Value of: Offensive Forwards to Minnesota

[Digitalbooya]

Want a cheaper Fiala in Kempe?

Kings need a goalie and they wanted Wallstedt; any interest in trading him?

Absolutely not. He is marked as untouchable in the first post.

 

[King'sPawn]

Absolutely not. He is marked as untouchable in the first post.

Sorry I missed that.

 

[Digitalbooya]

@biturbo19 @Nucklehead Supreme @jd22 @VanillaCoke
What would be the ask for Garland? He seems like a nice mid range offensive player with a workable cap hit.

Sorry I missed that.

It’s all good. He’s probably the best goaltender in the organization already so I’m defensive when it comes to talk of trading him lol

 

[57special]

Count me in as someone who doesn't get the point of trading Dumba for Boeser, nvm Dumba + Beckman + 2nd.

Both Dumba and Boeser are not worth their contracts, and appear to be trending the wrong way after having some nice seasons 3- 5 years ago. Unfortunately, Boeser's contract runs another two years after this one, while Dumba's expires after this.

My head will explode if Guerin makes a trade like this. It's like he'd pay Beckman and a 2nd for the privilege of signing Boeser instead of Fiala.... I know Fiala makes a bit more, but still, that's really f***ed up.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Count me in as someone who doesn't get the point of trading Dumba for Boeser, nvm Dumba + Beckman + 2nd.

Both Dumba and Boeser are not worth their contracts, and appear to be trending the wrong way after having some nice seasons 3- 5 years ago. Unfortunately, Boeser's contract runs another two years after this one, while Dumba's expires after this.

My head will explode if Guerin makes a trade like this. It's like he'd pay Beckman and a 2nd for the privilege of signing Boeser instead of Fiala.... I know Fiala makes a bit more, but still, that's really f***ed up.

Oh look another "expert" on Boeser who doesn't have a f***ing clue.

In 2020/2021 he was literally our best F, is that 3-5 years ago? Some of you really suck at research.

 

[King'sPawn]

@biturbo19 @Nucklehead Supreme @jd22 @VanillaCoke
What would be the ask for Garland? He seems like a nice mid range offensive player with a workable cap hit.


It’s all good. He’s probably the best goaltender in the organization already so I’m defensive when it comes to talk of trading him lol

Understood - plus I get it's maddening when you make something clear in the OP and it seems that someone ignores it.

Any interest in Kempe for O'Rourke+? Kings need to boost their LHD prospect pool. Saying + as I'm guessing you need to include some roster player for cap.

I'm assuming you'd want the Kings to add more to acquire Lambos, in which Minnesota couldn't afford for cap reasons.

 

[AKL]

How did I know you were using Fiala as your reasoning…

I don’t see how Beckman+2nd+Dumba (THEORETICAL 2nd round pick) is anywhere close to Faber+1st. Faber is a much better prospect than Beckman and with where those 2nd round picks will be, you’d be lucky to get a late 1st.

I flat out disagree that Dumba = Boeser. Boeser even in his “terrible” start to the year as a “one dimensional winger” is at .75 points per game. Kaprizov’s stat line at the beginning of last year read 8gp 0g 6a -3. The exact same as Boeser’s and before you misconstrue my words, Boeser isn’t close to Kaprizov. But what I’m saying is sometimes it takes a little bit to get the goal scoring going.

I feel like you’re overvaluing Beckman. The guy struggled to put up .5ppg in the AHL last year.

That Barker comparison is horrid. Barker had one good year. Boeser has had one bad year (still put up almost 50 points). Beckman isn’t Leddy.

I don't know why you get so bent out of shape any time Fiala is brought up for any reason. He's the most recent example of a winger traded for futures that we have.

Let me ask you this, do you think Zuccarello has been as good as his stat line indicates? Because he's a point per game winger right now, and I'll be damned if he'd actually be worth that much, because the one ice play doesn't match the production.
Similarly, Boeser has been playing with Horvat and Miller in the top six this season. He's going to get points for being on the ice with two point per game centers. That doesn't mean he should be valued as a 0.75 point per game player, the same way Zuccarello shouldn't be valued as a 1.00 point per game player.

As for Beckman, he is still a good prospect with a potentially bright future. Last year he was 20 years old playing his first pro season, and he's built like a dry spaghetti noodle. Of course there's going to be an adjustment period. This year he's already at 6 points in 8 games on a bad team. I don't know if we've been spoiled by the quick acclimation of guys like Boldy, Kaprizov (to a lesser extent) and Brodin, but not every player is going to light it up right away. It doesn't mean they're not still valuable.

Barker was acquired because Fletcher thought he could rebound with the Wild. Johnsson was "gone anyway" and Leddy was a prospect to sweeten the deal. It's the exact same scenario, different players, and you're hoping for a different outcome. Which may happen, or it may not. But this team is not in a position to watch a guy like Beckman (and the 2nd) blossom in Vancouver if Boeser never finds his form, is overpaid for two more years, and then ends up leaving. Maybe if we were actually contenders, but there's overwhelming evidence that we're not.

Want a cheaper Fiala in Kempe?

Kings need a goalie and they wanted Wallstedt; any interest in trading him?

Edit: missed the untouchable part.

I don't know why you thought Kempe for Wallstedt would be anything remotely interesting in the first place.

 

[Fjordy]

Understood - plus I get it's maddening when you make something clear in the OP and it seems that someone ignores it.

Any interest in Kempe for O'Rourke+? Kings need to boost their LHD prospect pool. Saying + as I'm guessing you need to include some roster player for cap.

I'm assuming you'd want the Kings to add more to acquire Lambos, in which Minnesota couldn't afford for cap reasons.

Buffalo has an LD prospect in Johnson and a promising goaltender prospect in Portillo. Kempe would be interesting, but also one of your RDs or RD prospect. Maybe something around this and we add pick/picks. You might also be interested in Olofsson or Mittelstadt, although I'm not sure.

 

[AKL]

Understood - plus I get it's maddening when you make something clear in the OP and it seems that someone ignores it.

Any interest in Kempe for O'Rourke+? Kings need to boost their LHD prospect pool. Saying + as I'm guessing you need to include some roster player for cap.

I'm assuming you'd want the Kings to add more to acquire Lambos, in which Minnesota couldn't afford for cap reasons.

You need to aim a lot lower

 

[Kingspiracy]

You need to aim a lot lower

I think you are undervaluing Kempe. He scored 35 goals last year and i personally wouldnt move him for a prospect.

 

[Gurglesons]

Greenway is actually on the table?

 

[AKL]

I think you are undervaluing Kempe. He scored 35 goals last year and i personally wouldnt move him for a prospect.

I don't think he'll score 35 goals again, and Wallstedt and Lambos are both very good prospects, not just prospects.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I don't know why you get so bent out of shape any time Fiala is brought up for any reason. He's the most recent example of a winger traded for futures that we have.

Let me ask you this, do you think Zuccarello has been as good as his stat line indicates? Because he's a point per game winger right now, and I'll be damned if he'd actually be worth that much, because the one ice play doesn't match the production.
Similarly, Boeser has been playing with Horvat and Miller in the top six this season. He's going to get points for being on the ice with two point per game centers. That doesn't mean he should be valued as a 0.75 point per game player, the same way Zuccarello shouldn't be valued as a 1.00 point per game player.

As for Beckman, he is still a good prospect with a potentially bright future. Last year he was 20 years old playing his first pro season, and he's built like a dry spaghetti noodle. Of course there's going to be an adjustment period. This year he's already at 6 points in 8 games on a bad team. I don't know if we've been spoiled by the quick acclimation of guys like Boldy, Kaprizov (to a lesser extent) and Brodin, but not every player is going to light it up right away. It doesn't mean they're not still valuable.

Because it feels like target fixating from some posters on how we can't trade for an offensive forward bEcAuSe We TrAdEd FiAlA. I would have still been on board with trading for more offense even if we had Fiala here. These proposals being tossed around are not the same value as Faber+1st (Ohgren, which then enabled us to take a riskier prospect in Yurov at 23). Just like Boeser is not the same value as Fiala.

Zuccarello also has a ridiculous amount of power play points (9) whereas Boeser's points have all come at even strength (he is tied w/ Boldy and Kap at 6 ES points). Boeser has more ES points than Zucc in 5 less games. Just an abysmal comparison.

So 6 points in 8 games is good in the AHL for Beckman, but 6 points in 8 games for Boeser in the NHL is dismissed because "teammates." Newsflash, not everyone is going to score 60+ playing next to the Tanner Pearson's of the world (which is his most common linemate and then it's Horvat/Miller). Good players find a way to mesh well with other good players. Should Boldy be discounted because he played with Fiala? Should Draisaitl be discounted because he plays with McDavid? How about Debrincat when he was with Chicago and had Kane feeding him pucks? What about Rantanen whom plays with MacKinnon? The list goes on and on.

 

[Kingspiracy]

I don't think he'll score 35 goals again, and Wallstedt and Lambos are both very good prospects, not just prospects.

Wasnt O'rourke+ In there too?

 

[Digitalbooya]

Greenway is actually on the table?

For me? Only three players off the table are Kap, Boldy and Wallstedt

 

[AKL]

Wasnt O'rourke+ In there too?

I didn't have an issue with the O'Rourke ask

 

[57special]

Oh look another "expert" on Boeser who doesn't have a f***ing clue.

In 2020/2021 he was literally our best F, is that 3-5 years ago? Some of you really suck at research.

Oh, you're the guy who maintains that Boeser is a fast, defensive wizard. Funny that few on your own board share that opinion. who are you trying to kid?

You and Sebastien should get a room.

 

[King'sPawn]

Wasnt O'rourke+ In there too?

Yeah, I said
Kempe for O'Rourke+

Then I said the Kings would like Lambos, but Minnesota would want a lot more than Kempe, and thus it probably wouldn't work for cap reasons.

 

[AKL]

Yeah, I said
Kempe for O'Rourke+

Then I said the Kings would like Lambos, but Minnesota would want a lot more than Kempe, and thus it probably wouldn't work for cap reasons.

It's not cap reasons that would prevent it from working.

 

[Sebastien]

Don't even bother trying to reason with the guy, he's got some grudge against Boeser, I have no idea why.



Wow, prove more that you've never watched the guy play hockey.......

Greenway is actually on the table?

No, he's not. Much like brodin, Joel Eriksson ek, marco Rossi, spurgeon, etc..

Because it feels like target fixating from some posters on how we can't trade for an offensive forward bEcAuSe We TrAdEd FiAlA. I would have still been on board with trading for more offense even if we had Fiala here. These proposals being tossed around are not the same value as Faber+1st (Ohgren, which then enabled us to take a riskier prospect in Yurov at 23). Just like Boeser is not the same value as Fiala.

Zuccarello also has a ridiculous amount of power play points (9) whereas Boeser's points have all come at even strength (he is tied w/ Boldy and Kap at 6 ES points). Boeser has more ES points than Zucc in 5 less games. Just an abysmal comparison.

So 6 points in 8 games is good in the AHL for Beckman, but 6 points in 8 games for Boeser in the NHL is dismissed because "teammates." Newsflash, not everyone is going to score 60+ playing next to the Tanner Pearson's of the world (which is his most common linemate and then it's Horvat/Miller). Good players find a way to mesh well with other good players. Should Boldy be discounted because he played with Fiala? Should Draisaitl be discounted because he plays with McDavid? How about Debrincat when he was with Chicago and had Kane feeding him pucks? What about Rantanen whom plays with MacKinnon? The list goes on and on.

No disrespect but you fail to recognize the reason, or reason's why fiala was let go. As long Guerin and Evason who I want fired are still here, they will prefer player's who play a two way game, and strong on d like greenway and foligno. We have seen the forwards chosen or d chosen.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Greenway is actually on the table?

Probably not in real life. I think Guerin likes our "identity" to be based around a really good checking line.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I guess I'll defer to others that have watched more Vancouver hockey than I have, because my gut reaction was that Boeser seemed like a reasonable gamble to make.

 

[McJedi]

Oh, you're the guy who maintains that Boeser is a fast, defensive wizard. Funny that few on your own board share that opinion. who are you trying to kid?

You and Sebastien should get a room.

He’s just a Vancouver fan desperate to unload Boeser so they can actually allocate that cap space effectively. If he actually liked Boeser, he’d be upset with all the Vancouver proposals to dump him on some unsuspecting sucker. $6.65mm is a major overpay for what Boeser is today and you have to deal with that for 3 years. Yikes

Horvat is a good 200 foot player they’ll lose soon. A guy having a great contract year. A captain and a C. Great in the dot. Someone they’ll actually miss like the Wild misses Fiala.

Vancouver is in a bad place. They have no cap space and some bad contracts on their books. Very few good young players (Hoglander and Podkolzin are not proving out as anything other than middle six meh players). They really need to dump some bad deals like Boeser or Garland to start a rebuild. But most of their wingers have no or negative value.

There are not many NHL teams with worse organizational prospects over the next two-three seasons.

If there is a team that needs a top 3 pick this year, Vancouver is it.

 

[Kaibur]

Nick Schmaltz from the Coyotes? He was nearly PPG player (59pts in 63GP) on a very bad team last year. He's on IR for 2-4 more weeks, but if he plays to last season's level, he's worth his contract ($5.85M cap).

He's 26 and has 3 more years after this one. That doesn't really fit the Coyotes planned window according to the current GM and his contract was signed by the former GM. He has a 10 team NTC that kicks in this summer and his actual cash goes up for the last 3 years of the deal.

He's better on the wing, but he can play a little center in a pinch. Coyotes would be more interested in picks and prospects as the return.

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

Wonder if the Capitals would consider moving McMichael, I have thought of him as a great fit for this Wild team for a while now. Not sure what Washington would look for in return though, he doesn't seem to have a solid role in that lineup.