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Prospect Info: Nils Lundkvist: Part II

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True Blue said:
Trouba was a good idea then. He is a good idea now. He will be a good idea in the future.

Robertson?? Jones? Lundqvist? The chances of all three becoming productive NHLers is slim to none. The chances that ANY of them will be able to play on a top pair against the oppositions top players is even less than that. And while we all love what the young defensemen have done this year, we all should also realize that none of them, at least for the lion's part of the season, had Trouba's usage. They were all effectively sheltered by the time that Trouba had, in the defensive zone and against the opposition's top players.
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I keep hearing this argument that Trouba consistently have more difficult assignments than Fox and DeAngelo. Do we actually have any real stats that suggest this? Because I have seen Fox out against teams' top lines fairly regularly and performing quite well in those situations. So I am curious if it really is so disproportionate how they are used against tough assignments.

Also for the sake of this argument we are talking about the RD so Robertson and Jones shouldn't be in the discussion. The question really is, will Lundkvist pan out? Obviously it is a gamble but even if it doesn't pan out, finding a solid 3rd pair RD won't be that hard. But I rather go with Fox and ADA as my 1RD and 2RD than to have Trouba replace either one of them, especially with his contract. I see Lundkvist at the very least being a capable 3RD, which fits into our plans. Anything more than that is just gravy.
 
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The New Russian Five said:
I keep hearing this argument that Trouba consistently have more difficult assignments than Fox and DeAngelo. Do we actually have any real stats that suggest this? Because I have seen Fox out against teams' top lines fairly regularly and performing quite well in those situations. So I am curious if it really is so disproportionate how they are used against tough assignments.

Also for the sake of this argument we are talking about the RD so Robertson and Jones shouldn't be in the discussion. The question really is, will Lundkvist pan out? Obviously it is a gamble but even if it doesn't pan out, finding a solid 3rd pair RD won't be that hard. But I rather go with Fox and ADA as my 1RD and 2RD than to have Trouba replace either one of them, especially with his contract. I see Lundkvist at the very least being a capable 3RD, which fits into our plans. Anything more than that is just gravy.
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Lundkvist himself expects to start in Hartford. He was very clear about that last month. There's really no reason to get ahead of ourselves and expect him to make the team, forcing us to make a decision. The 3 guys on the right will all be there next season.
 
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The New Russian Five said:
I keep hearing this argument that Trouba consistently have more difficult assignments than Fox and DeAngelo. Do we actually have any real stats that suggest this? Because I have seen Fox out against teams' top lines fairly regularly and performing quite well in those situations. So I am curious if it really is so disproportionate how they are used against tough assignments.

Also for the sake of this argument we are talking about the RD so Robertson and Jones shouldn't be in the discussion. The question really is, will Lundkvist pan out? Obviously it is a gamble but even if it doesn't pan out, finding a solid 3rd pair RD won't be that hard. But I rather go with Fox and ADA as my 1RD and 2RD than to have Trouba replace either one of them, especially with his contract. I see Lundkvist at the very least being a capable 3RD, which fits into our plans. Anything more than that is just gravy.
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DeAngelo starts 39% of his shifts in the offensive zone against 30% in the defensive zone. Fox is at 33/28. Trouba is at 27/34, 5v5 per Corsica. Unfortunately the QoC stats out there aren't particularly good, or not really good for showing much. Like I could tell you that the CF% QoC for those three has Trouba on top, but separated by a half-percent, with basically the entire defense separated by a point. So you can't tell anything from that.

I think based on zone starts and observing match ups, it was pretty clear Quinn would try to have the Skjei-Trouba pairing out there as often as possible, and would try to get them out on the fly against top lines as much as possible. Again, all the stats that I'm aware of, not really great at illustrating that. That's what I saw, though.

I also saw an increasingly reliance on Fox and Lindgren as the season wore on. Particularly Fox. He's good at everything. I do also feel that Quinn recognizes DeAngelo is defensively limited and tries to put him in a position to succeed as much as possible, while keeping him away from offensively gifted lines, particularly those with weight to them.
 
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The New Russian Five said:
So we can both agree that defensively they are both not very good. And I'm sure offensively DeAngelo is miles ahead of him. But DeAngelo will likely be a $5.5-6mill defenseman while Trouba an $8mill defenseman. But somehow DeAngelo is the one you rather trade than Trouba? :huh:
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Where did I say that I'd rather trade Deangelo than Trouba? I wouldn't trade either of them. I'd rather move ADA or Fox to the left side than trade one of our RD for a LD that'll probably be worse than what we're trading.

And no, I don't agree that Trouba isn't very good defensively at all lmao. I think that's pretty clear. You just like putting words in my mouth.
 
ElLeetch said:
Well, we didn't *know* what kind of RD corps we had. Fox had 0 NHL games, ADA had a good, but up and down rookie year, and Lindkvist hadn't broken out yet. 12 months ago, Trouba was a player we desperately needed.
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We still need him. Defense would be smurfsville without him on it, and yes, it matters.
 
MahomesIsGod said:
We still need him. Defense would be smurfsville without him on it, and yes, it matters.
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It does, but Lindgren plays big and Robertson/Miller are 6'4 while Hajek/Rykov are 6'2 so we will likely have bigger/tougher guys on the left to compensate. Also not particularly worried about Fox against pretty much anyone.
 
Blue Blooded said:
It does, but Lindgren plays big and Robertson/Miller are 6'4 while Hajek/Rykov are 6'2 so we will likely have bigger/tougher guys on the left to compensate. Also not particularly worried about Fox against pretty much anyone.
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Aside from Fox and Lindgren, everyone else you mentioned is, at best, in the AHL
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
They should, but they won't. Once Lundkvist earns his spot on the team (in 2021), they can tackle that issue. Until then, Fox, DeAngelo and Trouba will be playing on the right side
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the second half of that is the key...they probably aren't going to move one of them if there are only 3. there is no point....but if Lundkvist is the real deal (which I think he is) and gets added as a 4th guy then decisions need to be made. and you have to weigh the options of moving one to the left vs the potential return in a trade.

I also think that many people are looking at this in a short term view, the left side of our blueline is atrocious right night. but the system is loaded with LHD, just cause the RHD are a little older and more ready doesn't mean we should just forget about all the LHD that we have coming. how those kids develop will also weigh in on the decision
 
Blue Blooded said:
It does, but Lindgren plays big and Robertson/Miller are 6'4 while Hajek/Rykov are 6'2 so we will likely have bigger/tougher guys on the left to compensate. Also not particularly worried about Fox against pretty much anyone.
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Being big and playing a physical game are two different things
 
The New Russian Five said:
I keep hearing this argument that Trouba consistently have more difficult assignments than Fox and DeAngelo. Do we actually have any real stats that suggest this? Because I have seen Fox out against teams' top lines fairly regularly and performing quite well in those situations. So I am curious if it really is so disproportionate how they are used against tough assignments.
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Just look at total ice time and how many defensive zone shifts have been taken.
 
True Blue said:
Let Fox and DeAgelo handle his assignments and see how their stats are.
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Fox has been for a while and hes done a better job with it.

When it comes to DeAngelo, you have to take into account the great equalizer

marc-staal-2019-48.jpg
 
Vitto79 said:
Why should they ? Can’t hand Lundkvist a spot . IF plays great then they can figure it out

What if a RD gets hurt ? Can slide him in
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not exactly referring to "for Lundkvist". I think it should be a long term strategy regardless of how Lundkvist develops.
 
True Blue said:
Why should they?
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it's a good way to get your three really good RHD lots of the minutes you want them to have.

I'd like all three of them getting 20+ minutes of TOI a game between all situations unless we somehow find a similar embarrassment of riches on the left side.
 
I think Brooks' argument, that NYR should park Nils and K'Andre in Hartford, and leave them there all season, resist temptation to call up, makes a lot of sense.
They both would benefit and just be more ready when needed.
Next year is (hopefully) the final transition season, get through it without those 2.
 
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