League News: NHL Talk - (News n' Scores n' Stuff) | 2023-24 Regular Season Edition

[PlushMinus]

On the other hand I don't think any team is going to bail them out of John Klingberg's contract. 4.15 million United States Dollars and a modified no-trade clause! Why???

Klingberg is a great example of why a reclamation project is a real coin flip and very risky.

If you look at his career:

First 5 seasons with Dallas - very good but notice that 5th season, 20 of 45 points are from PP
Next 3 seasons with Dallas - almost half his points are on the PP and look at his plus/minus turn to crap

Anaheim take a chance on him - and why not? They already expected to be a bottom feeder

Klingberg is a PP specialist who from what I have heard / seen doesn't have much of a defensive game. He probably got away with that in Dallas because he had very good d-men around him.

I'd also say his best years are well behind him.

Toronto could have kept Gustafsson - same age except he's getting 825K on the Rangers and is now in the PP1 spot with Fox out injured.

You could even perhaps argue that WE should have kept Gustafsson and not traded for Sandin. Lord knows we could do with somebody who can create offence.

 

[Marshall]

Thank you, Sharks.

 

[Langway]

Heads will roll, surely?

 

[marcel snapshot]

Like an exclamation point on the panic button. Seems like the kind of game that gets someone fired

 

[twabby]

I don't know if Woodcroft should get fired, but he probably will.

Holland is the guy who should get canned.

Also Brad Treliving has been on the job for like 4 months and he should be fired in Toronto. All of his offseason moves look unsurprisingly horrible.

 

[StrikingDistance]

Thank you, Sharks.

Stayed up and watched the game. It definitely felt like a Cup final in the 3rd. Blackwood stood on his head to the dismay of the Oilers broadcast. When RNH made it 3-2 with ~2mins left, they were like: 'So this might be the turning point we need!'. LOL Then their spirits were crushed. So good.

 

[trick9]

Watching this tirefire kind of makes you realise how hard it is to win the Cup these days. Even if you have McDavid and Draisatl all it takes is one wrong GM hire and your chances to win the Cup go down the drain for... how many years?

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Just like everyone predicted in the preseason, the Winnipeg Jets and Montreal Canadiens are the two Canadian teams with the least amount of drama thus far (sarcasm intended).

Edmonton fans must be apocalyptic. Worst case scenario. Draisatl is pissy as hell and a UFA after next season. McDavid is a UFA in two years and said any talks of an extension are dependent on the Oilers being a Stanley Cup contender. Holland has saddled that team with multiple albatross contracts and they have no goaltending. I don't think they are anywhere near as bad as their record indicates and I think they'll turn it around but they are digging themselves a big hole.

 

[IafrateOvie34]

Just like everyone predicted in the preseason, the Winnipeg Jets and Montreal Canadiens are the two Canadian teams with the least amount of drama thus far (sarcasm intended).

Edmonton fans must be apocalyptic. Worst case scenario. Draisatl is pissy as hell and a UFA after next season. McDavid is a UFA in two years and said any talks of an extension are dependent on the Oilers being a Stanley Cup contender. Holland has saddled that team with multiple albatross contracts and they have no goaltending. I don't think they are anywhere near as bad as their record indicates and I think they'll turn it around but they are digging themselves a big hole.

As a fan of Edmonton, it’s all on the management and living in the 80s. I think it was trick that said in a previous post how hard it is to wa cup in the modern NHL. He’s correct because teams don’t don’t seem to adapt or have patience especially Canadian based teams. I also blame a lot of league GMs handing out huge contracts to fringe players. It requires a lot of patience now.

 

[HTFN]

Watching this tirefire kind of makes you realise how hard it is to win the Cup these days. Even if you have McDavid and Draisatl all it takes is one wrong GM hire and your chances to win the Cup go down the drain for... how many years?

This is why I’m a pretty vocal GMBM supporter, big swings seem awesome in the moment but I like someone where I can identify the process even when it doesn’t work. Some other GMs have these very obvious “what are you thinking” moments that just don’t make sense from day one, but I feel like you can at least angle towards understanding the bad moves of good GMs

 

[traparatus]

This is why I’m a pretty vocal GMBM supporter, big swings seem awesome in the moment but I like someone where I can identify the process even when it doesn’t work. Some other GMs have these very obvious “what are you thinking” moments that just don’t make sense from day one, but I feel like you can at least angle towards understanding the bad moves of good GMs

I'm with you as far as Treliving goes. His actions really make me consider throwing my resume into the pile. Three years of Ryan f*********g Reaves... It's hard to comprehend.

Holland and BMac are pretty similar GMs. Oilers roster looks pretty much exactly like what I think BMac would build, given all the constraints. Campbell's contract is bad but they needed a goalie so the GM signed one. Turns out to be not a very good one. That's goalies for you. The rest of it? BMac would have signed Nurse to that same exact contract. Ditto for the likes of Hyman, Kane, RNH, Bouchard.

 

[um]

I'm with you as far as Treliving goes. His actions really make me consider throwing my resume into the pile. Three years of Ryan f*********g Reaves... It's hard to comprehend.

Holland and BMac are pretty similar GMs. Oilers roster looks pretty much exactly like what I think BMac would build, given all the constraints. Campbell's contract is bad but they needed a goalie so the GM signed one. Turns out to be not a very good one. That's goalies for you. The rest of it? BMac would have signed Nurse to that same exact contract. Ditto for the likes of Hyman, Kane, RNH, Bouchard.

That’s BS. GMBM is ridiculously better than Holland.

 

[traparatus]

That’s BS. GMBM is ridiculously better than Holland.

Rock solid argument. Care to elaborate?

 

[HTFN]

I'm with you as far as Treliving goes. His actions really make me consider throwing my resume into the pile. Three years of Ryan f*********g Reaves... It's hard to comprehend.

Holland and BMac are pretty similar GMs. Oilers roster looks pretty much exactly like what I think BMac would build, given all the constraints. Campbell's contract is bad but they needed a goalie so the GM signed one. Turns out to be not a very good one. That's goalies for you. The rest of it? BMac would have signed Nurse to that same exact contract. Ditto for the likes of Hyman, Kane, RNH, Bouchard.

Strong disagree there, I’m not seeing how GMBM has done comparable things to some of those guys listed. I mean, wouldn’t he have just signed Kane himself like was rumored?

 

[um]

Rock solid argument. Care to elaborate?

Not really, it's not a statement made by a serious person.

 

[IafrateOvie34]

Ovy had like a 120 mph shot on that.

 

[traparatus]

Strong disagree there, I’m not seeing how GMBM has done comparable things to some of those guys listed. I mean, wouldn’t he have just signed Kane himself like was rumored?

I could absolutely see BMac signing Evander Kane for $5.25m until age 35. It's not any kind of controversial statement because it's not a controversial contract. It's fine, just like most contracts on their books. Campbell's situation is hurting them but you clearly see the reasoning behind that signing. They were desperate for a goalie and got one that was available. It didn't work out.

Do you think BMac would have traded his top pairing, 27 year old defenseman instead of signing him to a $9.25m per year deal? I think he would have done the same thing as Holland.

As I see it, the main problem for Oilers is the same as it has been for the Caps. Their farm system doesn't contribute cheap, high quality talent to their lineup. Drafting and development is poor. That's how you end up with majority of your roster filled with imported vets that need to be paid more than in-house talent and don't provide much upside. If this situation sounds familiar, it's because that is precisely what has happened under BMac's watch.

Holland and MacLellan manage in a very similar manner, with very similar results. By the way, BMac winning percentage with the Caps is 0.634, Holland's with Edmonton is 0.615. Both franchises have participated in an average of 1.5 playoff series per season during their era.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Objection: speculation

 

[IafrateOvie34]

Best game of the year by the Caps for me.

Edit: Wrong thread.

 

[trick9]

Yeah... i don't agree that GMBM would have given Nurse that contract. It was a pretty no-brainer to go for a bridge deal there especially given the Oilers window opening right around there but the Oilers made a call that has backfired badly.

 

[YippieKaey]

Wouldn't mind putting a claim in for Fagemo. He has a goalscorers mentality and might look good on our third line.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Wouldn't mind putting a claim in for Fagemo. He has a goalscorers mentality and might look good on our third line.

How’s that pronounced lol?

 

[Brian23]

Yeah... i don't agree that GMBM would have given Nurse that contract. It was a pretty no-brainer to go for a bridge deal there especially given the Oilers window opening right around there but the Oilers made a call that has backfired badly.

Yeah, he's locked guys up to term but it's always brought the overall number down. Unless you think Nurse was getting like 11 million a year on a 3 or 4 year deal, it was an overpayment and not something I'd see GMBM doing.

I also don't see how their Free Agency is comparable. I think, overall, all of GMBM's big swings at free agents have performed much better then Hollands did in Edmonton, which is the issue. If he'd gotten an Oshie, Niskanen, and Orpik to pair with McDavid and Drai, they've probably got a cup or two by now.

 

[Calicaps]

The other part of the GMBM-Holland comparison that doesn't hold up for me is the drafting critique. Sure both teams' cupboards were kinda bare (before last draft for us anyway) but the situations are totally different.

Caps prospects are/were what they are/were because the team was a perennial playoff contender and drafting in the 20s and 30s. And still they scored some nice late-first-round talent.

By contrast, the Oil sucked for most of Holland's tenure and before, so they've been drafting early and missing on picks or trading away prospects trying to fill holes.

 

[traparatus]

The other part of the GMBM-Holland comparison that doesn't hold up for me is the drafting critique. Sure both teams' cupboards were kinda bare (before last draft for us anyway) but the situations are totally different.

Caps prospects are/were what they are/were because the team was a perennial playoff contender and drafting in the 20s and 30s. And still they scored some nice late-first-round talent.

By contrast, the Oil sucked for most of Holland's tenure and before, so they've been drafting early and missing on picks or trading away prospects trying to fill holes.

Right... Their regular season and playoff records are close to identical. Also, Oilers have drafted 8th, 14th, 22nd and 32nd in the 1st round during Holland's time. Washington has drafted 13th, 22nd, 28th, 31st, 25th, 22nd, 20th and 8th.

Don't let facts get in the way of a good narative, though.