OT: NFL/Patriots 2016 Thread - 10-2

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riverhawkey91

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May 22, 2011
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I don't think this makes the Jones trade look worse. It wasn't an either or. It was "Is Jones gonna be worth it? Yes/no. Is Collins gonna be worth it? Yes/no."

I don't know about that. It wasn't necessarily an either/or situation, but the two decisions are definitely related because the players' value to the team is relative. Jones was the obvious odd-man-out over Hightower, Collins and Butler, but moving Collins now changes the whole dynamic of why that Jones trade was necessary in the first place. In hindsight, between having that extra space without Collins and knowing Chris Long hasn't filled in quite as well as hoped, they might have deemed Jones worth the cost.

I have no idea if they'd want a mulligan on the Jones trade given the Collins move and pass-rush struggles, but I don't think this was at all the plan going into the season. I personally was skeptical of the value they got for Jones anyways, so to me, this just makes that trade look worse.

And I really don't see how people can second guess Belichick at this point. With the benefit of hindsight? Sure. But to think anyone (especially someone on the outside, especially a fan) knows better is ridiculous. I'm not saying he'll never be wrong, but second guessing him is a very losing battle.

I definitely agree there's no reason to second guess Bill in his decision making. He has the occasional bad call, but he's overwhelmingly right for the most part.

On the other hand, I think it's perfectly fair to criticize the value on some of his choices. Collins should absolutely have gone for much more than a late 3rd/early 4th. A full year of Jones should have gone for more than a late second and a risky prospect, especially from a prospective SB contender (at the time).

Belichick has a tendency of turning what he does get into gold, which is part of what makes him so great (like with the Jones trade), so the original return sometimes gets overlooked. But that doesn't mean he should escape criticism for getting bad value in the first place.
 

Therick67

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Apr 6, 2009
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It is possible to love and believe in Belichick and still criticize some of his choices, you know.

Lost in all of this with Collins is how much worse the Chandler Jones trade looks. It made sense when he was the odd guy out, but now that Collins is gone, the money could have theoretically been there to keep him. Meanwhile, the Pats pass rush is nonexistent, and that was before moving a solid pass-rushing LB. Thuney and Mitchell have looked good, but Cooper was obviously cut, and there could have been other ways to get them without giving up Jones.

For most of the non-extremists, it boils down to having to take the good with the bad with Bill. Sometimes you trade a solid LB for essentially a 4th rounder and look stupid, and other times you pass on shelling out huge money to re-sign an elite CB in favor of a kid with no starts and look like a genius.

I do, know.

My issue is, he won't allow Don Sweeney to be criticized and likes to site 'arm chair GM's'.

We've seen this before from Belichick, we shouldn't be surprised or believe the season is over.

I was a Collins fan, but he wasn't having a good year and we have no idea whats going on behind the scenes.

I do have faith in Belichick, he's earned it as far as I'm concerned, doesn't mean I like all the moves - just that I'm wiling to see what happens.
 

Fossy21

Nobel Prize Deke
Mar 14, 2013
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How is Stephen A. Smith employed...?

Brady can't be the GOAT because "You have Randy Moss and Wes Welker and the No. 1 offense ... and you lose in 2007? I'm sorry, I'm gonna hold that against you."

:laugh:
 

JRull86

Registered User
Jan 28, 2009
27,762
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How is Stephen A. Smith employed...?

Brady can't be the GOAT because "You have Randy Moss and Wes Welker and the No. 1 offense ... and you lose in 2007? I'm sorry, I'm gonna hold that against you."

:laugh:

Who the hell is his GOAT then? Montana?

If he's using that criteria, then Manning shouldn't even be in his top 10.
 

CharasLazyWrister

Registered User
Sep 8, 2008
24,896
22,091
Lunenburg, MA
Strongly disagree. There are contrarians like felger who are calculating and geniuses at what they do. SAS is a moron and has proven it over and over.

Easily the most glowing review I've ever heard of Michael Felger. Genius? Wow. When I lived in Boston, the guy turned me off from sports radio, probably, forever.

They're both equally annoying. Mark Cuban (who annoyed the **** out of me before I realized how smart he was) put SAS in his place a while back. I'm sure he could do the same with Felger. All these guys just speak in emotional, sweeping generalities and have very little interest in the technicalities and intricacies of sports.
 

Johnnyduke

Registered User
Oct 30, 2007
23,648
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Classic awkward belichick press conference right now. Has to suck to ask this guy a question.
 

Johnnyduke

Registered User
Oct 30, 2007
23,648
7,593
Reggie wayne says brady can't win mvp because he was caught cheating this year. Guess he really didn't enjoy his short tenure here...
 

Johnnyduke

Registered User
Oct 30, 2007
23,648
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Btw, still waiting on nfl to release those PSI numbers but they won't because it doesn't support their argument
 

jgatie

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Sep 22, 2011
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Reggie wayne says brady can't win mvp because he was caught cheating this year. Guess he really didn't enjoy his short tenure here...

Caught cheating "this year"?

Tell Reggie Wayne that 2014 called and it wants it's meme back. No wonder this clown couldn't handle the playbook.
 

DKH

Worst Poster/Awful Takes
Feb 27, 2002
76,666
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Personally I don't think we should judge this Jamie Collins trade until Jakub Zboril is at least 21.

It will be to late. Zborol is only 19. By the time he turns 21 Jamie Collins will have already gone 0-24 as a Browns.

If they lose the SB i want BB to relinquish the GM duties and HOF exec Bill Polian to salvage the final year of Tom Brady career
 

BklyNBruiN

Registered User
May 7, 2009
14,122
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www.amishrakefight.org
Is it possible that NE didn't want to pay Collins because their planning on making a big move this Summer? New England now only has $65.8 million in salary and cash committed to the 2017 payroll. That is the lowest in the NFL! Not only are they the best Football team in the NFL rite now, they are also the best cap management team. Amazing.. I wish the Bruins had a staff that good. LOL

Okay let me ask. I heard that Tom Brady said that he could be traded? Though I have a feeling this was done only to throw off the damn media about them making a big deal of Collins and Jones being traded. Which I think if true, that is brilliant.
 
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