NHL Expansion back on agenda?

[TheLegend]

I can name two cities that would live to see the Atlanta Phoenix play a game in Phoenix. LOL.

Maybe someday.

Not sure if any team coming back to Arizona would carry the Coyotes name. Think the mood here seems to be to go in a different direction even with the Kachina logo being as popular as it was.

 

[StreetHawk]

Maybe someday.

Not sure if any team coming back to Arizona would carry the Coyotes name. Think the mood here seems to be to go in a different direction even with the Kachina logo being as popular as it was.

Of the trio of large markets I think Houston most likely of all to go with the established historical name of Aeros. Coyotes just no success to the name and countless bad owners. Might want to start fresh. Atlanta, kind of the same though not as bad off ice or having it drag out as long as in AZ.

But, getting a trademark is hard for anything that is a generic type name like Knights. I mean look at the name options Utah and Seattle put out.

 

[GKJ]

My guess is that Houston doesn’t go to the Aeros. They will want something fresh appealing to new fans.

 

[GreenHornet]

I'll accept Phoenix or Firebird, nothing else.

 

[ponder719]

I'll accept Phoenix

I'll allow it, on the condition that a new team in Arizona is named the Phoenix Atlantas.

 

[TheLegend]

Of the trio of large markets I think Houston most likely of all to go with the established historical name of Aeros. Coyotes just no success to the name and countless bad owners. Might want to start fresh. Atlanta, kind of the same though not as bad off ice or having it drag out as long as in AZ.

But, getting a trademark is hard for anything that is a generic type name like Knights. I mean look at the name options Utah and Seattle put out.

I'm under the impression Utah has theirs worked out..... but it's taken a lot of negotiating ($$$$$$$$$)

 

[TheLegend]

I'll allow it, on the condition that a new team in Arizona is named the Phoenix Atlantas.

Ironically..... Firebirds has been suggested as a replacement in Phoenix..

NHL could have a best of five series and make the cities play for it.

 

[Frenchy]

View attachment 919593

was that the G force cartoon , something like that ???

 

[ponder719]

Ironically..... Firebirds has been suggested as a replacement in Phoenix..

NHL could have a best of five series and make the cities play for it.

One should be the Firebirds, the other should be the Flame Birds.

(Mostly joking, but I absolutely favor teams not worrying about rivals encroaching on their nominative territory, like the Red Sox and White Sox. I will go to my grave insisting that the Stars should have been forced to leave the North Stars name in Minnesota, and take the name Lone Stars in Dallas.)

 

[GKJ]

was that the G force cartoon , something like that ???

Originally called Battle of the Planets, which was adapted from the Japanese series Science Ninja Team Gatchaman

 

[GreenHornet]

was that the G force cartoon , something like that ???

You have a good eye for 1970s anime, mon ami.

 

[Brodie]

I think the idea that they're expanding again so quickly is insane. Bush league behavior

 

[dj4aces]

I think the idea that they're expanding again so quickly is insane. Bush league behavior

Well, think about it like this.

First, as others have pointed out before, the NHL has only 25 US teams. They wanna bring that number up. MLB has 29, NBA has 29, and NFL has 32. I imagine the NHL wantjs to bring that number up to at least 28 (assuming QC gets team #36).

Second, look at the other three leagues, and you'll see one thing they all have in common: At least one franchise in each. Meanwhile, the NHL is missing in three of them. One could easily argue that is "bush league" type stuff.

I'm not saying you're wrong, because your opinion isn't necessarily invalid. But if the league doesn't expand to markets where there's interest, with at least one of these markets having interested owners willing to spend what it takes to get one, why wouldn't you consider expanding? Especially to these vacant markets...

 

[tucker3434]

I think the idea that they're expanding again so quickly is insane. Bush league behavior

Being the only major sport missing 3 of the top 10 American markets is also insane.

 

[frontsfan2005]

Being the only major sport missing 3 of the top 10 American markets is also insane.

100% agree with this.

5. Houston - 7.5 million
6. Atlanta - 6.3 million
10. Phoenix - 5.1 million

That's 18.9 million people in three markets without a local team.

 

[jetsmooseice]

100% agree with this.

5. Houston - 7.5 million
6. Atlanta - 6.3 million
10. Phoenix - 5.1 million

That's 18.9 million people in three markets without a local team.

At least an effort was made in Atlanta and Phoenix. But in some respects it's wild that the NHL has never tried Houston even in spite of the relative success that the Stars have enjoyed in that region.

 

[voyageur]

100% agree with this.

5. Houston - 7.5 million
6. Atlanta - 6.3 million
10. Phoenix - 5.1 million

That's 18.9 million people in three markets without a local team.

Or 3 sports teams, plus MLS, WNBA?, college sports. PGA and NASCAR events. Harder sells, that need some wins to succeed financially.

 

[varsaku]

Being the only major sport missing 3 of the top 10 American markets is also insane.

100% agree with this.

5. Houston - 7.5 million
6. Atlanta - 6.3 million
10. Phoenix - 5.1 million

That's 18.9 million people in three markets without a local team.

While putting a team there makes sense considering their size of those cities but the major thing always being looked over in this thread is the amount of competition in those markets. As @voyageur mentioned, there is a ton of other sports and college sports higher in the specking order than hockey. You basically have to be winning to draw interest otherwise people will just go to another sport to spend their money on. The panthers are probably the best recent example. They struggled to fill games but the moment they started winning, all their problems went away.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

The thing is that Atlanta Phoenix is inherently confusing and is an awful seach optimization name. If you google that, you're going to get Hawks vs Suns stats, flight info, city comparisons, etc., etc. clogging the space with a potential team name.

Just go with Atlanta Firebirds, imho. Start fresh while still harkening back to your hockey legacy.

Oh, and I just searched, Atlanta Pheonix is also already a women's football team apparently.

 

[dj4aces]

At least an effort was made in Atlanta and Phoenix. But in some respects it's wild that the NHL has never tried Houston even in spite of the relative success that the Stars have enjoyed in that region.

Don't get me wrong... definitely crazy that Houston hasn't had a shot at the NHL yet. But as for Atlanta and Phoenix... can one really say an effort was made? Perhaps easier to argue that with the Flames than with the Thrashers, at the very least.

 

[jetsmooseice]

Don't get me wrong... definitely crazy that Houston hasn't had a shot at the NHL yet. But as for Atlanta and Phoenix... can one really say an effort was made? Perhaps easier to argue that with the Flames than with the Thrashers, at the very least.

Well, I don't think anyone can say that an effort wasn't made. I mean, Atlanta has had two kicks at the can and Phoenix had nearly 30 years to get it off the ground.

All I'm saying is that maybe Houston deserves its first opportunity before Phoenix gets its second or Atlanta its third chance.

 

[tucker3434]

While putting a team there makes sense considering their size of those cities but the major thing always being looked over in this thread is the amount of competition in those markets. As @voyageur mentioned, there is a ton of other sports and college sports higher in the specking order than hockey. You basically have to be winning to draw interest otherwise people will just go to another sport to spend their money on. The panthers are probably the best recent example. They struggled to fill games but the moment they started winning, all their problems went away.

When you have a 5m+ market and only an ~18k arena to fill, there should be enough diversity to support all of it. Plenty of us are big CFB fans here but many of us also find it difficult to be season ticket holders because our teams aren’t here. I gave up my season tickets years ago.

Obviously, the teams will still struggle if they spend an extended period of time as a lottery team. But that’s also true of most markets. You compare last years standings to last years attendance figures and it tells a pretty predictable story. I wouldn’t expect these markets to be any different from anywhere else (aside from the TOR, NYR, MTL, etc.’s)

 

[ponder719]

All I'm saying is that maybe Houston deserves its first opportunity before Phoenix gets its second or Atlanta its third chance.

What a market does or does not deserve is entirely irrelevant. What is relevant is a) does an ownership group exist, willing to pay the going rate for an expansion team; b) do they have an NHL-worthy arena, or a concrete plan that will result in an NHL-worthy arena by puck drop, and c) does the market have enough people and corporations in it to sustain the team in good times and bad. Houston, Atlanta, and Phoenix all have c, so that doesn't matter in terms of who goes first. What matters is which of those cities gets a and b sorted first. Atlanta looks to have solid leads on a and b, Phoenix and Houston both have problems with a, so Atlanta will very likely go first, when the NHL decides to expand.

 

[Headshot77]

I like the Thrashers name but I never really jived with their logo and jerseys. 100% willing to see a rebrand though using the Thrashers name.

 

[dj4aces]

Well, I don't think anyone can say that an effort wasn't made. I mean, Atlanta has had two kicks at the can and Phoenix had nearly 30 years to get it off the ground.

All I'm saying is that maybe Houston deserves its first opportunity before Phoenix gets its second or Atlanta its third chance.

If we're going on merit exclusively... I mean, sure, Houston definitely deserves a shot, and unless someone is staunchly anti-expansion, you probably won't find very many who would oppose a Houston franchise. I'm sure they'll get one, too. The only question is when, and that answer is likely to be whenever Fertitta becomes willing to pay whatever price it is the league has in mind.

Atlanta has multiple groups with money to burn, and at least one of them has shovels at the ready to enter the dirt and start laying the groundwork for a new building. Phoenix either needs a new barn or needs Ishbia and the city of Phoenix to agree to renovate the building they have to make it NHL ready.

Whoever goes first all depends on who has the money first. So far, that looks like Atlanta.