Nylander Chronicles Part XXIV: Homer's Odyssey Edition

[FerrisRox]

I wonder if Dubas OK'd the Carolina "interested in willy" announcement?

Ok'ed it to who?

 

[GoonieFace]

He is a Red Deer Rebel. That means he is pretty good but not close to Nylander good, would be wanting a whole heck of a lot more.

I just meant they called up a defence man and that usually leads to utter chaos

 

[Jack Bauer]

Genuinely curious how? We can’t trade him he has a NMC. We can’t buy him out cause the full cap hit counts against us. We can’t force him to retire. The only way we can LTIR him is he shows up to camp unfit to play, which for someone that’s on an Ironman streak seems kinda unlikely

Let it play out. He won't be around by next October. Contract structure is enough of a sign that's been the plan since he signed.

Just like we couldn't rid ourselves of Clarkson and Robidas was an anchor we'd have and we'd never move Phaneuf without retaining we will rid ourselves of Marleau by July 1.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Interesting, thanks for this. I'm still dubious about trading Nylander for a defenseman with little to no offensive game, but at least his chops as a defensive defenseman appear to be real.

I understand the scepticism from a point perspective but it's near impossible to put up a respectable number of points as a defenseman without PP time. You're definitely looking at a defensive defenseman, he doesn't put up many points, but his team still does generate an decent number of chances, shots, expected goals, etc when he's on the ice. On a 1 to 10 scale I'd say at defense/supression he's a 9.5, on the offensive/generation side he's a 4-5 maybe. The year before he was traded Larsson was maybe a 5-6 on the defensive side, and a 1 offensively. You can live with only getting an average number of chances, because he gives up absolutely none as opposed to being good defensively and never seeing the other end of the ice. But if we got him, playing with Rielly, and the forwards there should be little trouble for the team offensively when he's on the ice.,

 

[thewave]

I just meant they called up a defence man and that usually leads to utter chaos

It's going to happen. If not for a top D we're going to get a package of picks and prospects more than likely. It's not managements fault though, I am not going to blame the Leafs for this, maybe Babcocks usage of him a bit and perhaps a tad with the Owners and the whole Sins of the Father Sportsnet article that was stupid. I could see a grudge stemming from that.

 

[Metroid]

We getting a Trick or treat tonight?

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

We getting a Trick or treat tonight?

Another trick.

 

[Not My Tempo]

What I imagine most of us are like currently:

 

[LeafsHome]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

 

[Suntouchable13]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

What are the Leafs supposed to do? The agent and the father are total pieces of shit.

 

[ToneDog]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

Seguin was traded for different reasons. AVs, TB and CBJ did just fine trading their non-contents.

 

[4thline]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

To be fair though, there's a lot of bad luck and mismanagement that contributes to that regret.

They got
3 years of a proven and consistent 70 point winger with strong-two way ability (who's career crashed post trade)
An NHL ready top 6 forward (that they traded away for nothing, coming off a 60 point season)
One a teams top defense prospects (one of the others is now a top pair dman, another is a top 4, they got the bust)

If you put together a today equivalent package for Nylander and proposed the main board would erupt with jeering at the "outrageous demands".

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

What I imagine most of us are like currently:

That right there is the roster. Now let's talk about the roster. Can we talk about the roster, please, Shanny? I've been dying to talk about the roster with you all day, OK? "William Nylander," this name keeps coming up over and over again. Every day Nylander’s name is getting sent back to me. William Nylander! William Nylander! I look on the roster, and I don’t see William Nylander! So I say to myself, "I gotta find this guy! I gotta go up to his place and put this kid’s name to paper! Otherwise, he's never going to play on this team and people will keep asking me about him." So I go up to Nylander’s locker and what do I find out, Shanny? What do I find out?! There is no William Nylander. The man does not exist, okay? So I decide, "Oh shit, buddy, I gotta dig a little deeper." There's no William Nylander? You gotta be kidding me! I got mobs yelling about him! All right. So I start marchin' my way down to Lewis Gross of SPM and I knock on his door and I say, "Lewis! Lewis! I gotta talk to you about Nylander." And when I open the door what do I find? There's not a single goddamn desk in that office! There...is...no...Lewis of SPM. Shanny, half the people I keep hearing about have been made up. This kid is a goddamn ghost.

 

[Clark4Ever]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

Chiarelli was solely responsible for the Seguin (and Hamilton) debacle. There are also examples of GMs getting full value for talented young players (ie. Jones for Johansen, Sergachev for Drouin, etc.).

If we can parlay Nylander into an equally talented young defenceman, I would take that all day long.

 

[Marshy]

Trade him for picks and highly rated prospects. Use the cap space to improve the team at the deadline and at the draft this year with the surplus of assets you are able to recoup. Plus there is July 1 shopping spree too. We don't have to load up for a big run this year. Let's be poised to be a perennial contender for a decade. I'm fairly sure Dubas isn't the short-sighted type. Not even worried.

 

[Brobust]

What are the Leafs supposed to do? The agent and the father are total pieces of ****.

The leafs are a very good team even without Nylander. So let him sit out a season if he pushes it that far.

 

[Pookie]

Your the one who said it’s a loss if we don’t sign or trade Willy.

Irregardless whether we let Willy sit for a year Dubas will make moves at the deadline if we are close to a cup contender.

Willy has no options. I don’t think you get it. It doesn’t matter if Carolina is willing to trade it has to be what we want and that’s not a guarantee. Maybe they offer Faulk and a first and we say Slavin and a first or no deal. Dubas doesn’t have to trade with Carolina unless he gets what he wants, again Willy has no options.

The only sure option Willy has is an offer sheet and evidence suggest by the lack of one that no one wants to give up the assets
That it will take.

Again Willy has no options but these

Sign a bridge and prove he is worth his asking price on his next deal
Sign what is offered in a long term deal
Sit out a year
Hope another team submits an offer sheet and is willing to lose the assets
Sign in the khl for 1/5 th of what he would make in the nhl

Dubas under the above scenario

A bridge deal helps us with cap for the next few years. If nylander scores 80 points we sign him if we can but if not get some great assets in trade

Sign the long term is a win for Dubas

Only hurts Willy. We retain his rights till 27

Match offer sheet or take assets

Have you followed the Leafs for long?

A GM that does not improve his team isn't a GM for long. We have an asset. He must be signed or traded. There is no holding him (or his return asset) out for a year.

This rookie GM will be eaten alive as the season unfolds if he fails to improve the team. And his risks further scrutiny if the trade back fires.

Welcome to Toronto

 

[Pookie]

The leafs are a very good team even without Nylander. So let him sit out a season if he pushes it that far.

Leaf fans don't want a very good team. They want a Cup.

 

[LeafsHome]

What are the Leafs supposed to do? The agent and the father are total pieces of ****.

I agree, they are delusional - I guess, Nylander and camp are proably asking themselves the same question. They can't force a trade on the Leafs and if push comes to shove Nylander will have to cave, be it this year or next.

As a fan, I'd rather be without Nylander for one season knowing he will be with the team long term.

 

[Brobust]

Leaf fans don't want a very good team. They want a Cup.

Trading Nylander for a mediocre return doesn't take them any closer to the cup. It's an extremely short sighted way of doing things.

 

[TimeZone]

Trade him for picks and highly rated prospects. Use the cap space to improve the team at the deadline and at the draft this year with the surplus of assets you are able to recoup. Plus there is July 1 shopping spree too. We don't have to load up for a big run this year. Let's be poised to be a perennial contender for a decade. I'm fairly sure Dubas isn't the short-sighted type. Not even worried.

We are in "Win now" mode. Trading our 22 year old 60+ point player for Draft picks and prospects(unless they're NHL ready NOW) would be moronic.

Plus I'm not exactly sure how useful that cap space would be around Deadline time, I mean who's honestly expected to be available?

If we're trading Willie, we need another good young player coming back who can contribute immediately, period

 

[Pookie]

Trading Nylander for a mediocre return doesn't take them any closer to the cup. It's an extremely short sighted way of doing things.

Plan A would be pay him market value. Ask what the Canes would pay. Then pay that.

 

[socko]

I don't believe the Hurricanes would grossly overpay Nylander with Sebastain Aho's contract coming up - who is a much better player. If we get a good return for Willy, I'm going to be very happy. Stevie Y did it with Drouin, so it's possible.

 

[Stephen]

But trading him for an expensive forward lands the Leafs back where they started. A difficult cap situation.

I'm perfectly content being in a cap situation where we are paying for expensive young good players. Just with Aho you preserve the Nylander value and you keep your options open. Whereas if you trade for Pesce, you basically got 65 cents on the dollar for Nylander and you start feeling like Peter Chiarelli.

 

[Warden of the North]

Most of the times a team trades away a very good young player it doesn't end well for that team - look at Boston and Tyler Seguin - they have nothing to show for it - none of the players and picks Boston received are any longer with the team - Boston still regretting that trade to this day

Boston trading Kessel was superb, on the other hand.

NJ got the Hart winner for a young Dman.

Nashville got Seth Jones

Calgary got Lindholm and Hanifin for Hamilton