I like Ullmark so personally I hope this contract works out. I don’t think it’s a bad deal or a bad goalie to bet on. I just would have waited to see how he performed in a small sample first. I mean he isn’t going to play himself to higher average in a dozen games
Confirmed Signing with Link: [OTT] G Linus Ullmark signs extension with the Ottawa Senators (4 years, $8.25M AAV)
- Thread starter LOFIN
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
- Status
I like Ullmark so personally I hope this contract works out. I don’t think it’s a bad deal or a bad goalie to bet on. I just would have waited to see how he performed in a small sample first. I mean he isn’t going to play himself to higher average in a dozen games
He obviously has some issues to go on and on complaining about this move.
JS19
Legends Never Die
Man you don't make any sense.
When you want to shit on needing elite goaltenders, you emphasize system and name guys like Pascal Leclaire from nearly 20 years ago.
You just refuse to give elite goaltenders their credit, or identify that it's not logical to expect consistent performances from inconsistent keepers.
When you want to shit on needing elite goaltenders, you emphasize system and name guys like Pascal Leclaire from nearly 20 years ago.
You just refuse to give elite goaltenders their credit, or identify that it's not logical to expect consistent performances from inconsistent keepers.
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
This is going to be a fun bump after one season, just like this signing was.
if you bother to read all my posts there nothing childish about them. I dont ridicule anyone for liking the Sens, Im not responding with "LOL youre idiot"...... Im giving my opinion and arguments, posting data, showing past examples....
always the same people who get offended here.
I think its a bad signing..... so what? boo hoo, get over it.
John Gibson got to a Conference Finals in Anaheim.
And again, as I've said in many posts, Ottawa isn't actually a god awful team. They weren't last year. They had go awful goaltending which sank them.
It's not the chicken or the egg. In Ottawa, it was the egg (goaltending).
The great thing about that stats we have today is that you can, much more, accurately separate goalies from the "system".
And in Ottawa's case, the system was about average. The goalies were the worst in the league.
In Boston, the system was about average. The goalies were the best in the league.
Now, I don't expect Ottawa to be Boston of last year, because Boston had two top end goalies, so 82 games of great goaltending. Ottawa will now have one great goalie, and likely ~60 games of great goaltending.
But I fully expect the Senators and Bruins to be within ~6 or so points of each other this year (now that each team has a top starter and a shit backup).
The Senators are probably a 94-96 point team. The Bruins a 100-102 point team.
you acutally think Ullmark is elite? based on 2 great years in Boston under Montgomery?
Wow. Low bar.
Agree to disagree. I think Boston has BY FAR the superior coach and system, its not even close.
You wanna keep blaming goaltending year after year after year, go ahead. Cam Talbot and Gustavsson proved otherwise the moment they changed teams. Hell even Matt Murray went from a Cup winner to a being a backup after he signed in Ottawa. Theres a trend.
But it must be the goaltending....
JS19
Legends Never Die
You legitimately used Pascal Leclaire as an argument against elite goaltenders.
Let that sink in.
Yeah and his backup posted a 0.925 behind that same group with 22 GSAx in 27 games compared to 15 in 58 (17th) for Bob.
The same thing happened in 22-23 where Lyon had significantly better analytics, and a significantly better SV% than Bob.
Shesterkin was the best goalie in the playoffs, then Swayman.
In terms of rate stats in the playoffs, LT was also much better, Woll was better, but I assume you'll be exlcuding anyone who didn't make it past round 1.
At which point you have 8 total goalies, of Bob was the 3rd/4th best depending on how you view him vs Oetter in those playoffs.
As I've said, confirmation bias.
Goalies are good because they make it deep, therefore you need a good goalie to make it deep.
Bob was a pretty mediocre regular season who turned it up in the playoffs. I don't see what relevance it has to justify paying a guy like Ullmark who has been an excellent regular season goalie who has severely disappointed in the playoffs
Sens With Benefits
Registered User
What are you talking about? I was saying Leclaire had a one hit wonder season because his coach was Hitchcock in CLB. And Im saying Ullmark will be similar, though, maybe not as extreme.
Nuance is not your forte, eh?
In Matt Murray's last year in Pitt, he put up an .899 SV% and was already showing signs of chronic injury problems. And Ottawa, in 20/21, is not the same as Ottawa heading in to 24/25.
The numbers bear it out. Ottawa was a terrible team, by all metrics, in 20/21. They were not terrible, outside of goaltending, last year.
But yes, it's the same!
I'm curious, if it's all Boston's system, why did they bother to pay Swayman 8.25M? Why not just run with Korpisalo and Bussi and reallocate the money somewhere else.
After all, if Ullmark's numbers were because of the system, Swayman's must be as well, so there'd be no reason to believe that Korpisalo couldn't have similar success there?
SpezDispenser
Registered User
- Aug 15, 2007
- 27,857
- 7,522
But then, wasn't it shown clearly that Boston gave up more high danger chances than Ottawa did last year, but one team had a real goaltender and one didn't?
@amnesiac has determined that advanced metrics like GSA% are too subjective but saying the "system" over and over again is hard fact.
I assume that as a Montreal fan, he watched the Bruins and Sens a combined 8 times last year and knows both teams inside and out.
Meanwhile, looking at some of his past posts, earlier this summer he claimed that Sam Montembeault would make Ottawa a much better team... but Ullmark is obviously not in the same class as Monty!
JS19
Legends Never Die
ANd somehow you think that's comparable to Linus Ullmark's situation, despite every single analytic saying you're wrong.
You keep banging the point about le system, and the conveniently ignore that Ottawa and Boston's defense weren't all that different. You cast doubt on Ullmark's ability to perform, and never once addressed that he played for the SABRES. You can't get any worse than them.
Tragedy
Registered User
No doubt. If goalie coach bob and the Bruins systems are so elite it seems kinda silly to waste 8 Milly against the cap when you can just have random AHL trash making league min
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
I don’t see what all the hoopla is about.
1. Ullmark won’t sign a team friendly deal with a team that hasn’t made the playoffs in 7 years.
2. Obviously he’d prefer a longer-term deal (what goalie wouldn’t?) but Ottawa would rather trade years for AAV as insurance in case he busts.
3. The longer Ottawa waits before signing Ulmark, and the longer he stays healthy, the more likely he’s willing to just roll the dice on free agency.
4. Sure, December and January sounds great to Ottawa but by then, maybe Ulmark is thinking that it’s only a few more months and he gets to pick his destination and salary.
It’s the product of compromises on both sides.
1. Ullmark won’t sign a team friendly deal with a team that hasn’t made the playoffs in 7 years.
2. Obviously he’d prefer a longer-term deal (what goalie wouldn’t?) but Ottawa would rather trade years for AAV as insurance in case he busts.
3. The longer Ottawa waits before signing Ulmark, and the longer he stays healthy, the more likely he’s willing to just roll the dice on free agency.
4. Sure, December and January sounds great to Ottawa but by then, maybe Ulmark is thinking that it’s only a few more months and he gets to pick his destination and salary.
It’s the product of compromises on both sides.
You can believe goaltending was the "only" reason Ottawa was bad. I dont. One year? sure.... 5+ years of very bad goaltending numbers. Theres something more to it.
Age has a lot to do with wanting to sign Swayman longterm, and the fact that he has already put up very good numbers in Boston for a few seasons. They sure as hell werent going to sign 30 year old Korpisalo for 8 years.
SpezDispenser
Registered User
- Aug 15, 2007
- 27,857
- 7,522
Face Of Bear
Registered User
- Jul 30, 2012
- 2,144
- 1,374
SpezDispenser
Registered User
- Aug 15, 2007
- 27,857
- 7,522
So...you wouldn't bet money on it, it turns out
Swayman's contract will expire when he's 35.
Ullmark's contract will expire when he's 35.
But again, age is irrelevant if Boston goalies are only good because of Montgomery and the system. Bussi is as young as Swayman. They could have just kept him, right?
Why give any system goalie 8M, even a 28 year old one?
- Status
