Nick Ritchie in Toronto

[hullsy47]

He's definitely in that category of "we paid him so he's playing". He hasn't earned his minutes, not by a long stretch. And he sure doesn't deserve to be given minutes playing shotgun to the reigning Richard trophy winner. He'd be in the minors if he was one of the guys making near the minimum.

Waive him

 

[seanlinden]

Nick Ritchie (@ $2.5 mil) was brought in to replace Zach Hyman (@ $2.25 mil) out at his old price point, and play in the top likely beside Matthews were he started the year.

However all 4 of those new additions at forward above (including Ritchie) for $6.2 mil Cap produce at the same rate as 1 X Zach Hyman .. 11 games 7 goals 3 assists 10 points for (@ $5.5 mil) new price point, at this point in time.

Leafs GM essentially believed in quantity of new additions to replace quality to address Leafs supporting cast and provide better secondary scoring around the core 4, however they're struggling just to replace Hyman. He could just re-signed Hyman and added Bunting @$ 950k for about the same cap as the new 4 combined and left unqualified RFAs Ritchie, Kampf and Kase for someone else .

Dubas was likely betting on Ritchie to meet and exceed his last year #'s of 56 games 15 goals 11 assists 26 points [= 82 games 22 goals 16 assists 38 points] when playing on a line with 2 of his core 4 forwards at any time to prop up his stats. Now he is already a 4th line hoping Spezza and Simmonds elevate him statistically.

You can't really compare 3 players to 1.

It's not Hyman ($5.5) vs Ritchie ($2.25) + Kase ($1.25) + Kampf ($1.5), totaling $5m, meaning you still have to find $500k. It's Hyman ($5.5m) + Brooks ($725k) + Ho Sang? ($750k) totaling $7m, meaning you still need to find another $2m.

The math also was not as simple as "we need to replace Zach Hyman" -- it was "we need to replace Zach Hyman, but we also have other needs on this team to address.

Notably, amongst their forward groups, they wanted / needed the following:
- "Replacements" for Zach Hyman, Nick Foligno, Alex Galchenyuk and Joe Thornton, with the latter being a fairly easy replacement.
- More toughness / size / ability to score in the dirty areas of the ice.
- The ability to create a pure shutdown line that does a ton of defensive zone heavy lifting.

The simplest way to look at it is probably that Hyman becomes Bunting, Foligno becomes Ritchie, Galchenyuk becomes Kase, and Thornton becomes Kerfoot, while Kerfoot becomes Kampf.

It wasn't so much a "replace quality with quantity" as it was, we've got 4 spots in our forward group to fill, 3 of which were pretty important players, and an area of need (a shutdown 3rd line C). He went with the approach of trying to address all 4 needs (knowing he doesn't have much deadline ammunition), rather than filling 1 need really well, but knowingly leaving gaps on the roster.

Maybe you can argue that "Joe" shouldn't have been replaced, and instead just rely on improvement from Mikheyev & Engvall, but then you don't sign Kampf, and you're stuck with Kerfoot in the #3C role.

Sure, maybe a bit of moneyball, trying to find diamonds in the rough, but it's not like the Leafs could go out and spend $3.5m to get a guaranteed perfect player. Boston signed Foligno for $3.8m. He's played 7 games and has 1 assist.

TLDR? If he signed Hyman, it's not at the cost of Ritchie, Kase, Kampf and maybe Mikheyev. It's at the cost of Kerfoot, Ritchie, and and probably Mikheyev, being replaced by Brooks and another guy making close to league min. That doesn't put the Leafs in a good situation, especially if Matthews or Tavares get hurt for any length of time.

 

[zeke]

The simplest way to look at it is probably that Hyman becomes Bunting, Foligno becomes Ritchie, Galchenyuk becomes Kase, and Thornton becomes Kerfoot, while Kerfoot becomes Kampf.

I'd even hesitate to include Foligno in there given he only played 11gms so wasn't actually a "loss" from last year's performance.

But I like your basic idea here. I make it clearer to myself by lining up the roster vs last year and we're left with these changes:

Hyman ----------> Bunting
Thornton -------> Ritchie
Vesey/Galy -----> Kase
Boyd/Brooks --> Kampf

Bogosian -------> Liljegren
Andersen ------> Mrazek

And while Kampf is essentially replacing the Boyd/Brooks combo from last year, in reality when we're healthy it's Kampf likely pushing Engvall out of the lineup and Engvall being the replacement for Boyd/Brooks as the extra C. Or maybe we can say Kampf is the upgrade over Engvall that we wanted Foligno to be if he was healthy.

And while the Leafs probably lost some offensive skill in that forward changeover they also seem to have clearly improved the forwards defensively and arguably in the grit/physical department as well.

And tbh I'm not conceding yet that the new group is actually worse offensively yet than the old group was as I think the team has been pretty snakebit offensively so far.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Waive him

Man can't believe some fans who never played .. he changed game against Isles by intimidating Isles D and then they got scared and started giving him free pucks on forecheck which he utilized to create da 2nd goal which was da back breaker .. no skilled guy scores that goal without Ritchie work .. skilled guys need da horse to get to water

 

[mydnyte]

Ritchie is a better passer than I expected, but, I think he's trying too hard to be a team player rather than just to stand in front of the net and cause havoc in front.
He should be netfront on PP2 at last, and take Engvall's spot and Let Simmonds work the low boards, as he loves to skate the puck from the back to the net anyways

 

[Fogelhund]

Man can't believe some fans who never played .. he changed game against Isles by intimidating Isles D and then they got scared and started giving him free pucks on forecheck which he utilized to create da 2nd goal which was da back breaker .. no skilled guy scores that goal without Ritchie work .. skilled guys need da horse to get to water

Good to see someone else notice that too. Ritchie needs to play like this, game in, and game out... He hasn't very much so far, but he did last game. Like I've said elsewhere, the staff need to sit him down, with videos of what he did right last game, and the result... and just say.. play this way ALL the time. We need his type of play on the team.

 

[Stephen]

Man can't believe some fans who never played .. he changed game against Isles by intimidating Isles D and then they got scared and started giving him free pucks on forecheck which he utilized to create da 2nd goal which was da back breaker .. no skilled guy scores that goal without Ritchie work .. skilled guys need da horse to get to water

Ritchie seems more of a better intuitive fit on a checking/shutdown/shock troop line.

One thing you want a guy like that to do is if we’re in a playoff series you send this guy out to just play the opposition D hard. Run them into the end boards on every puck retrieval so their legs are wobbly by Game 7. Just look at the damage Boston put on Jake Gardiner or Toronto put on Wade Redden in repeat series. One of the Leafs reasons for not coming out on top vs Boston is Krug was always so fresh cause we didn’t play the attrition game with him.

 

[Twine Tickler]

Ritchie has played a lot better as of late, the points have not been there, but he has been very effective IMO. I still don't think he is fit for our top 6, he just doesn't have the motor to consistently play against top lines all the time. I much prefer him in a complimentary role. I liked him with Kampf and Kase, but I also thought he looked really good on that 4th line with Spezza and Simmonds. When Michy comes back i'd run:

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Kerfoot - Tavares - Nylander
Micheyev - Kampf - Kase
Ritchie - Spezza - Simmonds

to me, that is the right formula when we have a full compliment of players. I think every line would have great chemistry IMO. Not to mention a Micheyev - Kampf -Kase line could be one of the hardest 3rd lines to play against in the NHL

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Good to see someone else notice that too. Ritchie needs to play like this, game in, and game out... He hasn't very much so far, but he did last game. Like I've said elsewhere, the staff need to sit him down, with videos of what he did right last game, and the result... and just say.. play this way ALL the time. We need his type of play on the team.

Agreed Ritchie needs to play like a bull in a china shop every single night .. but he can't do it by ramming someone's head from behind into glass and killing someone either .. there is a fine line with him and he can easily go over da edge .. but having strongest man in NHL on team always helps

 

[Fogelhund]

Agreed Ritchie needs to play like a bull in a china shop every single night .. but he can't do it by ramming someone's head from behind into glass and killing someone either .. there is a fine line with him and he can easily go over da edge .. but having strongest man in NHL on team always helps

Have you watched Curtis Douglas play yet? That is a kid that would be dynamite for us, if he could make it.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Eh.... He doesn't fit on the top line...more like 3rd, more like.. wtf was Dubas thinking...

It’s obvious what he was thinking. ThiccNick had 15 goals last year. He figured at 2.5 short term if nick figures it all out it’s a steal and if not it’s a short commitment.

 

[Leafsfan74]

Good to see someone else notice that too. Ritchie needs to play like this, game in, and game out... He hasn't very much so far, but he did last game. Like I've said elsewhere, the staff need to sit him down, with videos of what he did right last game, and the result... and just say.. play this way ALL the time. We need his type of play on the team.

I am one who believed that Ritchie was a good fit for what the Leafs needed. I always hold out hope that a guy can rise to his potential, let's not forget that he is a top 10 First Round pick in the NHL. Most importantly for me, Leafs need a stronger, more balanced identity in the playoffs.

We've seen what Ritchie can do: outmuscle opponents, throw message sending checks, even drop the gloves, take it easy and still control the fight. I will take this all day, especially post-season.

Confidence is a big deal and not scoring has to wear on a guy. He's not a $10M player who has failed in the playoffs for years here. He has a fresh slate from my perspective to figure out his game. I thought the third line was impressive against the Isles and Ritchie was in a place this team will need him to be if they want to raise a Cup.

Score or not, be engaged. If Leafs roll four engaged lines no team is going to have an easy night.

He is a big man, but sometimes it's as if he doesn't know it. Defenders have an impossible task stopping him if he decides he wants the front of the net for himself. Players will have a tough time outmuscling him for the puck in the corners and along the boards, we saw this last game with the recovery, tic-tac-toe goal.

 

[Stephen]

I am one who believed that Ritchie was a good fit for what the Leafs needed. I always hold out hope that a guy can rise to his potential, let's not forget that he is a top 10 First Round pick in the NHL. Most importantly for me, Leafs need a stronger, more balanced identity in the playoffs.

We've seen what Ritchie can do: outmuscle opponents, throw message sending checks, even drop the gloves, take it easy and still control the fight. I will take this all day, especially post-season.

Confidence is a big deal and not scoring has to wear on a guy. He's not a $10M player who has failed in the playoffs for years here. He has a fresh slate from my perspective to figure out his game. I thought the third line was impressive against the Isles and Ritchie was in a place this team will need him to be if they want to raise a Cup.

Score or not, be engaged. If Leafs roll four engaged lines no team is going to have an easy night.

He is a big man, but sometimes it's as if he doesn't know it. Defenders have an impossible task stopping him if he decides he wants the front of the net for himself. Players will have a tough time outmuscling him for the puck in the corners and along the boards, we saw this last game with the recovery, tic-tac-toe goal.

The type of player we need is also the type of player Nick Ritchie has struggled to be over the years on a consistent basis. I wouldn’t sign off on him being a perfect fit for us, since his issue has always been putting it together, but we did see a nice scoring touch and lately he has brought more in a checking role.

 

[Leafsfan74]

The type of player we need is also the type of player Nick Ritchie has struggled to be over the years on a consistent basis. I wouldn’t sign off on him being a perfect fit for us, since his issue has always been putting it together, but we did see a nice scoring touch and lately he has brought more in a checking role.

So I've read. We could say the same of some of our top players when the playoffs begin.

Hopefully the whole team focuses on consistency and commitment, especially when it matters most.

 

[Stephen]

So I've read. We could say the same of some of our top players when the playoffs begin.

Hopefully the whole team focuses on consistency and commitment, especially when it matters most.

Yeah, let’s hope we get the results come playoff time. That’s about the long and short of it.

 

[justashadowof]

Ritchie seems more of a better intuitive fit on a checking/shutdown/shock troop line.

One thing you want a guy like that to do is if we’re in a playoff series you send this guy out to just play the opposition D hard. Run them into the end boards on every puck retrieval so their legs are wobbly by Game 7. Just look at the damage Boston put on Jake Gardiner or Toronto put on Wade Redden in repeat series. One of the Leafs reasons for not coming out on top vs Boston is Krug was always so fresh cause we didn’t play the attrition game with him.

We literally wasted 3 years of Tavares/Matthews/Marner/Nylander in order to have our GM reluctantly come to this obvious conclusion.

 

[Menzinger]

Has been doing the little things well lately even if not scoring

 

[Stonehands1990]

Has been doing the little things well lately even if not scoring

He winger assisted winning the draw on the Spezza goal also

 

[ToDavid]

Penalty at the end of the game aside, he had a damn good game tonight.

 

[Confucius]

Penalty at the end of the game aside, he had a damn good game tonight.

He'll never score again but other than that not bad, really.

 

[justloveleafs]

Those two open ice body checks have me rooting for Ritchie... I don't see the Scarborough man throwing that kind of stuff up front. On the back end we have Muzzin who can loosen teeth...

Ritchie is valuable if he can do that And not hurt the team otherwise..

Wa have two guys now, that can change a guys life and career.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Ritchie looks like he's playing in the Mighty Ducks movie during that period of time when the other bash brother wasn't allowed to play.

Looks so out of place in this lineup.

 

[horner]

Man can't believe some fans who never played .. he changed game against Isles by intimidating Isles D and then they got scared and started giving him free pucks on forecheck which he utilized to create da 2nd goal which was da back breaker .. no skilled guy scores that goal without Ritchie work .. skilled guys need da horse to get to water

Engvall doesn't touch a flea .
We need players like Simmons Ritchie and Clifford to rattle some bones , it gets players of there game . They don't go after the puck first and give it up quicker.
If Engvall would do the same thing , I would like him as a player.

 

[ITM]

Ritchie has played a lot better as of late, the points have not been there, but he has been very effective IMO. I still don't think he is fit for our top 6, he just doesn't have the motor to consistently play against top lines all the time. I much prefer him in a complimentary role. I liked him with Kampf and Kase, but I also thought he looked really good on that 4th line with Spezza and Simmonds. When Michy comes back i'd run:

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Kerfoot - Tavares - Nylander
Micheyev - Kampf - Kase
Ritchie - Spezza - Simmonds

to me, that is the right formula when we have a full compliment of players. I think every line would have great chemistry IMO. Not to mention a Micheyev - Kampf -Kase line could be one of the hardest 3rd lines to play against in the NHL

With an eye of interchanging Marner/Nylander when needed, I don't mind that lineup at all.

I think organizationally we've got an opportunity to address three question marks. I think Ho-Sang is trending up and should get a look soon. Ritchie's improved play is encouraging but...there are issues obviously. I wonder if building upon Ritchie's play would be best served by expanding his role in the AHL, and similarly, giving Ho-Sang an opportunity on the third line while giving Micheyev fourth line minutes to begin with.

Ritchie returns after a stint, to the fourth line as noted, and either Micheyev or Ho-Sang continue on the third line or return to the AHL or the press box, or moved in trade.

 

[Fogelhund]

People want to put Ritchie on waivers? Send him to the AHL? If he gets claimed off of waivers, then what are the plans to replace his physicality?

Ho Sang doesn't really warrant much of a look at this point. 12 points in 13 games in "nice", but this is a 25 year old, playing well in a minor league. This isn't a dominant performance, where he's begging to be moved to the big club. It's just ok. He's not even on the first page of scorers in the AHL, or PPG...