Off-Season Roster Thread #2 -- Nothing to do but wait

[Zman5778]

With that in mind, I’d prefer they steer clear of any potential additions that have had any sort of baggage - rumored, perceived or otherwise - in the past (Kadri, Subban, Kassian, etc). Although in a vacuum, Kadri’s skill set would be perfect for the roster…

Subban is an absolute prince of a person off the ice. I've never heard anything bad about Kadri off-ice. For those 2, all of their transgressions are ON the ice.

When this team/FO talks about "Culture" and "Vibes".......it's more off-ice than on-ice. There seems to be more of a commitment to the community and towards working toward a common goal. I don't think Kadri would interrupt that, and I'm 100% sure Subban would only add to that.

 

[Irving Zisman]

Subban is an absolute prince of a person off the ice. I've never heard anything bad about Kadri off-ice. For those 2, all of their transgressions are ON the ice.

When this team/FO talks about "Culture" and "Vibes".......it's more off-ice than on-ice. There seems to be more of a commitment to the community and towards working toward a common goal. I don't think Kadri would interrupt that, and I'm 100% sure Subban would only add to that.

Subban was rumored to be an ass in Montreal. Hearsay? Possibly. Willing to chance it with our roster and what they’ve finally started to build on for an old 3rd-pairing Defenseman? f*** no.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

Another goalie who's locked in at $5m for three years is Linus Ullmark. Bruins need cap pretty desperately and have Swayman as a number one. Save pct of .917 over 40+ games isn't too shabby. He was deemed to be popular in the room, IIRC.

Maybe send a third rounder to Boston for Ullmark and Foligno? Assuming there's no bad blood, of course.

Bruins cap need isn't desperate...if Bergeron retires. In that case, they have ~2.3M cap space with 12F/8D/2G, meaning they really only need to sign one more forward. Of course, if they want to upgrade the roster they'll have to move some money, but I feel like Forbort/Reilly/Haula/Smith/Nosek are all way more likely cap casualties than Ullmark/Foligno. I don't think running the roster back is going to work for them, but I don't think there's a realistic addition to the roster that will move the needle either. They made their bed with the Hall and Lindholm deals (and the McAvoy extension).

If Bergeron decides to return, then a little more roster surgery would be needed, but I still don't think Ullmark will be it. Next year though when Swayman is RFA, all bets are off--and they will need some money for Pastrnak, though half their depth forwards will be UFA.

 

[BritSabre]

Subban was rumored to be an ass in Montreal. Hearsay? Possibly. Willing to chance it with our roster and what they’ve finally started to build on for an old 3rd-pairing Defenseman? f*** no.

I wonder how much that's just the archaic attitude of suppressing personality and him not conforming to that mould. It's not going to fit everywhere, the guy exudes confidence and swagger it's either going to rub off on people or rub against them.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

I wonder how much that's just the archaic attitude of suppressing personality and him not conforming to that mould. It's not going to fit everywhere, the guy exudes confidence and swagger it's either going to rub off on people or rub against them.

Supposedly it was regarding control of the locker room and him clashing with Pacioretty. He was also rumored to have issues between him and Josi when he was in Nashville. These are just rumors but 2 teams with 2 locker room leaders could be a pattern.

 

[Irving Zisman]

I wonder how much that's just the archaic attitude of suppressing personality and him not conforming to that mould. It's not going to fit everywhere, the guy exudes confidence and swagger it's either going to rub off on people or rub against them.

That’s a very fair point. Personally, I think I’d still steer clear on the oft chance there’s any fire to that smoke.

 

[Fjordsen]

Subban was rumored to be an ass in Montreal. Hearsay? Possibly. Willing to chance it with our roster and what they’ve finally started to build on for an old 3rd-pairing Defenseman? f*** no.

I'm sure Adams will have all the information for that. But Subban doesn't seem like an ass.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Well… f***. Tage has to double his output this season!

 

[Matt Ress]

Supposedly it was regarding control of the locker room and him clashing with Pacioretty. He was also rumored to have issues between him and Josi when he was in Nashville. These are just rumors but 2 teams with 2 locker room leaders could be a pattern.

Not many big heads to butt with in Jersey. Although not completely engrained, there does seem to be a structured positive culture in Buffalo. I feel like it's strong enough to withstand a single player but the idea is to build it and not test it.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

Not many big heads to butt with in Jersey. Although not completely engrained, there does seem to be a structured positive culture in Buffalo. I feel like it's strong enough to withstand a single player but the idea is to build it and not test it.

Yea. I think some of those issues could have been youth and ego as well, especially in Montreal. I can only imagine how winning a Norris at such a young age, signing a huge contract and being in the spotlight in a market like Montreal could inflate a players ego. A lot of players become much better team guys as they age, especially when their skills start to decline and they realize they aren't elite anymore.

 

[Fjordsen]

If Adams has even the slightest doubt about Subban's identity, he simply won't sign him, he values culture too much, so I'm not worried about it. Subban could be our David Justice

 

[DapperCam]

I think Canucks are in a cap crunch. We should try to pry Horvat and Myers away. They would probably want some sort of cheaper youth to replace them coming back. Not sure who would fit the bill and be a good value.

 

[Zach716]

Isn't PK pretty much half way out the door starting his broadcasting career? It would seem pretty bizarre to have an active player assume both roles.

I'm sure an NHL contract pays more so he'd be glad to accept as long as someone is still willing but is that what we want?

I'm def on board for resigning Malcolm. Looks like he's been an awesome addition to the room and could maybe revive his career in the AHL still. Low risk-medium reward.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Isn't PK pretty much half way out the door starting his broadcasting career? It would seem pretty bizarre to have an active player assume both roles.

I'm sure an NHL contract pays more so he'd be glad to accept as long as someone is still willing but is that what we want?

I'm def on board for resigning Malcolm. Looks like he's been an awesome addition to the room and could maybe revive his career in the AHL still. Low risk-medium reward.

Sign PK to do play by play. Then we won’t have to listen to Dunleavy trying to make “TNT” a thing anymore

 

[Djp]

Super off topic, but here it goes:

The key is trust. What Marquet talks about is part of it. Doing your job is part of it. But it takes a special kind of person to form those teams, and be part of them.

Sinek talks about how in the military we give medals to people who are willing to sacrifice for others, in business they bonus those who are willing to sacrifice others for gain. Dramatic, but on target with his point.

Which leads to why special operations forces select the way they do. Why to the SEALs go through hell week? Why is Ranger school 62 days (minimum) of no sleep, minimal food, etc? Why does SFAS includes back breaking team events? It's not to find the leaders. It's to find those willing to sacrifice and work for others.

That builds trust. You find players, workers, or people in your life willing to do that, and you keep them around.

I’m not going to go into it on here but from the eyes of someone who worked as a fed fir the army has a very different POV on it.

as for special ops stuff..some of what they go thru does not build trustst all. In some ways it’s more of a glorifiedfrat house.

But you see where the comparison breaks down right? The Seals are the peak aspirational goal for a lot of career military types. They don't really compete much for elite army talent, they get to take their pick and build as they choose.

Professional Sports teams don't have that luxury. There are only so many elite talents available and 32 teams are vying to get them. The true elite talent, high character guys might play for 1 team in their career, maybe 2. You have to make choices about what players to pursue after that, and not every one is going to be a boy scout at the end of the day.



Not to dig in the Patriots history too much, but Belicheck won 3 super bowls in his first five years and was gifted with a HOF QB in his 2nd year. None of his proteges have been able to replicate his success because it was based around 2 key tenants.

1. Belicheick's defensive genius
2. Brady

Success (and luck) begat the 'Patriot way' not the other way around. If there was some magic formula Bill used for culture, it would have been replicated elsewhere already by people who saw it up close. It hasn't been, because they lack 1 and 2.

Culture, character, etc. They all matter. But, in the environment of a professional sports team, culture alone isn't enough. And the idea you can craft culture in some lab and build it is false. It's almost entirely about the players you have and getting success to reinforce it.

i agree …in the military they can screen applicants. They get the best.

Other military fields like military recruiting assignments is where a unit dumps the losers or people they want to get rid of Or the pissed off someone.

sports in a lot of ways you do have the best of the best in potential talent. That’s why the Q/A and character research is so important.

in any unit organization there can be conflicts that occur even if neither one is bad but for whatever reason they don’t work well together.

Hearing Alex DeBrinicat could be a casualty in Chicago if they cannot move Toews or Kane.

This kid would fit what were looking

chicago would want something more than Eichel got. No interest.

besides over the summers of 2022-24 there will be at least 20 named wingers ( including him) who hit UFA. Some are UFA now, some hit UFA in 1-2 years.

 

[Blitz]

Isn't PK pretty much half way out the door starting his broadcasting career? It would seem pretty bizarre to have an active player assume both roles.

I'm sure an NHL contract pays more so he'd be glad to accept as long as someone is still willing but is that what we want?

I'm def on board for resigning Malcolm. Looks like he's been an awesome addition to the room and could maybe revive his career in the AHL still. Low risk-medium reward.

Halfway out the door???! No, no he isn't.

He literally just turned 33yo - has a good 5yrs left in the NHL.

 

[Zach716]

Halfway out the door???! No, no he isn't.

He literally just turned 33yo - has a good 5yrs left in the NHL.

I don't see him having that longevity, NJ fans have talked about how he's lost all of his previous explosiveness that made him so great already.

His playstyle isn't the type that is gonna have him playing at 38.

 

[RefsIdeas]

Adam Kimelman:

Buffalo will be looking for a goalie in the future free agent market. Kimelman suggested that Ville Husso could be an option.

Sabres second priority is a top-6 forward. Options are Philip Forsberg, Johnny Gaudreau and Nazem Kadri.

Where did you see that second part? I only saw him say that we wouldn’t be interested in the top UFA forwards

 

[Fjordsen]

Where did you see that second part? I only saw him say that we wouldn’t be interested in the top UFA forwards

It was on a Russian-language site, where every 1-2 weeks there is a column "NHL Rumors" and news and rumors for all teams. So I do not guarantee the complete veracity of the news.

 

[RefsIdeas]

It was on a Russian-language site, where every 1-2 weeks there is a column "NHL Rumors" and news and rumors for all teams. So I do not guarantee the complete veracity of the news.

Ah, if I had to guess, something got lost in translation between the question and answer in this article:

Mailbag: Flyers' chances for Gaudreau, Canadiens' options with No. 1 pick | NHL.com

NHL.com's Adam Kimelman answers weekly questions

www.nhl.com

 

[BritSabre]

I get we have the floor and the potential impact on the room... But as a hockey player is Subban really a better player and fit with our other D than Mark Pysyk at 3x the price? I'd rather go for Stralman

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

I’m here for a talk on the character of the cheating Patriots with the murdering tight end

What you say is a bit of a one-off quick hit but it does have relevance in how an organization or sub-group can have breakdowns despite it's efforts to build a positive culture. @Der Jaeger gives an example of a sub-group that lives/dies by trying to adhere to the highest standards possible...and can actually function that way due to a constant flow of qualified applicants.

Many/most sub-groups have to make due with the best they can acquire through extensive competition with other sub-groups, and often have to settle or make value-balancing selections to either hold firm on standards or try their best to make the lesser qualified or even semi-rogue person with talent fit the mold of the group.

I venture to guess that Der Jaeger has more experience around the first scenario, while I have more experience among the second. I think my scenario applies a bit more accurately to a pro sports team, even though what he's saying is absolutely true in an ideal vacuum. I think anyone can point to examples of success and failure in either scenario, despite what Der Jaeger describes being the optimal environment for success. In my scenario, there are occasional Hernandez-types that infect the group or go unchecked for various reasons. The goals and values remain the same but there is a constant pendulum swing depending on the actual people in charge or being brought in during any certain time frame.

That pendulum was swinging poorly during the TM years, and now (maybe accidentally) it's swinging in the right direction. Either set of teams could of/can see some level of success but I think it more boils down to a combination of talent, character and experience throughout the line-up. I personally would hold character high on my list for who to bring on the team, but you can find great 18 yr old kids that would bust through brick walls for all the right reasons and still be 7th rd talent. I don't fool myself about what wins hockey games...you have to have talent, and at least look and hope to acquire guys that also have the team in mind.

 

[Chainshot]

 

[Blitz]

I don't see him having that longevity, NJ fans have talked about how he's lost all of his previous explosiveness that made him so great already.

His playstyle isn't the type that is gonna have him playing at 38.

You're not signing the 24yo, 60pt, top-pairing, perennial Norris candidate PK - everyone knows that in 2022. That's just not who he is anymore - NJ fans have had issues accepting that since he got there... Largely due to that $9M cap hit.

He is a VERY capable & reliable RH veteran bottom-4 D, who *at the right price* fills a huge hole here.

He's also spent the last 2yrs wearing an 'A' under Lindy - which says a TON about his leadership & presence in the room w the young guys.

He would be a very good add in Buffalo - paired with Power.

 

[CowbellConray]

You're not signing the 24yo, 60pt, top-pairing, perennial Norris candidate PK - everyone knows that in 2022. That's just not who he is anymore - NJ fans have had issues accepting that since he got there... Largely due to that $9M cap hit.

He is a VERY capable & reliable RH veteran bottom-4 D, who *at the right price* fills a huge hole here.

He's also spent the last 2yrs wearing an 'A' under Lindy - which says a TON about his leadership & presence in the room w the young guys.

He would be a very good add in Buffalo - paired with Power.

And PK commands at least some locker room respect, which is something we should also value from our bottom six and bottom pairing defensemen