Confirmed Trade: [NYR/OTT] Mika Zibanejad & 2018 2nd round pick for Derick Brassard & 2018 7th rounder
- Thread starter Marlo Stanfield
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Lemmiwinks
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Brass agitates with the best of them, too, IIRC. Both teams should be happy with this deal. This is a great needs-based trade.
As an outside fan (Canuck fan) Ottawas top6 is one of the most fluid defensivley and offensive, looks great.
Teams playing a line of Hoffman Brassard Stone will never have puck possession and if they do, they won't really.
Great trade for the Sens today and it won't really effect them as much as one would think down the road IMO Brassard would be much harder to replace than Zibby.
Teams playing a line of Hoffman Brassard Stone will never have puck possession and if they do, they won't really.
Great trade for the Sens today and it won't really effect them as much as one would think down the road IMO Brassard would be much harder to replace than Zibby.
VS keeping less productive and inconsistent players with "potential" ?
Zibby wasn't working in OTT - for whatever reason. Maybe Brassard doesn't pan out any better, but good on Ottawa for trying to address their needs by acquiring a better and well rounded player.
While that's technically true, I think most would agree that at best, he's a low end #1C. Personally when I think of #1Cs, Brassard is not what comes to mind. That said, he'll probably do even better in Ottawa then he did in NYR offensively.
No there are not. There's players that have played in that role or rather have been forced to play that role due to the team not having sufficient personal (Bozak immediately comes to mind), but that doesn't mean he's a #1C. Because by that same token, Malkin is now a #2C, which clearly isn't the case.
The minutes or where you play does not mean you are (or are not) a #1C/#2C or whatever. It's whether you can handle that role or not. And there are not 30 #1Cs who can handle that roll on a night in and night out basis. Brassard to a lesser extent is one of these players who can.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
Not sure about that. The Rangers have been one of the better offensive teams in the league for a few years. I don't know that there's much room for improvement.
I think the discussion about 1Cs amounts to a simple idea: is he a 1C no matter who his wingers are? Not sure Brassard is.
You're never going to win a cup if you can't first make the playoffs. If this was a trade for a 30+ yr old center, I think short sighted would be an accurate statement. However that's not the case (Brassard is 28) and I do not think this will be the case. Zibby might find his game in New York, and people might look back on this with regret, but in his last couple of years in Ottawa, that hasn't been the case. OTT is getting the better player today and likely the player that will be a better fit over the next few seasons. After that due to their strong drafting (and poor finishes) they have Brown and White coming up.
Brooklyn Rangers Fan
Change is good.
Understand Sens fans, a lot of what you hear from Rangers fans posting in this thread is due to the fact that Brassard is a very emotive guy - I have no doubt that he cares very strongly about winning, but he makes it CLEAR that he cares. And that goes a long way with the fanbase. You're seeing some overrating of the guy as a result. If you actually go to our page and read the thread there, you'll see a whole lot of "NOOOOO!" in the first hour after it was announced for exactly the same reason. But after that first hour - and still taking into account that he's a fan favorite, mind you - the vast majority of us think we did very well in this deal.
Here's what you get with Brassard:
- Creative, pass-first mentality.
- Has the ability to rip the slapper, and will occasionally do so to mix it up, or if the PP has become stagnant.
- On the offensive side of the puck, he has very good vision and anticipation.
- Decent agility
- Average speed
- Mediocre defensively
- Below average physicality
- Streaky during the regular season
- Steps up in the playoffs
Essentially, you have a skilled player who is a lot better in the offensive zone than anywhere else. He could be a poor man's 1C, and is an above average 2C, so long as you can give him sheltered zone starts. Too much time in his own end is a problem.
The really ironic thing about this deal, given the complaints about Zibenejad is that though a self-proclaimed "hockey nerd" Brassard, after a good start in his first, injury shortened season at the age of 21, then became the very definition of "underwhelming, shows flashes, streaky as hell" for the next five years (and, in his case, "soft" as well), including his first full year as a Ranger. (Though he was good for the partial year and POs post-trade.) It's only in his last two years, during his 27- and 28-year-old seasons that he's put together a bit more consistency (a lot of which IMO comes from finding chemistry with Zuccarello).
The funny thing is, I spent a lot of that first year defending Brassard against his detractors, who decried his inconsistency, but after two seasons of 60 and 58 point play - and showing that he gave a **** all along - he's become a fan favorite. So, as I said, he's being overrated, especially by the folks posting here.
I do think he's a better fit for the Senators roster than Zibanejad given his profile as left-handed and pass-first vs. right-handed and shoot-first.
But I like this deal a LOT for a rebuilding Rangers team. We got a guy whose numbers have gone up every year, and who last year, at the age of 22, was not far off from Brassard's production (besting Brassard's best year prior to turning 27). He also is bigger, stronger, and does not require sheltered zone starts. Does he suffer from inconsistency, and has he shown up out of shape? Obviously. But production-wise it's ALREADY close between the two of them, and how many of us had our **** together as 20, 21, 22 year olds? Brassard certainly didn't.
Throw in the fact that Zibanejad has upside that Brassard no longer has, plays a power game (admittedly when he's on), has a lower AAV, is team controlled for three more years... and you threw in a 2nd round pick?
As I said, I think Brassard's a good fit for your current squad – hopefully he takes you on a nice, long PO run or two over the next couple of years. If you ARE that close to the cup, then it may work out for you. But from an asset management point of view, this tilts heavily in favor of the Rangers, IMO.
Here's what you get with Brassard:
- Creative, pass-first mentality.
- Has the ability to rip the slapper, and will occasionally do so to mix it up, or if the PP has become stagnant.
- On the offensive side of the puck, he has very good vision and anticipation.
- Decent agility
- Average speed
- Mediocre defensively
- Below average physicality
- Streaky during the regular season
- Steps up in the playoffs
Essentially, you have a skilled player who is a lot better in the offensive zone than anywhere else. He could be a poor man's 1C, and is an above average 2C, so long as you can give him sheltered zone starts. Too much time in his own end is a problem.
The really ironic thing about this deal, given the complaints about Zibenejad is that though a self-proclaimed "hockey nerd" Brassard, after a good start in his first, injury shortened season at the age of 21, then became the very definition of "underwhelming, shows flashes, streaky as hell" for the next five years (and, in his case, "soft" as well), including his first full year as a Ranger. (Though he was good for the partial year and POs post-trade.) It's only in his last two years, during his 27- and 28-year-old seasons that he's put together a bit more consistency (a lot of which IMO comes from finding chemistry with Zuccarello).
The funny thing is, I spent a lot of that first year defending Brassard against his detractors, who decried his inconsistency, but after two seasons of 60 and 58 point play - and showing that he gave a **** all along - he's become a fan favorite. So, as I said, he's being overrated, especially by the folks posting here.
I do think he's a better fit for the Senators roster than Zibanejad given his profile as left-handed and pass-first vs. right-handed and shoot-first.
But I like this deal a LOT for a rebuilding Rangers team. We got a guy whose numbers have gone up every year, and who last year, at the age of 22, was not far off from Brassard's production (besting Brassard's best year prior to turning 27). He also is bigger, stronger, and does not require sheltered zone starts. Does he suffer from inconsistency, and has he shown up out of shape? Obviously. But production-wise it's ALREADY close between the two of them, and how many of us had our **** together as 20, 21, 22 year olds? Brassard certainly didn't.
Throw in the fact that Zibanejad has upside that Brassard no longer has, plays a power game (admittedly when he's on), has a lower AAV, is team controlled for three more years... and you threw in a 2nd round pick?
As I said, I think Brassard's a good fit for your current squad – hopefully he takes you on a nice, long PO run or two over the next couple of years. If you ARE that close to the cup, then it may work out for you. But from an asset management point of view, this tilts heavily in favor of the Rangers, IMO.
Blackhawkswincup
RIP Fugu
darko
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- Feb 16, 2009
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Wait what? I'm not saying every team has 1 top line C. Some teams have 2, others have none. There are 30 teams so really there are 30 #1Cs scattered around the league. Brassard is in that 30.
The Expert
Registered Expert
Unfortunately so has his icetime. An extra 5 points should be expected with an extra minute and a half a game.
Also even when he's on, it's not from playing a power game at all. He has a lot of skill and it certainly does occasionally shine. Brassard doesn't have to improve for Ottawa to be happy with this trade. If Zibanejad doesn't improve, I can't say the same for Rangers fans.
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Saying there are 30 #1Cs is like saying there are 30 #1Ds as well which is certainly not the case, imo. Being a #1C or #1D means that you can make those on the ice with you better and can produce at a high rate, not necessarily a point per game, but still at a high rate. There doesn't have to be 30 #1Cs, and, imo, I don't think there are that many. Brassard is a low end #1C which I don't prefer to label him as which could just be my own definition and because he isn't that responsible in the defensive end, but he is a very solid #2C mostly because his offensive production makes up for where he lacks defensively if he was started in the right zone
bert
Registered User
JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
Nah. Toronto has now set their sights on Tavares. It's basically an E5 that he's coming home. They've basically already laid out the red carpet.
bert
Registered User
bert
Registered User
This is a high quality honest post, dont see this too often.
How is Brassard in the shoot out? Zibby is money, he definitely had a hand in getting the sens a few extra points.
The Expert
Registered Expert
SpezDispenser
Registered User
- Aug 15, 2007
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True, I forgot about the "Leaf" factor. It'll be a shame seeing him suit up for the Blue and White.
- Jul 28, 2011
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I think the real problem is people compare those lower #1's with the high elite #1's. He's not a franchise center. He's not going to be as good as a franchise center.
I have never seen any fire or special drive from Zibby. He has skills, but has not yet been motivated to use them. A change of scenery might do him good. I'm fine with the pick swap, compensates for Brassard being the better player right now.
Makar Goes Fast
grocery stick
haha this is my favourite all time trade. guess zibby isn't worth duchene after all. welcome to reality those who thought otherwise.
The problem on this site has to do with what people actually mean when they say someone is a #1C or a #1D.
The first definition would be is he a top 30C in the league, so that if talent is spread out equally between all 30 fanbases would he be a #1 center. In Brassard's case, he probably would be, but it would be awfully close.
The second definition tends to be, if you have a balanced team (not grossly overcompensating in other areas like the 90's/2000's Devils) can this player be a #1C on a team capable of winning the cup. Brassard may qualify, because him and Stepan came quite close, but that is a much more doubtful than the first definition.
Another major factor that gets overlooked when just looking at point production is the context in which players are used. Over the last 3 years I would take David Backes, and Kesler over Brassard due to their numbers being depressed by system or in how they were deployed.
Granted, the Senators now basically have the set-up the Rangers had at center the last 2 years. Two fringe #1 or high-end 2's splitting the duties.
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