MrB1Ps annual affiliated prospect list 2020 Covid edition

[Pavels Dog]

Gee, a 5'11 player known for his weak physical stature has trouble defending a 6'7 240 lbs monster? Wow, who woulda thought!

You caught a bad game, and he has his warts, hes weak and he wont win puck battles one on one, thats not his strength, nor will it ever be.

That doesn't mean hell be sheltered, since he wasnt sheltered on the best team in the SHL as a 19 years old, while being their best defender.

It's just counter to your argument that he's better defensively than offensively, from my viewings that's not something I see. The size disadvantage is more pronounces at the NHL level which is why you see very few d-men of his size logging top pairing minutes in the NHL.

 

[Mrb1p]

It's just counter to your argument that he's better defensively than offensively, from my viewings that's not something I see. The size disadvantage is more pronounces at the NHL level which is why you see very few d-men of his size logging top pairing minutes in the NHL.

Very few Ds of his size but
Makar
Hughes
Karlsson
Krug
Girard
Keith
Letang
Pionk
Mcavoy
Josi
Spurgeon
Goligoski
Morrissey
Orlov
Subban
Dumba

.... lmao

Hes weak physically, hes going to get beat, hes 20, hes not a perfect player, neither is Seider.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Very few Ds of his size but
Makar (105)
Hughes (77)
Karlsson (36)
Krug (130)
Girard (39)
Keith (18)
Letang (9)
Pionk (14)
Mcavoy (10)
Josi (3)
Spurgeon (86)
Goligoski (41)
Morrissey (8)
Orlov (12)
Subban (73)
Dumba (43)

.... lmao

Hes weak physically, hes going to get beat, hes 20, hes not a perfect player, neither is Seider.

Well I highlighted the players that are listed as bigger than Lundkvist. Josi for example is quite a bit taller. I also added their rank in terms of ES TOI/GP, which tends to be a decent measure of legit top pairing d-men.
Out of the guys who are listed as small or smaller than Lundkvist only Orlov is even top 30.. i.e. a lot of these smaller guys are powerplay specialists. Makar and Hughes may break the mold but Lundkvist is nowhere near their talent level.

It's not about being a perfect player it's about what's likely. Especially if someone has defensive issues as a 20 year old in his 3rd SHL season.

 

[Mrb1p]

Well I highlighted the players that are listed as bigger than Lundkvist. Josi for example is quite a bit taller. I also added their rank in terms of ES TOI/GP, which tends to be a decent measure of legit top pairing d-men.
Out of the guys who are listed as small or smaller than Lundkvist only Orlov is even top 30.. i.e. a lot of these smaller guys are powerplay specialists. Makar and Hughes may break the mold but Lundkvist is nowhere near their talent level.

It's not about being a perfect player it's about what's likely. Especially if someone has defensive issues as a 20 year old in his 3rd SHL season.

Ah, right, cherry picking 3 centimeters off a player.

The defensive issues are the same defensive issues Karlsson and Rafalski had all their careers. Yet here we are, with both of them posting up HOF worthy careers.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Ah, right, cherry picking 3 centimeters off a player.

The defensive issues are the same defensive issues Karlsson and Rafalski had all their careers. Yet here we are, with both of them posting up HOF worthy careers.

Well the reason it's an uphill battle for small D-men is because if you go up against forwards that are nearly all bigger, even if they are only 3 or 4 or 5 cm bigger, you are at a disadvantage defensively. You have a slightly harder time pushing them off the puck, a slightly harder time containing them. Every little bit matters, especially at the NHL level. So I don't think it's cherrypicking at all.
Comparing to Karlsson (or Hughes or Makar) I simply don't see that caliber of elite skating and offense from Lundkvist. It's not about whether it's impossible to make it either, but it's kinda like saying any small forward could be the next Theo Fleury. Yeah, it's possible. But it's not likely.

 

[Mrb1p]

Well the reason it's an uphill battle for small D-men is because if you go up against forwards that are nearly all bigger, even if they are only 3 or 4 or 5 cm bigger, you are at a disadvantage defensively. You have a slightly harder time pushing them off the puck, a slightly harder time containing them. Every little bit matters, especially at the NHL level. So I don't think it's cherrypicking at all.
Comparing to Karlsson (or Hughes or Makar) I simply don't see that caliber of elite skating and offense from Lundkvist. It's not about whether it's impossible to make it either, but it's kinda like saying any small forward could be the next Theo Fleury. Yeah, it's possible. But it's not likely.

You dont see the elite offense ? Youre aware that Lundkvist shattered the record for u20 points by a D last year? How much more elite do you want it to be ?

Also, the point is that these defenders make these situations happen less, they move the puck quickly on forecheckers to not get in these situations, it doesnt happen nearly as often as you say it does.

Sure, Seider is always going to have the advantage defensively, hes bigger, hes faster and hes stronger. But so are many othet players when compared to smaller Ds, sadly that doesn't make them better players.

 

[Pavels Dog]

You dont see the elite offense ? Youre aware that Lundkvist shattered the record for u20 points by a D last year? How much more elite do you want it to be ?

That was a very good season but it remains to be seen how much it means. I mean if we are comparing to for example Erik Karlsson one has to mention that he was in the NHL at that age, and several others who might have put up great SHL numbers as 19 year olds also moved to NHL/AHL instead (Brännström, Hedman), and you have a guy like Rundblad who was nearly PPG in the same season (d+2) and obviously still didn't become anything.
After a season like Lundkvist had last year, I would expect him to build on it and show that he is mastering the SHL level. I'm not seeing that. It's just my opinion, like you have yours.

 

[Mrb1p]

That was a very good season but it remains to be seen how much it means. I mean if we are comparing to for example Erik Karlsson one has to mention that he was in the NHL at that age, and several others who might have put up great SHL numbers as 19 year olds also moved to NHL/AHL instead (Brännström, Hedman), and you have a guy like Rundblad who was nearly PPG in the same season (d+2) and obviously still didn't become anything.
After a season like Lundkvist had last year, I would expect him to build on it and show that he is mastering the SHL level. I'm not seeing that. It's just my opinion, like you have yours.

Karlsson was in the SHL at 19 and posted up 10 points, just like Lundvist.

 

[thrillhous]

Karlsson was in the SHL at 19 and posted up 10 points, just like Lundvist.

Age 18 you mean.

 

[Mrb1p]

Age 18 you mean.

Right 18 because theyre late birthdays

 

[Pavels Dog]

Karlsson was in the SHL at 19 and posted up 10 points, just like Lundvist.

Karlsson dominated WJC in his d+1, in his d+2 he was dominating AHL and getting adjusted to NHL, also played at the men's world championship.
D+3 he was already a great offensive d-man in the NHL.

The trajectories are completely different.

 

[P10p]

Right 18 because theyre late birthdays

So you're wrong lol.

 

[Mrb1p]

Karlsson dominated WJC in his d+1, in his d+2 he was dominating AHL and getting adjusted to NHL, also played at the men's world championship.
D+3 he was already a great offensive d-man in the NHL.

The trajectories are completely different.

I mean Lundkvist dominated SHL like no one ever before in his D+2, so I have a hard time figuring out how you hold that against him. He did the best everyone ever did in the situation he was in.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I mean Lundkvist dominated SHL like no one ever before in his D+2, so I have a hard time figuring out how you hold that against him. He did the best everyone ever did in the situation he was in.

I don't hold it against him, I just don't think it means much unless he builds on it.

 

[Mrb1p]

I don't hold it against him, I just don't think it means much unless he builds on it.

And somehow youve extrapolated that hes not building on it from the 10 games he played in which he has 4 points ?

I guess Seider aint building mych either then, so whats the hold up?

 

[stl76]

Might want to re-count Texier's games played. Unless we are not counting playoff games as professional games, which seems like an odd choice.

 

[Mrb1p]

Might want to re-count Texier's games played. Unless we are not counting playoff games as professional games, which seems like an odd choice.

Thats a good point, I did not but I probably should have.

Ill probably reconsider for next years list.

 

[Tripod]

Just for some feedback regarding Brink. On the Flyets board, here is how the voting has gone:

1. Frost, Morgan - 79%
2. York, Cam - 70%
3. Zamula, Yegor - 48%

Brink is winning the #4 spot at 72%. He and Zamula were neck and neck for the #3 spot and it was a toss up. But it is pretty clear that our fans have Frost and York as better prospects.

And to show you the difference, the voting results for our top Prospect:

Frost had 86 votes
York had 13 votes
Zamula and Brink had 2 votes each

And for the 2nd top prospect, it went:

72 votes for York
15 votes for Brink
12 votes for Zamula

Just sharing our boards opinion.

 

[Pavels Dog]

And somehow youve extrapolated that hes not building on it from the 10 games he played in which he has 4 points ?

I guess Seider aint building mych either then, so whats the hold up?

Yes it's just an indication from 10 games, but that's all we got.

Seider is PPG, it's only 4 games but he definitely looks like he's building on last year and like he's ready for bigger things than the SHL.

 

[Mrb1p]

Just for some feedback regarding Brink. On the Flyets board, here is how the voting has gone:

1. Frost, Morgan - 79%
2. York, Cam - 70%
3. Zamula, Yegor - 48%

Brink is winning the #4 spot at 72%. He and Zamula were neck and neck for the #3 spot and it was a toss up. But it is pretty clear that our fans have Frost and York as better prospects.

And to show you the difference, the voting results for our top Prospect:

Frost had 86 votes
York had 13 votes
Zamula and Brink had 2 votes each

And for the 2nd top prospect, it went:

72 votes for York
15 votes for Brink
12 votes for Zamula

Just sharing our boards opinion.

Yeah, I wouldn't trust the Habs board with the opinion of Habs prospect either, most don't watch a single game and talk very loudly about them anyway.

 

[Tripod]

Yeah, I wouldn't trust the Habs board with the opinion of Habs prospect either, most don't watch a single game and talk very loudly about them anyway.

Well that is where we differ I guess. We have a knowledgeable bunch, most who don't venture much onto the main boards to avoid the cesspool.....lol.

 

[Mrb1p]

Well that is where we differ I guess. We have a knowledgeable bunch, most who don't venture much onto the main boards to avoid the cesspool.....lol.

Oh theres a few good posters on the habs board too, but I fail to see how a poll can represent that.

 

[Tripod]

Oh theres a few good posters on the habs board too, but I fail to see how a poll can represent that.

Well I guess I feel we have way more than a few on ours.

And to clarify, it doesn't mean you are wrong about Brink. I hope you are right. Hope he becomes a great 1st line player. Just as I hope we are right about Frost, York and Zamula. For Flyers prospects, those 4 are the highest tier and then we see a drop down to the next tier. Time will tell how they all fair out.

 

[Mrb1p]

Well I guess I feel we have way more than a few on ours.

And to clarify, it doesn't mean you are wrong about Brink. I hope you are right. Hope he becomes a great 1st line player. Just as I hope we are right about Frost, York and Zamula. For Flyers prospects, those 4 are the highest tier and then we see a drop down to the next tier. Time will tell how they all fair out.

I had Brink ahead of York on draft day, I see no reasons why someone would want York ahead of him. Ive also been notoriously low on Frost because of the same reasons why I hate Zegras

 

[SI90]

Dobson the 33rd best prospect? Yikes.