Blue Jays Discussion: Off-season Edition II - Winter Meeting Madness

[canucksfan]

Popular with the core I think. Maybe not so popular with the management lol.

They were popular with Vladdy but I don't think anyone else will be impacted by them leaving. Bo seems to hang out with Springer and Chapman more.

Obviously, both of us are guessing but I do think it's telling they have brought in players with a more business-minded attitude and have shipped out two players that like to have 'fun.' Management has more of a pulse of the room than the fans do.

 

[saska sault]

I didn't realize but Varsho has 4 years control.. That's huge. Lourdes and Teo had 1.

 

[Cloned]

They were popular with Vladdy but I don't think anyone else will be impacted by them leaving. Bo seems to hang out with Springer and Chapman more.

Obviously, both of us are guessing but I do think it's telling they have brought in players with a more business-minded attitude and have shipped out two players that like to have 'fun.' Management has more of a pulse of the room than the fans do.

I hope it works out. Only time will tell.

I think Atkins panicked a bit here. Varsho is a good player but this is an overpay imo.

That said, Jays can win the trade in a lot of ways since Varsho impacts the game in a lot of different areas.

 

[Kurtz]

lol this might be a bit hyperbolic, but if he corrects a bit at the plate(was a monster in the minors) and with shift changes that i believe will naturally bump his numbers up, its not out of the realm of possibility that varsho becomes a trout-lite type of player.

Already looks like Trout, so half-way there.

 

[Sexy Necksy Garland]

No more all dressed chips for him


I honestly do believe the jays quiety was trying to make the jays more serious and less childish in the dugout. I mean its nice to have some fun. But sometimes its over the top

Maybe Jr. can be sold on ice baths being saved for playoff victories this season.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[Eyedea]

I hope it works out. Only time will tell.

I think Atkins panicked a bit here. Varsho is a good player but this is an overpay imo.

That said, Jays can win the trade in a lot of ways since Varsho impacts the game in a lot of different areas.

I’m not sure it’s an overpay, just a shrewd move for the DBacks. They had a plethora of LH OFers, the Jays ended up with likely the 2nd best one (and Carroll was probably off limits anyway). Moreno was blocked by Jansen/Kirk, and this may have been peak value for him. Gurriel doesn’t really move the needle and it may have just been the Jays giving him a chance to get more ABs elsewhere since he would’ve turned into a bad side platoon option here.

I don’t think there was a better OF option out there (and yes Reynolds has less value than Varsho) and the Jays moved their 3rd catcher and expiring LF to swing an additional ~3 wins in the OF (still have no idea where he plays).

 

[Ciao]

I didn't realize but Varsho has 4 years control.. That's huge. Lourdes and Teo had 1.

I had known that for a while, and I think some long-term planning is part of these moves.

They got ahead of things here by avoiding trade-deadline off-loads, pressured contract renewals, decisions over qualifying offers and/or the prospect of losing these roster players to free agency.

Moreno is the most durable asset they gave up between both trades.

 

[Puckstuff]

Varsho can be our Scottie Barnes swiss army knife type of player. With 3 catchers, I’m fine trading one for outfield defense. It’s very possible Moreno ends up the better player but Varsho fits better both positionally and the timeline. Really disappointed to see Moreno go (I would have preferred to move Jansen in a different trade) and this is a huge gamble. I also really like this for Arizona who just got 6 years of control with a franchise player in Moreno to add to Carroll. Arizona will be a fun team to watch. We just have to wait and see how it plays out. If Varsho has an uptick in OBP and power at Rogers center and becomes a 6 WAR guy it’s a major win. If he regresses to 3 WAR it could be really bad depending on how Moreno develops. I don’t hate it. This fills a major need and Varsho has 4 years of control and may not be done improving.

 

[OVO16]

Would love Mccutchen

 

[DonnyNucker]

But were they popular? Management stated they wanted to improve run protection and the attitude within the clubhouse. Seeing as they got rid of Gurriel and Teoscar I don't think they were as popular as we think.

Personally, I couldn’t stand Teo or Lourdes. They aren’t professionals and don’t give a damn about defence. To each their own

 

[Ciao]

Wikipedia says that Daulton Varsho is named after his father's Philadelphia Phillies teammate Darren Daulton, who was the Phillies catcher in the 1993 World Series against the Blue Jays.

Small world, that MLB ecosystem.

 

[Langdon Alger]

Would love Mccutchen

No deal McCutchen, that moon money is mine.

 

[Wry n Ginger]

I wonder if part of the Skydome renovation will be to make the outfield bigger. Otherwise, having 3 extremely rangy defensive outfielders, you run into diminished returns, defensively. We need to turn Skydome into Coors pretty much to maximize our advantage.

Gurriel and Hernandez couldn't figure out a regular shaped outfield. They would have been a disaster out there with the newly shaped walls.

 

[Ciao]

@DonnyNucker -- I like Teoscar. I thought he is pretty good and brought a very professional attitude.

Not so much for Gurriel -- I think I'm biased against him because I just don't like his creepy hair. Turns me off, that kind of thing. Too much "look at me!"

 

[Langdon Alger]

We should be a very good defensive team, which I like.

 

[BertCorbeau]

In terms of a win now mindset you can downplay Jansen’s game calling. He’s the best of the 3 right now. Moreno will undoubtedly get there and Kirk will get better, but IIRC the pitching was a lot better when Jano wasn’t injured.

It’s one reason why I don’t mind keeping him

 

[Schennanigans]

Sad to see Moreno go, but I just knew he was gonna be the one to go to improve a need. Was a pretty high price to even see gurriel be added too. He will be missed as well.

 

[saska sault]

I don't know if the moves were made to break up the Kids having fun atmosphere as much as it was, they think that entire group just had too many limitations.. Also like others mentioned final year of their deals, demanding raises and we can get a more versatile, defensive player under control. Still good flexibility for moves before spring training and with Ryu and others gone, we could potentially go big game hunting next off season with some huge names potentially hitting the market.

 

[phillipmike]

Basically the thread summarizes there is evidence thay the Rogers Centre outfield will increase, mostly in CF. Which basically enhances the need for great OF defence, mainly CF.

 

[ItalianLeaf]

Austin Martin was also once highly regarded and was right up there in the rankings and look at him now. The bust rate in baseball is super high for top picks. Its a win now move.

This is one of those trades that could end up being a win-win for both teams.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Austin Martin was also once highly regarded and was right up there in the rankings and look at him now. The bust rate in baseball is super high for top picks. Its a win now move.

This is one of those trades that could end up being a win-win for both teams.

Moreno has performed in both the minors and the majors. Martin performed in neither. Nothing comparable there. It's like comparing Pearson to Tiedemann and saying we should have traded him for Reynolds because they could end up as busts.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

I still hope we can add Matt Moore to the pen. Adding him and another bat like Grossman or Profar would be helpful.

 

[Kurtz]

I was lamenting our lack of leadership and frequent aloofness earlier in the offseason. With Mattingly, Varsho, Bassit, KK aboard that should be fixed to say the least.

And adding Mcctuchen's leadership would just be ...chef's kiss. A real Molitor-like acquisition.