Muzz - What to do?

[Eternal Leaf]

I think Muzzin will be fine.

The Carlson play is a bad look but it happens. The only other issue I saw him have was mistiming his plays along the boards, which is likely due to his time off. For the most part, he was passable with his performance even if it wasn't the Muzzin of old.

They should probably let him rest until this niggle goes away though. A guy that's timing is already off can't be carrying a niggle too.

Once his timing comes back, I think he will be serviceable in the playoffs.

 

[The Iceman]

Re-sign Giordano and trade or LTIR Muzzin. He's been a warrior for us, but his body just can't handle the grind anymore.

Has he been a warrior?

Not blamming him but he has missed a lot of important games.
His play has fallen off a cliff very unexpectably this season. Did he stop looking after himself or was he never much of a workout type? makes me wonder.

He is 33 but looks much older.

 

[Menzinger]

I have zero idea why people think he's just going to willingly accept being LTIR'd out of the league. He's a guy who wants to play.

If the Leafs want him gone they'll likely go the trade route. Some GM will take him for futures considerations

 

[myleafs]

i like Muzzin but the hard miles have caught up to him and he's looking cooked so i have no idea why people think someone would take his last 2 yrs without a large sweetener

also he has a full ntc and as i've been told there's no way to trade a player with the clause in his contract so we're stuck with him

According to Capfriendly he does not have a full ntc.

CLAUSE DETAILS: Starting July 1, 2023: Player submits a 10 team no trade list.

 

[Griffin76]

It was embarrassing or really looked embarrassing on TV.

It was bad. Really bad

 

[Martin Skoula]

Giordano arguably has less hard miles on him than Muzzin does at this point. Gio is a weekend car owned by a grandma in Florida, Muzzin has been offroading since he entered the league.

 

[Nylanderthal]

He's been very valuable in his time here but his cap would be best used elsewhere

5.65 from him and 3.8 from Mrazek opens up a lot of options

Those 2 along with Holl & Kerfoot create a significant portion of cap to redistribute this off-season (14.925m)

 

[Nylanderthal]

I have zero idea why people think he's just going to willingly accept being LTIR'd out of the league. He's a guy who wants to play.

If the Leafs want him gone they'll likely go the trade route. Some GM will take him for futures considerations

Anaheim and LA both need LD who can play that style and are familiar geography for him. Detroit Columbus Buffalo and Ottawa are all at different stages of their rebuilds where a rugged vet like Muzz would seem valuable, and all are close to his Woodstock home. Pitt is always all in with sid & geno and muzz might be a good fit there, also close to home for him.
Once his July bonus is paid out this summer he’ll have $2m in salary that year and $2m in bonus and $2m salary the following season, so $6m over 2 seasons in actual dollars.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Has he been a warrior?

Not blamming him but he has missed a lot of important games.
His play has fallen off a cliff very unexpectably this season. Did he stop looking after himself or was he never much of a workout type? makes me wonder.

He is 33 but looks much older.

Yes he has been a warrior and he's paying for it now

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I love him, I really do but he looks like he might be done, he might be headed for LTIRetirement same with Marazek

they need a younger version of Muzzin


thankfully there is one on the block in Arizona for some reason

 

[Leafsfan74]

I have zero idea why people think he's just going to willingly accept being LTIR'd out of the league. He's a guy who wants to play.

If the Leafs want him gone they'll likely go the trade route. Some GM will take him for futures considerations

Muzzin traded for only future considerations? If he is healthy that would be theft by another GM.

I get that he hasn't been healthy or even himself this season buf he is a Gamer. His contract might not be cheap, but again, if he is healthy, it's a reasonable contract

In any league, especially the NHL, teams always seek out Gamers, and they pay more than future considerations for them. With him on this backend the defense is far deeper and meaner for a playoff run.

Now, if Leafs could find a suitable competitor to replace him, maybe he is expendable. I won't rule anything out. I gather from his teammates and coaches comments that he brings far more than just the intrinsic value of his play on the ice.

Sometimes a player falls off a cliff. I am not convinced that he has yet. He hasn't been 100%. This is the defining factor going forward IMO.

This is also a poll that is more relevant after this years playoffs. Depending on the outcome, you may see a similar poll on a number of players...

 

[supermann_98]

Yes muzzin lost speed and will be beat like carlsson again but he didn't get his career because of his skating..hea
Its the same thing everybody telling about Chara like last 10-15 season or about Weber... They are slow but they know how to defend and how to use their body perfectly. Thats why brodie is a very good fit with muzzin. Brodie bring the skating but lack of physicality, muzzin bring the physicality but lack of skating. If hes hewlthy, no reason to trade him away

Agreed, Brodie is great for him at this stage. He's obviously struggled this year whereas the past 2 years I really believe him being hurt in the playoffs is the main reason why we lost to Montreal and Columbus.

Reilly and Boosh seem to have some chemistry and their games seem to mesh as each has elements to their game the other does not.

Gio with Liljegren has also looked in sync since the trade was made.

Muzzin will get this weekend off, hopefully he's not rushing back if he has lingering concussion issues. 2 concussions in one season at his age and the physicality in which he plays may allow us to Robidas Island the guy but something tells me he has plans to play as long as he can and wants a cup in TO before he agrees to a career ending LTIR stint

 

[Legion34]

Has he been a warrior?

Not blamming him but he has missed a lot of important games.
His play has fallen off a cliff very unexpectably this season. Did he stop looking after himself or was he never much of a workout type? makes me wonder.

He is 33 but looks much older.

He looks like he never recovered from last years torn groin.

He couldn’t push yesterday. It looked like it blew but I think he played the game

 

[Zonk]

According to Capfriendly he does not have a full ntc.

CLAUSE DETAILS: Starting July 1, 2023: Player submits a 10 team no trade list.

Please check Capfriendly again. He has a full NTC for this year and next. Starting on July 1, 2023 he submits a ten team no trade list. His contract is designed for him to be traded in the summer of 2023. Suggesting that the Leafs can trade him this summer is highly questionable.

 

[darrylsittler27]

Please check Capfriendly again. He has a full NTC for this year and next. Starting on July 1, 2023 he submits a ten team no trade list. His contract is designed for him to be traded in the summer of 2023. Suggesting that the Leafs can trade him this summer is highly questionable.

 

[darrylsittler27]

Who thinks Muzzin will be here next year?
I think with the addition of Lyubushkin his ability to stabilize Morgan and his Lyubushkin UFA status + Muzz's recent injury history , his declining play, plus his cap hit (5.6 mil), means Muzz is the odd man out next year.
IMO it makes a lot of sense to sign Lyubushkin for the reasons I previously mentioned. Gio stabilizes Lilly, Lilly has gone from a bottom pairing pizza delivery risky defender , to a good bottom pairing defender with Gio. It makes sense to resign Gio just for the mentorship for Lilly, not to mention Gio's ability to play up in the lineup.
Next year I see the D-pairings as :
Rilley - Lyub
Gio - Lilly.
Sandin- Open

 

[AuraSphere]

If we can trade Holl and Muzzin it would be ideal.

Rielly - Brodie
Gio - Liljegren
Sandin - Lybushkin

Niemela should be knocking on the door very soon

 

[ponder]

He was really good his first 3 seasons with us, a legit #2/3 level dman. This year he’s been much, much worse, more of a #6/7.

Hopefully it’s mostly injuries, and he can get healthy and bounce most of the way back. If not … he’ll be tricky to trade.

 

[ACC1224]

He hasn’t looked great all year but like everything it’ll come down to how he looks in the playoffs and how the team performs.

 

[aingefan]

Gotta think the injuries are catching up, and they seem to be making him tentative to play his physical style. Which is very fair - concussions are no joke.

A fully healthy Muzz is gonna go right at Wilson and at least try to stand him up after hitting Jack. He kept himself away from that.

 

[Mess]

The Muzzin contract is not aging well, and this was somewhat expected at time of signing due in part to his physical style of play and wear and tear that takes on the body and now already 33 years old.

With 2 years left at $5.6 mil cap and $8 mil in actual salary this is also not going to be an easy contract to move either for those same reason above.

With a limited 10 team no trade list NTC that Muzzin has he also has a say in where he could be traded to. He could simply list the bottom 10 teams in the league with the most cap room to absorb his contract in his NTC and limit Leafs trade partners to he stronger teams.

Toss in concussion issues and concerns that alter is availability uncertainty, and then impacting his style of play perhaps to avoid the direct physicality and the situation becomes even more cloudy.

 

[crump]

I wonder what the flare up is? The way he turned awkwardly on that one goal against I might be inclined to say back injury. Backs can be worked on, but as we saw with Wendel Clark they can be devastating injuries.

 

[ShaneFalco]

The way he has played all year I don't think we'd miss him much. But he's certainly capable of turning it up a notch

 

[Menzinger]

Muzzin traded for only future considerations? If he is healthy that would be theft by another GM.

I get that he hasn't been healthy or even himself this season buf he is a Gamer. His contract might not be cheap, but again, if he is healthy, it's a reasonable contract

In any league, especially the NHL, teams always seek out Gamers, and they pay more than future considerations for them. With him on this backend the defense is far deeper and meaner for a playoff run.

Now, if Leafs could find a suitable competitor to replace him, maybe he is expendable. I won't rule anything out. I gather from his teammates and coaches comments that he brings far more than just the intrinsic value of his play on the ice.

Sometimes a player falls off a cliff. I am not convinced that he has yet. He hasn't been 100%. This is the defining factor going forward IMO.

This is also a poll that is more relevant after this years playoffs. Depending on the outcome, you may see a similar poll on a number of players...

Oh my preference is to have a healthy Muzzin back in the lineup as part of the top 4.

I just don't think the Leafs will have too much time moving him, one way or another if push comes to shove.

 

[nuck]

I have Muzzin penciled in for at least well into next season because I don't think they can trade him without a big sweetener this year.. What is the cost of dropping a $6M salary on another club, a 1st? How much then for $5.623 x 2? He has to be healthy and playing decent hockey for another team to be interested and he isn't there. I don't think there is a "what to do with Jake" question yet because the club has no intention of paying another team to take him, especially when those same assets may be required to add a goalie.

Assuming he keeps missing because of more concussion problems I think it will still be well into next year before we can predict the worst outcome for him. Maybe I 'm wrong but I'm not getting the Savard/Horton/Kase vibe with him yet. He is as likely to recover as get worse until someone in the know says he isn't. He's not going anywhere.