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Hard to be mad. The Dodgers choke. It’s what they’re known for unfortunately. Sucks that’s what they’re known for, but so it goes.

Absolutely pitch perfect that the top of their order, all superstars, none of them homegrown, all go down like chumps in the 9th.

They need to fire Roberts. Let Kershaw walk. Get rid of both Turners and Bellinger. Change up the personality of the clubhouse.
 
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Ziggy Stardust said:
It’s as if Freeman swung at that last pitch just to put an end to this pitiful series. What a monumental choke job after the season they had.
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Ya. That's gonna be remembered for a while. Absolute unreal collapse. Credit the Pads.

Rick Knickleback said:
They need to fire Roberts. Let Kershaw walk. Get rid of both Turners and Bellinger. Change up the personality of the clubhouse.
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As much as I love some of those people this all has to happen.
 
The Dodgers don't have a starter that can go more than 5 innings. Not a big deal in the regular season, but in the playoffs they need that ace to shutdown the opponent and keep the bullpen rested for when they are needed. The big "closer" they acquired didn't even make the roster. But hey, Jansen is out too. The Astros are going to win it all.
 
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kingsholygrail said:
Nothing but missing the playoffs will get Roberts fired.
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You're probably right and that's the great, cruel irony of the Friedman/Roberts regime.

The Dodgers will hardly ever miss the playoffs with the money they've got and their analytics approach. Analytics is the perfect framework for regular season baseball because more than any other sport it's a series of discrete outcomes: pitches, groundballs, flyballs, station to station running--all things that can be quantified into strategies that can be honed and optimized over the course of six months. It's like counting cards, baseball style.

But the postseason is determined so much by the pitcher v hitter dynamic, and the psychology of that is hard to quantify (ask Kershaw*). It's feel and flow. It's why Hader can have a 5+ ERA this year and then pitch like it's 2018 in the NLDS. It's why Kahnle can be lights out in no leverage situations in games 2 and 3 and then melt down tonight.

Roberts isn't a manager as much as a bag man for Friedman. I doubt he even makes the lineup or batting order. He's no Bochy, or even Lasorda. His decision making is so poor--what was up with pulling Almonte tonight after one pitch?--because he's not used to making executive decisions.

*Low key: Kershaw sucked in game 2 when a solid performance could've put the foot on SD's throat, since Darvish was also mediocre.
 
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Rick Knickleback said:
You're probably right and that's the great, cruel irony of the Friedman/Roberts regime.

The Dodgers will hardly ever miss the playoffs with the money they've got and their analytics approach. Analytics is the perfect framework for regular season baseball because more than any other sport it's a series of discrete outcomes: pitches, groundballs, flyballs, station to station running--all things that can be quantified into strategies that can be honed and optimized over the course of six months. It's like counting cards, baseball style.

But the postseason is determined so much by the pitcher v hitter dynamic, and the psychology of that is hard to quantify (ask Kershaw*). It's feel and flow. It's why Hader can have a 5+ ERA this year and then pitch like it's 2018 in the NLDS. It's why Kahnle can be lights out in no leverage situations in games 2 and 3 and then melt down tonight.

Roberts isn't a manager as much as a bag man for Friedman. I doubt he even makes the lineup or batting order. He's no Bochy, or even Lasorda. His decision making is so poor--what was up with pulling Almonte tonight after one pitch?--because he's not used to making executive decisions.

*Low key: Kershaw sucked in game 2 when a solid performance could've put the foot on SD's throat, since Darvish was also mediocre.
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Absolutely. My issue with Roberts is he doesn't change modes when the playoffs start. He treats them like the regular season.
 
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Rick Knickleback said:
Hard to be mad. The Dodgers choke. It’s what they’re known for unfortunately. Sucks that’s what they’re known for, but so it goes.

Absolutely pitch perfect that the top of their order, all superstars, none of them homegrown, all go down like chumps in the 9th.

They need to fire Roberts. Let Kershaw walk. Get rid of both Turners and Bellinger. Change up the personality of the clubhouse.
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Been saying that for a few years now. I don’t think management or ownership will do anything different. They just had record attendance and revenue for the year. The formula works for Guggenheim, they’ll annually “compete” and that’s enough to draw in the fans ($$$).

If it was about championships, it would be a completely different culture.

I was very happy with Anderson tonight, he was dealing and unfortunately his manager and teammates all crapped themselves.
 
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The pitching staff gave them 111 wins this year but the offense clearly had so many black holes. The previous 3 100-win Dodger teams were better than this 111-win team. I’d even take the 91-win 2018 team over this. This year’s offense just had no depth statistically. Very top heavy with Trea, Freeman, and Mookie carrying the load. Then you have ex-All stars playing very subpar with Muncy, CT3 and obviously Bellinger. This team badly misses Kike and Joc.
 
Vamos Rafa said:
The pitching staff gave them 111 wins this year but the offense clearly had so many black holes. The previous 3 100-win Dodger teams were better than this 111-win team. I’d even take the 91-win 2018 team over this. This year’s offense just had no depth statistically. Very top heavy with Trea, Freeman, and Mookie carrying the load. Then you have ex-All stars playing very subpar with Muncy, CT3 and obviously Bellinger. This team badly misses Kike and Joc.
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I agree wholeheartedly, I know we probably overromanticize intangibles a bit in hockey, but dumping the heartbeat guys bit us right away.
 
kingsholygrail said:
The Dodgers don't have a starter that can go more than 5 innings. Not a big deal in the regular season, but in the playoffs they need that ace to shutdown the opponent and keep the bullpen rested for when they are needed. The big "closer" they acquired didn't even make the roster. But hey, Jansen is out too. The Astros are going to win it all.
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Really surprise they pulled the starter. It's not like he was going to pitch again in the series, they couldn't do anything with him out there. Mustgrove was out there until he hit 101 pitches in the late 6th.
 
kingsfan28 said:
Really surprise they pulled the starter. It's not like he was going to pitch again in the series, they couldn't do anything with him out there. Mustgrove was out there until he hit 101 pitches in the late 6th.
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That's the thing. It's an elimination game and he was dealing. During the regular season, yeah you might pull him to save the arm, but not in this situation. But again that's Dave being unable to transition from regular season management to playoff management.
 
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kingsholygrail said:
That's the thing. It's an elimination game and he was dealing. During the regular season, yeah you might pull him to save the arm, but not in this situation. But again that's Dave being unable to transition from regular season management to playoff management.
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It really was like when they yanked Snell a few years back, but even earlier
 
kingsfan28 said:
Really surprise they pulled the starter. It's not like he was going to pitch again in the series, they couldn't do anything with him out there. Mustgrove was out there until he hit 101 pitches in the late 6th.
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kingsholygrail said:
That's the thing. It's an elimination game and he was dealing. During the regular season, yeah you might pull him to save the arm, but not in this situation. But again that's Dave being unable to transition from regular season management to playoff management.
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Also nearly forgot all that mismanagement of Vesia and Almonte was--admittedly!--because Roberts thought they were gonna save Phillips for the 9th.

Imagine treating your elimination game like a one-off vs. the Rockies in July and keeping your job.
 
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Raccoon Jesus said:
Also nearly forgot all that mismanagement of Vesia and Almonte was--admittedly!--because Roberts thought they were gonna save Phillips for the 9th.

Imagine treating your elimination game like a one-off vs. the Rockies in July and keeping your job.
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You're on the verge of elimination If you need to bring in Julio Urias for three freaking innings you do. There is no game tomorrow if you don't win today.
 
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kingsholygrail said:
That's the thing. It's an elimination game and he was dealing. During the regular season, yeah you might pull him to save the arm, but not in this situation. But again that's Dave being unable to transition from regular season management to playoff management.
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Exactly, keep him in until he gives up a run. He could've made it through the 7th . If he throws 115 pitches , bfd, he's not going to pitch for 3-4 days. I remember the days when a guy would throw a complete game up 3-0.
 
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