League News: NHL Talk - (News n' Scores n' Stuff) - 2022-23 season, Vol. 4, Off-season Edition

[AlexModvechkin8]

If the Leafs get first rounded in the playoffs again maybe they'd be open to moving Marner. Marner+Ovi for the next 2 years would be great to behold. 895 next year at the rate the league is going. Wilson would be the main piece going the other way most likely but imo its worth it for that level of player

No chance they’d move Marner and if they did, Wilson wouldn’t come close to getting it done. I could see them maybe moving Nylander if they wanted to change the makeup of their top six but you don’t trade a 25 year old who has scored or paced to score 90+ points in five straight seasons for a power forward on an expiring contract who is four years older. Wilson holds a lot of value but not that kind of value.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Pettersson is the guy I dream about that is maybe, possibly available.

There were rumblings from Michael Russo of The Athletic that Pettersson would want to move on. Russo would be a weird person to start an unfounded rumor about a Canuck player given that Russo is the Wild's beat writer, so I tend to think there is some truth to it. Vancouver also played hardball with Pettersson during his last contract and forced him to take a bridge so I could see that making him sour a bit on Vancouver. On top of, you know, Vancouver being a directionless franchise.

That being said I don't think Kuzy + #8 overall does anything to even begin a conversation. Washington would need to add a lot more futures, or get another team involved in a 3-way deal with a guy like Wilson going in the direction of that third team to even begin discussions. It's certainly something Washington should pursue, but it'd be complicated and cost a lot.

They traded their captain for a pick in the 20s, a B prospect, and a struggling roster player who needed a change of scenery. Kuznetsov + 8OA doesn’t get it done but if there’s really a rift there maybe they bite at a package of Kuznetsov, 8OA, McMike/Lapierre, and Iorio/Chesley.

 

[max21]

Disagree. They dominated the league collectively for a good 15 years. Both top five in wins. Pittsburgh won three Cups and Washington won one. Winner of their playoff series went on to win the Cup four times. Multiple Presidents Trophies. Multiple first ballot HOFers. Two biggest superstars in the sport crediting with leading the league out of the Dark Ages after the last lockout.

They may not have had playoff success recently but the Caps and Pens have been almost unprecedented in terms of success and longevity in the salary cap era. Dominant is the right word.

Don’t cry because it’s over, smile because it happened friends

 

[shtorm2005]

Disagree.

With what? I said their dominance days are far behind. Soon, it's 5 years they didn't make out of the 1st round and are likely to miss playoffs this year.

 

[Ovi895]

No chance they’d move Marner and if they did, Wilson wouldn’t come close to getting it done. I could see them maybe moving Nylander if they wanted to change the makeup of their top six but you don’t trade a 25 year old who has scored or paced to score 90+ points in five straight seasons for a power forward on an expiring contract who is four years older. Wilson holds a lot of value but not that kind of value.

I really wanted them to make a move for Marner last offseason. He was the biggest punching bag for Toronto's first round loss and we had an array of players of the type they would covet. Something around Wilson, Hathway, Eller, Samsonov would have been seriously appealing for them. we pretty much lost 2 of those players for marginal deadline rental return (and in Samsonov's case nothing).

It would probably be Wilson+ our first (I'd do it if its 5 or lower) + whatever else they reasonably want. Murray for Lindgren swap would probably be appealing to them since they'd want every dollar they can to get depth. We don't have an impact defensive piece they'd likely want but if they get enough value and cap space from us to use for a separate acquisition that would be appealing

They traded their captain for a pick in the 20s, a B prospect, and a struggling roster player who needed a change of scenery. Kuznetsov + 8OA doesn’t get it done but if there’s really a rift there maybe they bite at a package of Kuznetsov, 8OA, McMike/Lapierre, and Iorio/Chesley.

They traded a player they weren't gonna resign for a very good rental return who subsequently got signed for a monster overpayment. There's really no comparison between him and Pettersson. Everything they're doing right now down to punting on Bedard is to keep Pettersson (and to a lesser extent Hughes) around

 

[marcel snapshot]

Calgary Winnipeg looking a bit old school here

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

This rangers Tampa game is pretty fun. I wouldn’t mind seeing a playoff series probably the two best goalies in the league.

Who had seven goals going into the third. Also, Corey Perry is a bitch. I’m glad he hurt his hand fighting a rookie.

 

[Marshall]

The efforts put forth in the CAL/WPG game do not seem to match the importance of said game.

Disregard - I missed trash-talking the goalie. That's not bad.

 

[shtorm2005]

McDavid is probably to break Ovy's record tonight. Oilers averaged 5 goals/game against Ducks this season.

Also there are 2 games against Sharks, Oilers averaged 6 goals/game against them.

 

[McVechkin]

McDavid is probably to break Ovy's record tonight. Oilers averaged 5 goals/game against Ducks this season.

Also there are 2 games against Sharks, Oilers averaged 6 goals/game against them.

You calling a 4 goal game tonight??

That’s a cake walk or a schedule. How’s it compare to those ol SE matchups ovie was able to feast on ?

 

[shtorm2005]

You calling a 4 goal game tonight??

That’s a cake walk or a schedule. How’s it compare to those ol SE matchups ovie was able to feast on ?

Ducks are dead last in the league, they won't fight back probably.

About SE division, it takes a deeper analysis, but league-wide scoring was lower I think.

Damn, NHL removed player vs division stats. Would be nice to compare them

 

[usiel]

5% is perfect. It is basically rolling a natural 20 on a d20 die. Can't tell you how many times I've started a p&p rpg session with the first role of the day being a nat 20.

 

[shtorm2005]

Ok found it

Ovechkin 2007-08

McDavid 2022-23

 

[shtorm2005]

Wait, Caps where in SouthEast division

His stats there

Much less than McDavid's

Ovy feasted on NE division, but that division wasn't easy. 3/5 made playoffs, while SE only Caps made it.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

You calling a 4 goal game tonight??

That’s a cake walk or a schedule. How’s it compare to those ol SE matchups ovie was able to feast on ?

Cake Walk? Didnt Tampa and the Canes win a cup. Tell me what Canada has done

 

[Ovi895]

The year AO got 65 goals he pivoted more towards scoring. It was his biggest goals to assist discrepancy until the second half of his career where he started morphing more and more into a pure goal scorer vs an everything highlight reel. Crosby was even more extreme when he got the rocket, there was a major shift in his offensive playstyle

McDavid is looking like he'll score 65+ while leading the league in assists. If he hadn't scored a single goal this year he'd still be top 20 in the league in points, right behind Crosby and Zibanejad. He's putting up this scoring season while not even pivoting the way he plays and just going super saiyan yet again on his entire game

 

[twabby]

They traded their captain for a pick in the 20s, a B prospect, and a struggling roster player who needed a change of scenery. Kuznetsov + 8OA doesn’t get it done but if there’s really a rift there maybe they bite at a package of Kuznetsov, 8OA, McMike/Lapierre, and Iorio/Chesley.

I mean if they bite at that package Washington should take it and run. Eichel was traded for not too much and is a similar caliber player so maybe if Pettersson gets disgruntled he’d go for a package like this.
Different situations, but it always seems like the team trading away a star player loses the trade.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

The year AO got 65 goals he pivoted more towards scoring. It was his biggest goals to assist discrepancy until the second half of his career where he started morphing more and more into a pure goal scorer vs an everything highlight reel. Crosby was even more extreme when he got the rocket, there was a major shift in his offensive playstyle

McDavid is looking like he'll score 65+ while leading the league in assists. If he hadn't scored a single goal this year he'd still be top 20 in the league in points, right behind Crosby and Zibanejad. He's putting up this scoring season while not even pivoting the way he plays and just going super saiyan yet again on his entire game

I don’t remember well enough to comment on if Ovechkin consciously made a decision to change his game but if he did, it’s fair to question if it was his choice or a directive from the team. You may be right that he and/or the team decided he was going to focus primarily on goal scoring and if so, it was probably due to the relatively weak supporting cast he had.

When Ovi scored 65 the next highest goal scorer on the team was Alex Semin who scored 26 goals. That’s an outrageous gap. Ovi was also second on the team in assists behind Backstrom and finished with 112 points. Backstrom was 2nd in points and Ovi almost doubled him up. Also, if you look across the league only two other guys hit 50 and Ovi and Iginla were the only two players to hit 100 points.

With McDavid, it’s a very different story both in terms of supporting cast and with scoring levels across the league. He’s got another 50 goal scorer on his team and there are three players on that team with 100 points. Another will finish in the mid 80s for points. Nobody on Washington finished with even 70 points in 2007-08 (besides Ovi). Across the league there are eight guys with 100 points already and another three or four have a solid chance at hitting 100. Three guys have hit 50 goals and with the possibility of two more players hitting it.

 

[crazy8888]

I don’t remember well enough to comment on if Ovechkin consciously made a decision to change his game but if he did, it’s fair to question if it was his choice or a directive from the team. You may be right that he and/or the team decided he was going to focus primarily on goal scoring and if so, it was probably due to the relatively weak supporting cast he had.

When Ovi scored 65 the next highest goal scorer on the team was Alex Semin who scored 26 goals. That’s an outrageous gap. Ovi was also second on the team in assists behind Backstrom and finished with 112 points. Backstrom was 2nd in points and Ovi almost doubled him up. Also, if you look across the league only two other guys hit 50 and Ovi and Iginla were the only two players to hit 100 points.

With McDavid, it’s a very different story both in terms of supporting cast and with scoring levels across the league. He’s got another 50 goal scorer on his team and there are three players on that team with 100 points. Another will finish in the mid 80s for points. Nobody on Washington finished with even 70 points in 2007-08. Across the league there are eight guys with 100 points already and another three or four have a solid chance at hitting 100. Three guys have hit 50 goals and with the possibility of two more players hitting it.

I didint want to say anything on the main boards because i do not want to deal with stupid replies. But year i agree with you 100%. This season feels like mid 80's. More than 10 people may hit 100 and 3 of them are on the same team. Not to take anything away from Mcdavid because he is clearly the best player in the world but this season is just bonkers in terms of scoring. Its the perfect storm for offensive minded players.

 

[g00n]

I don’t remember well enough to comment on if Ovechkin consciously made a decision to change his game but if he did, it’s fair to question if it was his choice or a directive from the team. You may be right that he and/or the team decided he was going to focus primarily on goal scoring and if so, it was probably due to the relatively weak supporting cast he had.

When Ovi scored 65 the next highest goal scorer on the team was Alex Semin who scored 26 goals. That’s an outrageous gap. Ovi was also second on the team in assists behind Backstrom and finished with 112 points. Backstrom was 2nd in points and Ovi almost doubled him up. Also, if you look across the league only two other guys hit 50 and Ovi and Iginla were the only two players to hit 100 points.

With McDavid, it’s a very different story both in terms of supporting cast and with scoring levels across the league. He’s got another 50 goal scorer on his team and there are three players on that team with 100 points. Another will finish in the mid 80s for points. Nobody on Washington finished with even 70 points in 2007-08 (besides Ovi). Across the league there are eight guys with 100 points already and another three or four have a solid chance at hitting 100. Three guys have hit 50 goals and with the possibility of two more players hitting it.

The way I remember it the Caps offense was almost entirely built around Ovie for the first few years.

Look at 2008-09....he took 529 shots!

After that the team became more of an overall offensive threat and Ovie either didn't have to shoot as much or didn't want to. His yearly totals dropped to the 300s on average.

I don't know if it was a coaching thing or if they realized as a team they needed more diversity in scoring.

 

[um]

No chance they’d move Marner and if they did, Wilson wouldn’t come close to getting it done. I could see them maybe moving Nylander if they wanted to change the makeup of their top six but you don’t trade a 25 year old who has scored or paced to score 90+ points in five straight seasons for a power forward on an expiring contract who is four years older. Wilson holds a lot of value but not that kind of value.

Its crazy how Marner's reputation has changed after 1 season. He was HFs punching bag not long ago.

But yea, Leafs would be crazy to trade him.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Its crazy how Marner's reputation has changed after 1 season. He was HFs punching bag not long ago.

But yea, Leafs would be crazy to trade him.

I think the reputation talk is more centered around playoff performance and the lack of team success. As we all know from experience, when a really good team can’t get over the hump the burden falls on the star players. Marner’s production doesn’t drop too precipitously in playoffs vs regular season (1.1 PPG regular season vs .84 PPG in the playoffs) but he’s developed a reputation as someone who is a bit soft and doesn’t play well when the ice becomes smaller. That reputation will stick with players until the team wins, fair or not.

 

[Corby78]

Wonder if St.Louis would do a deal of Kuzy for one of their extra 1sts, a 3rd, and Nieghbors?

 

[twabby]

Wonder if St.Louis would do a deal of Kuzy for one of their extra 1sts, a 3rd, and Nieghbors?

If so take this deal and run.

 

[um]

I think the reputation talk is more centered around playoff performance and the lack of team success. As we all know from experience, when a really good team can’t get over the hump the burden falls on the star players. Marner’s production doesn’t drop too precipitously in playoffs vs regular season (1.1 PPG regular season vs .84 PPG in the playoffs) but he’s developed a reputation as someone who is a bit soft and doesn’t play well when the ice becomes smaller. That reputation will stick with players until the team wins, fair or not.

Yep. He’s also had a few really bad delay of game penalties is the last few playoffs.

Like the Caps the Leafs seemed to be on the wrong end of a lot of weird plays in the playoffs.