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Blue Jays Discussion: Off-Season Madness the 12th: We don't know Dickey (about any extension. Yet)

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Cloned said:
Sanchez, Gose and Romero would probably get it done.

I was being sarcastic too. ;)
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I know you were kidding, I just wanted to point out the chances of it happening before were 1% and now it would be 0.1% :laugh:

Gose, Sanchez would not get it done cause they are not top elite level prospects.
 
Spezza19 said:
We have the best division in the majors.

Johnson
Dickey
Morrow

Tops Weaver/Wilson/Hanson
Tops Cain/Baugartner/Zito
Tops Kershaw/Greinke/Billingsley
Tops Price/Helickson
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The SF and LA trios could be just as good.
 
BTW, congrats on getting Dickey. He is one of the most awesome humans on the face of the planet. He's so smart, his interviews are always great. He is a huge competitor. Watching him throw his knuckleball will be a real treat. It isn't like any other knuckleball out there. He will instantly become a fan favorite. No doubt in my mind about that.
 
blader258 said:
I'm laughing at the great length that this guy has gone to discredit Colby Rasmus. The point is we have BOTH Gose and Rasmus and it makes no sense to trade either one at this time until Gose steals Colby's job. He wants to hand him the reigns to Centre field right now.

And regards to JPA I will admit I have a soft spot for him because he seems like a good clubhouse guy. Ultimately clubhouse chemistry is important and I think he plays a role in this. For as much as baseball can be reduced to a numbers game, you always have to remember the human element
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And at some point, whatever comes from the human element has to be outweighed by the cold, hard reality presented by the numbers. For perspective:

among the 26 players who you can qualify as "regular" 1Bs (500 PAs while manning 1st, an average of 3 per game), if you slotted in Arencibia's #s (which, admittedly, come from 372 PAs), he would be:

20th out of 27* in Avg
27th out of 27 in OBP
18th out of 27 in SLG
21st out of 27 in OPS
23rd out of 27 in K%
26th out of 27 in BB%
27th out of 27 in K/BB
14th out of 27 in ISO
23rd out of 27 in WRc+

*remember, 26 qualified players from last year's stats, plus Arencibia makes 27.

About the only place where he ends up sitting up closer to the top is HR rate, where he'd be I believe 7th in PAs per HR. So you'd still get solid power, but awful everything else and reverting him to terrible D having to learn a new position.
 
Spezza19 said:
So who exactly would you trade to get Price? If TB ever entertained the idea of trading Price they would NEVER do it within the division and if they did the price would be astronomical...as in what we just gave up to get Dickey.

You'd deal Romero + Gose or something? Sanchez?

Just no.....
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For Price? Easily. The cost is higher than Romero and Gose. He'll, I'd toss Sanchez in there too.

Imagine getting Price or Hernandez..
 
Spezza19 said:
I know you were kidding, I just wanted to point out the chances of it happening before were 1% and now it would be 0.1% :laugh:

Gose, Sanchez would not get it done cause they are not top elite level prospects.
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TB would think pretty hard about that deal imo.

Sanchez is rated pretty close to Syndergaard depending on who you talk to. Gose is still a blue chip prospect with elite tools.
 
Cappayne said:
As a Leafs fan who understands farm systems in general and how highly touted the Jays system is, I was scared at first at this trade. But then I realized that this is not the Maple Leafs, who I would never condone making a trade like this.

This is the Toronto Blue Jays, who just made one of the best trades I've ever seen, and who are much closer to being a contender than the Leafs have in recent memory. Sure giving up 2 top prospects is scary since we as fans read up so much on these guys, but as others have mentioned, this is the only knuckle ball pitcher in the league, the only knuckle ball pitcher to win a Cy Young (which happened to be last season), and he is not a 'one season wonder'. I think having a knuckle ball pitcher, especially a veteran, can only help the other pitchers in the rotation hit their potential. Additionally, he is known for pitching many complete games, so the Jays bullpen can hopefully have more rest with him in the mix.

If this trade sacrifices some future (2 top prospects in a system with many other hopefuls) to put the starting rotation over the edge so this team can win games NOW, AA has my full support. He can still make more deals after this.
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the blue jays are closer right now to any WS than the leafs have in my entire existence (20 years)
 
mapes said:
Sanchez is rated slightly higher I believe
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Sanchez is supposed to have better pure stuff, but is farther away from a developmental standpoint so is harder to project. Prospect experts like projectability.
 
The Nemesis said:
And at some point, whatever comes from the human element has to be outweighed by the cold, hard reality presented by the numbers. For perspective:

among the 26 players who you can qualify as "regular" 1Bs (500 PAs while manning 1st, an average of 3 per game), if you slotted in Arencibia's #s (which, admittedly, come from 372 PAs), he would be:

20th out of 27* in Avg
27th out of 27 in OBP
18th out of 27 in SLG
21st out of 27 in OPS
23rd out of 27 in K%
26th out of 27 in BB%
27th out of 27 in K/BB
14th out of 27 in ISO
23rd out of 27 in WRc+

*remember, 26 qualified players from last year's stats, plus Arencibia makes 27.

About the only place where he ends up sitting up closer to the top is HR rate, where he'd be I believe 7th in PAs per HR. So you'd still get solid power, but awful everything else and reverting him to terrible D having to learn a new position.
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Look it doesnt take Bill James to realize that JPA's OBP, Strike Out Rate and Average are terrible. While cold hard statistics must always play a factor, I still think JPA provides some value to this team outside of what he brings as an actual player
 
pooleboy said:
the blue jays are closer right now to any WS than the leafs have in my entire existence (20 years)
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Well that's because the Leafs plays hockey and by that nature cannot ever win a World Series :sarcasm:
 
Brody said:
Wasn't he trying to fight against the ban? We all know that won't work, so he'll have to give it to family or get traded..?
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It's fine. He said he'd resolve the situation some how. He fought the ban against Pitbulls in Miami. He'll most likely continue his efforts here in toronto even if he has to give his dog away short term or find a home in Buffalo/Montreal.
 
blader258 said:
Look it doesnt take Bill James to realize that JPA's OBP, Strike Out Rate and Average are terrible. While cold hard statistics must always play a factor, I still think JPA provides some value to this team outside of what he brings as an actual player
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that might be so, only stats matter if he wants to stay. (baseball is probably the only sport where stats trump everything)
 
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