Confirmed with Link: Nick Robertson asks for trade (Update signs 1 year/875k deal with leafs)

[Nineteen67]

He may have gotten offersheets. Same as all the others that you think got them. Like the supposed others, they would only be made public if they were signed.

The offer sheets were never signed obviously, but they were finally recognized this summer and not just made up in Dreger’s mind. Too bad the GM didn’t use it to the Leafs’ advantage.

Not sure any team would offer Robertson enough that the Leafs wouldn't match, but it’s a great opportunity for a team to snag him for an overpay.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

You must hate Robertson for irrational reasons if you are impressed with Caufield's numbers.

The difference in their goals is PPGs, they have the same G/GP (Robertson is slightly ahead) when you remove that.

Now if you start looking into who they play with and TOI, you may find Robertson's numbers more impressive.

I knew Caufield wasn't living up to the hype but didn't know it was this bad.

Weird to try to defend other players who have similar stats and then hate on Robertson.

It's good to update your intel from time to time.

What? Caufield had 65 points in 82 games last season. Is that bad? I'm sorry, but Robertson will likely never produce like that. He doesn't have the skill set. What's the hype about Caufield?

 

[crump]

So possible outcomes:

• He sits until he changes his mind
• He sits until Tre gets a trade worthwhile (I’m thinking a first and a good prospect is the minimum considering he’s a RFA)
• Another team offer sheets him a contract that provided crap compensation because it’s a low ball number, so Tre accepts to match and Nicky Bobby has to stay anyway (offer sheet matching also doesn’t include NTC or NMC or bonuses)
• The offer sheet is high enough that you get at least 1,2,3 round picks, Tre still has final say.
• Nick might sit out the year and still be at the same spot next August.
• Nick doesn’t have much leverage

 

[notbias]

What? Caufield had 65 points in 82 games last season. Is that bad? I'm sorry, but Robertson will likely never produce like that. He doesn't have the skill set. What's the hype about Caufield?

Remove powerplay points (can't compare them with that big of a difference in PPTOI and which unit they are on).

Then compare the two, and adjust for GP.

I don't think this is perfect, but here, these are G/60 and P/60 at 5v5.

Robertson: 1.34 G/60, 2.36 P/60
Caufield: 0.80 G/60, 1.90 P/60

It's hard to compare the two players because they are deployed very differently, have different quality of opponent, different quality of linemates, different PP time, etc.

Just pretending like Caufield is absolutely killing it and Robertson is failing miserably is hilarious.

I am not saying Robertson is the better player by the way, but I bet Robertson puts up 50+ points if he was given the opportunity Caufield has (not saying he should be given that opportunity).

PP1, 1st shooting option, 20 mins of ice time, his numbers without that are already respectable.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Robertson's not worth much.

The most you can expect in a trade is what compensation for an offer sheet would be. Anything between $1.5M-$2.3M is only a 3rd. Between $2.3M-$4.6M is only a 2nd.

Nobody in their right mind is offering him more than $4.6M.

So he's only worth a middling pick. That's if you even find someone offering futures. More likely all anyone is willing to part with for an undersized injury prone one trick pony demanding a trade is another disgruntled employee of their own.

Is it really worth the hassle.

Just cut the cord already. Bury him on a bottom feeder like San Jose for future considerations. That's what he wants anyway is the ice time and opportunity he apparently wasn't getting here.

It worked out so well for Zadina.

 

[DarkKnight]

Two straight camps he earned a gig, wasn't given it. Scored at a great goal pace, played 9 minutes and no PP time. Every mistake he was benched. Keefe mismanaged this guy, can't blame him for wanting to go elsewhere. That said, he has a great opportunity this year, hope he reconsiders. You'll never recoup his value in a trade under these circumstances. I thought he matured last year, wasn't going a thousand miles an hour and looked way more defensively responsible.

 

[LeafGrief]

Some of the point projections and discussions about Robertson in here remind me of Leivo. Guy who passed the eye test pretty well and always had great points/minutes numbers when he was a tweener or at the bottom of the lineup. We clamoured for years for him to get his big shot, and when he did he just didn't have "it" to be a top6 forward. Or even really an NHL'er for that matter.

Maybe Robertson is legit, I can see that he's got 20g upside. But there's still very much a chance that he's just a scoring depth piece who might not even stick in the league. He scores every now and then, but aside from that Dallas game where he bagged two including the overtime winner, I never really think "this guy is a player". He might be a player, but the depth role that he's had for the last two years has been exactly right for what he brings.

 

[Twine Tickler]

I've always liked Nick as a player and as an athlete. He clearly gives a shit about his craft. I will always remember him forgoing the world juniors at the off chance that he'd make the team out of camp. It really showed where his focus was. Needless to say, his work ethic and determination has never been something I question.

Through a combination of bad luck, injury, and mismanagement Nick has been the yo-yo of our organization. Due in large part to his 2-way contract and inconsistent play.

I completely understand Nick's frustration as it relates to being a cap casualty for a team that has had Ryan Reaves, David Kampf, Wayne Simmonds..etc on multi year deals. That would piss me off as well.

That said, Nick has never made good of the opportunities he has been given. The door has been open for him to take hold of a bigger role, and he's failed to do that on repeated occasion. That is not to say that day will never come, but he hasn't earned that role on a consistent basis.

I'm not sure how a player of his caliber can look at our "depth" at LW and feel like there is a better opportunity elsewhere in the league.

If I am Brad, I fully understand Nick's POV. I'd do my best to accommodate his request, but I would not be moving him for pennies on the dollar. That's unfortunately not how the business works. As much as I hate seeing young careers "rot" by being boxed out as a result of the cap, it's hardly like that would be the case for Nick this upcoming season. His pathway to consistent NHL minutes has never been easier. As Travis Kelce once said "Know your role and shut your mouth you jabroni"

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Wonder why every other Leaf rfa supposedly gets multiple offer sheets, but the guy most primed for one continues to sit without a contract?

Because nobody respects the Leafs and the market is soft so players can essentially say they don't want to play here unless overpaid and then be welcomed back with open arms as if nothing happened.

 

[Nineteen67]

Remove powerplay points (can't compare them with that big of a difference in PPTOI and which unit they are on).

Then compare the two, and adjust for GP.

I don't think this is perfect, but here, these are G/60 and P/60 at 5v5.

Robertson: 1.34 G/60, 2.36 P/60
Caufield: 0.80 G/60, 1.90 P/60

It's hard to compare the two players because they are deployed very differently, have different quality of opponent, different quality of linemates, different PP time, etc.

Just pretending like Caufield is absolutely killing it and Robertson is failing miserably is hilarious.

I am not saying Robertson is the better player by the way, but I bet Robertson puts up 50+ points if he was given the opportunity Caufield has (not saying he should be given that opportunity).

PP1, 1st shooting option, 20 mins of ice time, his numbers without that are already respectable.

Or just stay in reality.

 

[rocketman588]

The offer sheets were never signed obviously, but they were finally recognized this summer and not just made up in Dreger’s mind. Too bad the GM didn’t use it to the Leafs’ advantage.

Not sure any team would offer Robertson enough that the Leafs wouldn't match, but it’s a great opportunity for a team to snag him for an overpay.

They're probably offer sheeting because you can get a b prospect for nothing if the leafs don't match.

That doesn't mean that we can trade him for any value

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Or just stay in reality.

I am going to lean more to reality.

I mean you could take a lot of PP points away from players. So what? The power play is part of the game of hockey.

 

[notbias]

I am going to lean more to reality.

I mean you could take a lot of PP points away from players. So what? The power play is part of the game of hockey.

Or just stay in reality.

Okay, we can stick with stats and not bring context into things.

Robertson: 1.34 G/60, 2.36 P/60
Caufield: 0.80 G/60, 1.90 P/60

Those are the stats from each player last year at 5v5.

Robertson produces at a much higher rate than Caufield and a much better offensive weapon at 5v5.

Do stats without context still look good to you?

 

[ULF_55]

So much written for so little.

If it is just about playing time and opportunity let him rot.

If it is because he is unhappy in Toronto, and his mental health is suffering he doesn't have to sign anything and can go live where he's happy and get a job.

If it is about anywhere but Toronto, he can go overseas.

Whatever makes him healthy, that he has control over, is up to him.

Part of being a professional athlete and making million$ comes with a cost and all the players know that. People sacrifice all the time, Oil Patch workers make good money, but live in less than ideal conditions not seeing their family for weeks. They accept the trade-off. Rail workers are on-call 24 hours a day and have 2 hours to report any time of the week, miss their children's life events and know it is part of the job, and get paid quite well for the inconvenience.

Robertson is the one making it difficult for himself.

 

[notbias]

So much written for so little.

If it is just about playing time and opportunity let him rot.

If it is because he is unhappy in Toronto, and his mental health is suffering he doesn't have to sign anything and can go live where he's happy and get a job.

If it is about anywhere but Toronto, he can go overseas.

Whatever makes him healthy, that he has control over, is up to him.

Part of being a professional athlete and making million$ comes with a cost and all the players know that. People sacrifice all the time, Oil Patch workers make good money, but live in less than ideal conditions not seeing their family for weeks. They accept the trade-off. Rail workers are on-call 24 hours a day and have 2 hours to report any time of the week, miss their children's life events and know it is part of the job, and get paid quite well for the inconvenience.

Robertson is the one making it difficult for himself.

Based on multiple responses like this, I am beginning to think no one has had any sort of leadership role in their life if this is how you deal with people who are unhappy about their working situation.

Also, a terrible analogy, all those people can go apply to work for a different company with more opportunities or better hours or whatever benefits they are seeking if they want to, no one is holding their career hostage like you are suggesting.

It amazes me how terrible some takes are on this situation.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Okay, we can stick with stats and not bring context into things.

Robertson: 1.34 G/60, 2.36 P/60
Caufield: 0.80 G/60, 1.90 P/60

Those are the stats from each player last year at 5v5.

Robertson produces at a much higher rate than Caufield and a much better offensive weapon at 5v5.

Do stats without context still look good to you?

So the context is you narrowing the statistical category so that Robertson looks better than Caufield? Good for you. You could be his agent. If you tried to pitch this to Treliving, he might show you the door due to your insulting nature.

 

[ULF_55]

Based on multiple responses like this, I am beginning to think no one has had any sort of leadership role in their life if this is how you deal with people who are unhappy about their working situation.

Also, a terrible analogy, all those people can go apply to work for a different company with more opportunities or better hours or whatever benefits they are seeking if they want to, no one is holding their career hostage like you are suggesting.

It amazes me how terrible some takes are on this situation.

What part of "I'm not signing." don't you understand?

 

[ACC1224]

Based on multiple responses like this, I am beginning to think no one has had any sort of leadership role in their life if this is how you deal with people who are unhappy about their working situation.

Also, a terrible analogy, all those people can go apply to work for a different company with more opportunities or better hours or whatever benefits they are seeking if they want to, no one is holding their career hostage like you are suggesting.

It amazes me how terrible some takes are on this situation.

I'm sure everyone agrees that it's just yours.

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Two straight camps he earned a gig, wasn't given it. Scored at a great goal pace, played 9 minutes and no PP time. Every mistake he was benched. Keefe mismanaged this guy, can't blame him for wanting to go elsewhere. That said, he has a great opportunity this year, hope he reconsiders. You'll never recoup his value in a trade under these circumstances. I thought he matured last year, wasn't going a thousand miles an hour and looked way more defensively responsible.

But keefe isn’t around anymore, so I don’t understand what’s going on with him and berube/management

We are shallow at LW, so he could easily slot in 3LW and probably even 2LW if he shows some promise. He just has to dig in, take a 1 yr deal and show he’s worth us or another team investing in him.

Completely guessing, but maybe something was said to him by treliving or berube that rubbed him the wrong way? Otherwise why would he be complaining about being here when the biggest obstacle from an outsiders perspective (keefe) is not here anymore

 

[notbias]

So the context is you narrowing the statistical category so that Robertson looks better than Caufield? Good for you. You could be his agent. If you tried to pitch this to Treliving, he might show you the door due to your insulting nature.

You don't care about context, so why start now?

What part of "I'm not signing." don't you understand?

What was the conversation?

Can you give me the full talk they had?

Have you ever had to work through a problem before? This reads like someone who has never talked to another person.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

You don't care about context, so why start now?



What was the conversation?

Can you give me the full talk they had?

Have you ever had to work through a problem before? This reads like someone who has never talked to another person.

I like to hear about the circumstances. What makes you think I don't?

 

[ULF_55]

What was the conversation?

Can you give me the full talk they had?

Have you ever had to work through a problem before? This reads like someone who has never talked to another person.

So everyone gets a ribbon?

He has an offer he can sign.

NHL has a CBA that applies to all the players.

If he doesn't agree with the CBA he can ply his trade in a non-NHL organization. Overseas, other hockey leagues in North America.

His decision is putting him in this situation.

Again, he can do whatever he wants.
What he can't do is have his own NHL CBA.


Your words:
Also, a terrible analogy, all those people can go apply to work for a different company with more opportunities or better hours or whatever benefits they are seeking if they want to, no one is holding their career hostage like you are suggesting.

So using your words, he can go play for a different league that is not governed by the NHL CBA.

You have to agree with your own words right?

 

[notbias]

Once again, I am asking about what the conversations between the two were.

You said that his comment was "I am not signing" which means absolutely nothing without the full conversation... I just want to see who is unreasonable, you seem to know.

So everyone gets a ribbon?

He has an offer he can sign.

NHL has a CBA that applies to all the players.

If he doesn't agree with the CBA he can ply his trade in a non-NHL organization. Overseas, other hockey leagues in North America.

His decision is putting him in this situation.

Again, he can do whatever he wants.
What he can't do is have his own NHL CBA.

What ribbon are you talking about? Makes no sense.

I agree, if he wants out of his contract that bad he can go play overseas and hurt the organization and himself.

I am saying there are better solutions and they should be explored, he is also better than current roster players so I understand why he is upset.

Your words:
Also, a terrible analogy, all those people can go apply to work for a different company with more opportunities or better hours or whatever benefits they are seeking if they want to, no one is holding their career hostage like you are suggesting.

So using your words, he can go play for a different league that is not governed by the NHL CBA.

You have to agree with your own words right?

Yes, he has that choice as well, he is basically ruining his career by doing so, not exactly a good comparison, but sure, we can say it is.

Great sales tactic for future employees too "hey, do exactly what we want, or we will try to ruin your career".

It is the rules though, you are right, it is why no one should be upset with any NMCs we have and no one should offer discounts, because if our GM or fanbase doesn't care about the players, why should they give up anything for them?

I don't even think Treliving wants to screw over Robertson, I bet he is trying to work on a resolution and will move him if he can't, this is the logical thing that is happening, everything else being suggested is idiotic.

 

[Dayjobdave]

My understanding is Nick doesn’t want to be a Leaf anymore. The issue isn’t money, it’s how he was handled by the previous coach. Maybe he doesn’t like his teammates, i don’t know.

But if he doesn’t want to sign, that’s where we are.

 

[Maple Leaf]

My understanding is Nick doesn’t want to be a Leaf anymore. The issue isn’t money, it’s how he was handled by the previous coach. Maybe he doesn’t like his teammates, i don’t know.

But if he doesn’t want to sign, that’s where we are.

He doesnt like the previous coach so must leave now with a new coach