lawrence.

Of course we could use a top-6 centre forward to bump down Lawrence to the 3rd line where I agree with you he'd be best suited, but at what cost and what is the team's strategy this season? This is the most important question imo.

Keep in mind that Uronen was the forward penciled in at 1RW or 2RW, and will be out for an extended period. The lineup is better with him in it as the RWs shift down a spot. Its possible that Boyd is evaluating how to best overcome his absence.

The 3C position (which Barlas is really ill-suited for) would presumably cost much less to upgrade than a top-6 forward. I don't think Whitehead is quite ready for that spot yet, otherwise we could fill it from within. I think that if we're looking to improve the team and overcome Uronen's absence relatively cheaply, we should be looking at that middle-6 area. The 67s certainly won't be a world-beater, but could still compete for a top-4 seed in the conference.

 

[OMG67]

The lineup has had guys all over the place in an effort to find some secondary scoring, Pinelli and Gardiner have maintained their production pretty consistently depending on who plays with Foster, Stonehouse and Lawrence. Barlas is non productive, he could be the 13th forward and no one would notice most nights.

This team doesn't need another middle six player they need a top 6 forward who moves the bar, otherwise it is assets wasted to get them here.

It depends on what you are looking for in roster construction.

You mention “top 6 forward” and that they don’t need another ”middle six” player. That assumes the top 6 are dominant vs the 3rd line.

I think what is being suggested is a top 9 that all contributes to the offence. IMO, we don’t have the makings of a pure #1 line. Outside of Pinelli, I don’t think we have what most would call a first line centre. We have a strong 2nd line centre with Gardiner and probably a strong 3rd line centre in Lawrence. We identified that last year as well which is why they invested in Morrison at the deadline.

I’m not sure anyone is willing to invest in a pure first lien centre. Adding a dynamic first line winger to Gardiner by default makes Gardiner a 1st line centre but that doesn’t improve the depth of the scoring.

I think we can improve the overall depth of scoring by making three lines all relatively equal if we were to add a 3rd centre. It can be a cheaper guy that helps elevate Kelly and Gerrior OR it can be someone more accomplished that pushes Lawrence down to the 3rd centre role.

To me, it seems like there is a difference of opinion on the level of player needed more so than the position. If we add an elite winger then the argument would be we don’t need a 3rd line that contributes on the scoresheet. This would be somewhat similar to the Petes config last year.

EDIT:
Looks like Nords and I pretty much posted the same message 1 minute apart!

 

[NordiquesForeva]

It depends on what you are looking for in roster construction.

You mention “top 6 forward” and that they don’t need another ”middle six” player. That assumes the top 6 are dominant vs the 3rd line.

I think what is being suggested is a top 9 that all contributes to the offence. IMO, we don’t have the makings of a pure #1 line. Outside of Pinelli, I don’t think we have what most would call a first line centre. We have a strong 2nd line centre with Gardiner and probably a strong 3rd line centre in Lawrence. We identified that last year as well which is why they invested in Morrison at the deadline.

I’m not sure anyone is willing to invest in a pure first lien centre. Adding a dynamic first line winger to Gardiner by default makes Gardiner a 1st line centre but that doesn’t improve the depth of the scoring.

I think we can improve the overall depth of scoring by making three lines all relatively equal if we were to add a 3rd centre. It can be a cheaper guy that helps elevate Kelly and Gerrior OR it can be someone more accomplished that pushes Lawrence down to the 3rd centre role.

To me, it seems like there is a difference of opinion on the level of player needed more so than the position. If we add an elite winger then the argument would be we don’t need a 3rd line that contributes on the scoresheet. This would be somewhat similar to the Petes config last year.

EDIT:
Looks like Nords and I pretty much posted the same message 1 minute apart!

But you said it more eloquently than I did!

Overall, I agree with @PuckStop75 in that in a perfect world we would go out and get that top-6 forward to (a) take some pressure off Pinelli, and (b) bump Lawrence down to the third line. Pinelli should expect some more stringent defense against him/Gardiner going forward. Shuffle things around such that you have a higher-skilled offensive centre to play with Stonehouse (with all due respect to Lawrence) and that line is more or less on par with the Gardiner/Pinelli line. Dever, Foster, and Gerrior are interchangeable across wings or lines, it doesn't really matter imo.

Lawrence could anchor a good 3rd line, flanked by Gerrior/Dever/Kelly/Barlas (again, it doesn't really matter), whose job it would be to keep the puck out of their own net, provide a physical/forechecking presence, and chip in some goals here and there. If Cameron decides to keep Gerrior on that line with Lawrence, it becomes a really good 3rd line.

The biggest question is strategy and cost of acquiring that top-6 forward and if there is carryover to next year's team (in which case the cost would go up). The cost would be much cheaper to get an OA to plug the current hole (read: Barlas) in a competent manner, preserve assets, and see where the team gets this year. I've long thought our objective this season should be to get to the 2nd round of the playoffs so that our key players for next year get some quality playoff reps in. Then, move our chips in next year.

That's without addressing the big need on the back-end. Perhaps capital could be best utilized there over the next season and a half. And, Donoso is certainly doing neither himself nor the 67s any favours these past few games if they are in fact trying to move him.

 

[PuckStop75]

Gardiner was unproductive through the first few weeks of the season before he was moved up to 1C with Pinelli on his wing. Pinelli was less productive (I won't say unproductive) as 1C before being moved back to his natural position as 1LW, with Gardiner. Pinelli is better suited to the wing, not centre. The two players obviously have good chemistry together and have consistently executed on set plays such as long stretch passes for breakaways or icings that Pinelli beats out for breakaways. Foster is a complementary player that has the skill to play with Pinelli and Foster.

Stonehouse and Lawrence are good enough to anchor a 2nd line for this particular team. Dever has the speed to offset that of Lawrence.

Of course we could use a top-6 centre forward to bump down Lawrence to the 3rd line where I agree with you he'd be best suited, but at what cost and what is the team's strategy this season? This is the most important question imo.

Keep in mind that Uronen was the forward penciled in at 1RW or 2RW, and will be out for an extended period. The lineup is better with him in it as the RWs shift down a spot. Its possible that Boyd is evaluating how to best overcome his absence.

The 3C position (which Barlas is really ill-suited for) would presumably cost much less to upgrade than a top-6 forward. I don't think Whitehead is quite ready for that spot yet, otherwise we could fill it from within. I think that if we're looking to improve the team and overcome Uronen's absence relatively cheaply, we should be looking at that middle-6 area. The 67s certainly won't be a world-beater, but could still compete for a top-4 seed in the conference.

Let me get this straight, Pinelli is less productive and Gardiner is non productive which makes Gardiner the better centre???? that makes no sense when they are playing with the same wingers.

Basically what you are saying is, unless Pinelli plays on LW the team does not have a 1st line LW which would seem to support my comments.

The truth of the matter is both guys need a skill winger to play with, which the team doesn't seem to have; so they are now defaulting to putting the two of them together.