Only game being played is the blame game(CBA Negotiation discussion thread) - Part IV

[JAX]

Actually, existing average salary is $2.45m.

After this CBA is agreed to, it may fall to, wait for it, wait for it.... a paltry $2.2m or some other ungodly low amount!! Oh the horror that NHLPA members are facing!!

I hear ya, I would def miss a season to stand my ground against that devil Bettman. The poor players will be lining up at the foodbank.

 

[BLONG7]

It's a little more complicated then that.

Sure it is, but maybe it could be looked at? The NFL of all leagues seems to make it work...

 

[Number 9*]

Did anyone read the Adrian Dater article posted earlier?

I just can't belive how ****ing biased these writers are. Ok, I know Brooks and Shoalts are die-hard NHLPA shills but Dater seems to be just as bad. Look at this piece from his article:

It all comes down to this simple truth, to the players: no way in hell is the short, old guy with the New York accent who never played the game going to push them around this time.

Dater is making very personal, very direct insults at Bettman, that is truly disgusting.

Adrian Dater is the lowest of the scum that unfortunately writes about NHL. Somebody should really stand up and call out these NHLPA zealots.

It's funny! I have read many many articles on the lockout. And with the pro NHL people ANY writer that says ANYTHING against Mr. Bettman is scum. And I mean any writer.

 

[Boltsfan2029]

Yep, and then we can all work 12 hours a day for pennies an hour like they did in the 1800's. Really looking forward to that

Have they repealed existing labor laws where you live? C'mon, the world isn't like it was back then.

 

[JAX]

Did anyone read the Adrian Dater article posted earlier?

I just can't belive how ****ing biased these writers are. Ok, I know Brooks and Shoalts are die-hard NHLPA shills but Dater seems to be just as bad. Look at this piece from his article:

It all comes down to this simple truth, to the players: no way in hell is the short, old guy with the New York accent who never played the game going to push them around this time.

Dater is making very personal, very direct insults at Bettman, that is truly disgusting.

Adrian Dater is the lowest of the scum that unfortunately writes about NHL. Somebody should really stand up and call out these NHLPA zealots.

Reminds me of Strachan in 05, I could barely stand to listen to his crap because you know it's 100% biased with the players. The reasoning is simple he wants to kiss the players ***** to keep his contacts and be in good standing with the players. I see more of the same this time around.

 

[JAX]

It's funny! I have read many many articles on the lockout. And with the pro NHL people ANY writer that says ANYTHING against Mr. Bettman is scum. And I mean any writer.

I don't see it that way, Bettman is the official whipping boy it seems, he the guy who takes all the heat and is constantly being insulted by the players. Do you ever hear the owners insult Fehr and his possy? no because Bettman put a gag order on all that kind of stuff.

 

[Number 9*]

Leave them at 57% of revenue, and take away guaranteed contracts, would that work? That way, when they stop producing, ala the NFL, you would just cut them...they would then not take a year or years off ala Vinny Lecavalier and Scott Gomez? Work, no?

How do NFL players get around non guaranteed contracts? Huge signing bonuses.

The only reason I wouldn't want the guaranteed contracts go away is I strongly feel GM's should be held accountable for their signing/mistakes!

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA NHLPA leader Don Fehr met privately again with NHL commissioner Gary Bettman; both are trying to figure out a way to make some progress

 

[JAX]

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA NHLPA leader Don Fehr met privately again with NHL commissioner Gary Bettman; both are trying to figure out a way to make some progress

Well being in the same room is a start.....

 

[Number 9*]

Of course, players don't lose money, the owners do. And I don't think a smaller peice of the pie is too much to ask considering hockey players make then football players but yet the NHL makes a fraction of what the NFL does.

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

 

[Crows*]

@michaelgrange: Don Fehr met w/ Bettman for 30 min; in brief comments said he didn't view movement by owners prior to lockout as meaningful. #NHL #NHLPA

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

Renaud P Lavoie ‏@RenLavoieRDS
Don Fehr on today's HRR meeting:"Its an important meeting. It will determine how much money is in the pot."

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA Big group meeting today dealing with hockey-related revenue and what current definition means and encompasses

Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA When asked if that means today's session deals w/ core econ. issues, Fehr said, in a way, yes. But the actual shares not discussed

It's good that they are tackling the what HRR actually is issue. That has to be solved.

 

[JAX]

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

OK so this means the players can effectivly bankrupt their own employers? A big part of this CBA is to set a % the PA will get and how to control it not to decide who the fans go see because I'm going to to take a wild guess that the fans don't pay to see Jacobs or Snider in the skyboxes.

 

[CrAzYNiNe]

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

If 20 of 30 teams fold, a lot less jerseys will be sold.

 

[BLONG7]

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

Good point, but the players come and go, it's the team and the game I am interested in, not the names on the back of the jersey at all...

 

[Dicdonya]

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

What does that question have anything to do with what you quoted? Everyone knows that players are the single most important revenue generator in sports leagues. Does not change the fact that players foot exactly zero of the expenses or risk of the league.

On a side note, if the players are truly dealing from a stance of revenge against bettman, I have officially zero respect for them from this point on. That is the most arrogant and childish thing I've ever heard and further proves the players could care less about anything but their next paycheck and have zero foresight for the future of the league and all young players who come into it down the road.

I really hope this is not about revenge. That would be beyond stupid.

 

[Number 9*]

OK so this means the players can effectivly bankrupt their own employers? A big part of this CBA is to set a % the PA will get and how to control it not to decide who the fans go see because I'm going to to take a wild guess that the fans don't pay to see Jacobs or Snider in the skyboxes.

Players have done nothing but play within the system Mr. Bettman preached was the cure all. Would you like me to quote his cure all speeches?

Why hasn't he said anything about poor this time? Why was bragging about the riches all 6.5 years? Why is he only saying they make too much?

 

[Number 9*]

Good point, but the players come and go, it's the team and the game I am interested in, not the names on the back of the jersey at all...

As we see right now there is NO game without the names!

 

[BLONG7]

As we see right now there is NO game without the names!

Easy to fix, get someone in the PA to negotiate in good faith...

 

[Number 9*]

What does that question have anything to do with what you quoted? Everyone knows that players are the single most important revenue generator in sports leagues. Does not change the fact that players foot exactly zero of the expenses or risk of the league.

On a side note, if the players are truly dealing from a stance of revenge against bettman, I have officially zero respect for them from this point on. That is the most arrogant and childish thing I've ever heard and further proves the players could care less about anything but their next paycheck and have zero foresight for the future of the league and all young players who come into it down the road.

I really hope this is not about revenge. That would be beyond stupid.

IMO above beyond the revenge factor the PA want assurance this does happen again. In other words NHL want are YOU going do to be sure we aren't concessing again 6 years and then again in 6 more years?

 

[Number 9*]

Easy to fix, get someone in the PA to negotiate in good faith...

Just like Mr. Bettman's first offer. In the first offer show me one thing that was a concession from the NHL to the PA. Everything was taking away and no giving.

Concession don't have to be after completely stupid offer.

 

[KingsFan7824]

How do NFL players get around non guaranteed contracts? Huge signing bonuses.

The only reason I wouldn't want the guaranteed contracts go away is I strongly feel GM's should be held accountable for their signing/mistakes!

No hiding money in the AHL. If a guy like Redden gets sent down, that money stays on the cap. Buyouts should be for the full amount, and all of it also stays on the cap.

Okay let me ask you a very serious question?

Why do people spend money on games, concessions, parking, sweaters and many other things?

To watch the players play the game. When was last time you saw someone buy a sweater with the names Dolan, Rogers, Ontario teachers pension plan, Ilitch or any other owners (excluding Mario and Gretzky playing sweaters) name on the back?

When was the last time you saw a sweater with the name of a player on the back, but no logo on the front?

 

[Puddin]

IMO above beyond the revenge factor the PA want assurance this does happen again. In other words NHL want are YOU going do to be sure we aren't concessing again 6 years and then again in 6 more years?

I agree with this. Nothing in the NHL offer will keep the same scenario playing out again when the next CBA expires.

I think the players know they will lose some % of the HRR, but a reduction of % does not help the poor teams from becoming profitable in the long run. Sure, a drop helps now, but in 5 years we are right back here again (assuming the league HRR continues to grow).

In my less than expert opinion, the real question is whether you want a healthy 'league' or a dozen or so healthy teams and the rest either fold or continuously lose money.

 

[Bubba Thudd]

No hiding money in the AHL. If a guy like Redden gets sent down, that money stays on the cap. Buyouts should be for the full amount, and all of it also stays on the cap.



When was the last time you saw a sweater with the name of a player on the back, but no logo on the front?

I have several sweaters/jerseys, each with a different name on the back...but the same logo is on the front of them.

 

[Number 9*]

No hiding money in the AHL. If a guy like Redden gets sent down, that money stays on the cap. Buyouts should be for the full amount, and all of it also stays on the cap.



When was the last time you saw a sweater with the name of a player on the back, but no logo on the front?

When was the last time you saw that sweater and logo skate on the ice without a body in it?

We can go round and round on this. The players are the labor and the product.