Player Discussion Morgan Rielly

[ULF_55]

For a decade we've been talking about finding a player to play with Morgan Rielly, but his sputtering offense, terrible special teams contributions on the powerplay, inconsistent and sloppy defensive play, that daydreaming sequence in the Game 7 OT loss to Boston, I don't think he's part of a winning recipe.

We have to find a defenseman who can supplant him in the "number one" role that will bump him down the roster, and with his cap being what it is, he's really not a guy who can be locked in till 2029-30 with a NMC.

What a disappointing player.

5 months later and wow.

I'm not sure the player we're seeing today is a #1.

Might make more sense to talk about finding a partner for Tanev on the 1st. pairing.

 

[TopCheeseShotta]

How many more years of this? 7or so? Good lawwwwdd

He strikes me as the one constant from the Kessel years to now - and I think we should probably start to see him as the guy that welcomes dude's in like, hey - just cool, man... dont rock the boat.. we're all Leafs and it's a great time and a good privilege. There's lots of pressure here as it is, so yknow - just stay within yourself and don't overdo it.. you'll make us all look bad.

I want you all to start watching Morgan chase players either dumping past him, or with him having lost a step, in our zone. It's bloody said man. I've never seen him look at work and think hey - I'm gonna go do that - except to his credit, for the occasional playoff round here and there (not the last one).

I dunno.. personal conspiracy theory when counting all of the cracks in the Maple Leaf wall that need mending, that this is and has always been a voice that doesn't work for a championship team.

 

[dubplatepressure]

5 months later and wow.

I'm not sure the player we're seeing today is a #1.

Might make more sense to talk about finding a partner for Tanev on the 1st. pairing.

He never was a true #1. More like a solid #2. We haven't had a true #1 in a long time.

 

[1specter]

You guys are genuinely insufferable

 

[notbias]

One of the guys who seems to consistently step it up in the playoffs and you all are upset that 2 games into the season he hasn't shown that he is an all-star?

Spoiler, Rielly isn't going pointless this year, Matthews isn't going goalless, McMann isn't going GPG, and Lorentz isn't putting up a PPG.

He never was a true #1. More like a solid #2. We haven't had a true #1 in a long time.

Who are the 32 true #1s?

5 months later and wow.

I'm not sure the player we're seeing today is a #1.

Might make more sense to talk about finding a partner for Tanev on the 1st. pairing.

2 games in, some of you can't help but be miserable.

 

[dubplatepressure]

Who are the 32 true #1s?

who says there are?

 

[ULF_55]

2 games in, some of you can't help but be miserable.

We wish it was only 2 games in to be discussed.

This is just a continuation of how he's been playing.

He really seems to have lost a gear, or perhaps he isn't in shape?

Maybe he should play at a lower weight?
225lb. at 6'1" ...

 

[Suntouchable13]

He never was a true #1. More like a solid #2. We haven't had a true #1 in a long time.

24 years as a fan, and I don't think I have ever seen 1. Bryan McCabe maybe came close one season? Finished 4th in the Norris voting, can't remember which year.

 

[ULF_55]

24 years as a fan, and I don't think I have ever seen 1. Bryan McCabe maybe came close one season? Finished 4th in the Norris voting, can't remember which year.

Skating was always Rielly's greatest asset.
Passing was another.
It was never defending, nor shooting, nor being physical.


I've not seen all these guys ... I'm not 100.
My time 1960's forward.

The Top 10 Toronto Maple Leafs Defensemen of All-Time

The Toronto Maple Leafs have been graced with a plethora of phenomenal defensemen over the course of their over 100 year history. Here are their Top 10:

editorinleaf.com

 

[Leafs87]

Don’t understand the Rielly hate

 

[notbias]

who says there are?

Define #1... clearly, it is not the normal definition.

We wish it was only 2 games in to be discussed.

This is just a continuation of how he's been playing.

He really seems to have lost a gear, or perhaps he isn't in shape?

Maybe he should play at a lower weight?
225lb. at 6'1" ...

He has been around 220+ for the last several seasons...

I agree we should get a smaller quicker team, but Treliving thinks the opposite (and most of this board).

He probably loves the size of Rielly.

Last two seasons, in the playoffs, only 15 points in 18 games... he sucks.

 

[ULF_55]

Don’t understand the Rielly hate

But, is it hate?

Or is it disappointment that he not the player he once was? Norris votes need not enter this discussion as that award is really distorted. Norris is sometimes used as the Art Ross for defenders.

Certainly, he will still put up the points, and hopefully Tanev can cover off the heavier lifting, but there are some of us who see some concerning signs. Last night he was unable to keep up with an attacking forward. He was thoroughly beat and it wasn't even close. Maybe it was at the end of a shift, but it was glaringly obvious. Remember it has always been his skating that put him at the top of the Leafs' defensive hierarchy.

He's probably been the Leafs best defenseman since Phaneuf, who had his own warts.

He might still be their best defenseman ... but maybe he isn't?

 

[dubplatepressure]

Define #1... clearly, it is not the normal definition.

A team's top defenseman is not necessarily a #1D. When we think about true #1D we probably ought to agree that to be a #1D you'd be the best defenseman on most playoff teams. That is probably a good start. There will be exceptions. So would Rielly be a #1 on the majority of playoff teams? I don't think so. Last year for example, arguably Rielly may be a wash with Forsling (FLA), Doughtly (LA), Theodore (VGN), or Carlson (WSH), but IMO he's not equal to Hedman (TB), McAvoy (BOS), Fox (NYR), Skjei (CAR), Morrisey (WPG), Makar (COL), Heskainen (DAL), Josi (NSH), Hughes (VAN), Ekholm (EDM), or Dobson (NYI). He's not "better" than any of those players IMO.

 

[Leafs87]

But, is it hate?

Or is it disappointment that he not the player he once was? Norris votes need not enter this discussion as that award is really distorted. Norris is sometimes used as the Art Ross for defenders.

Certainly, he will still put up the points, and hopefully Tanev can cover off the heavier lifting, but there are some of us who see some concerning signs. Last night he was unable to keep up with an attacking forward. He was thoroughly beat and it wasn't even close. Maybe it was at the end of a shift, but it was glaringly obvious. Remember it has always been his skating that put him at the top of the Leafs' defensive hierarchy.

He's probably been the Leafs best defenseman since Phaneuf, who had his own warts.

He might still be their best defenseman ... but maybe he isn't?

He turned 30 this year, while it’s not like he’s toast. His career is likely on a linear decline from here on out, maybe he has some more good seasons, but his prime is definitely behind him and skating is usually the first noticeable decline with age.

 

[notbias]

A team's top defenseman is not necessarily a #1D. When we think about true #1D we probably ought to agree that to be a #1D you'd be the best defenseman on most playoff teams. That is probably a good start. There will be exceptions. So would Rielly be a #1 on the majority of playoff teams? I don't think so. Last year for example, arguably Rielly may be a wash with Forsling (FLA), Doughtly (LA), Theodore (VGN), or Carlson (WSH), but IMO he's not equal to Hedman (TB), McAvoy (BOS), Fox (NYR), Skjei (CAR), Morrisey (WPG), Makar (COL), Heskainen (DAL), Josi (NSH), Hughes (VAN), Ekholm (EDM), or Dobson (NYI). He's not "better" than any of those players IMO.

A #1 is simply one of the best 32 D...

Just say a top X D if you want to make a cut off.

He's not a top 10 D, but I believe he's in the top 32 (a #1 D), probably somewhere between 15 and 25.

 

[WTFMAN99]

But, is it hate?

Or is it disappointment that he not the player he once was? Norris votes need not enter this discussion as that award is really distorted. Norris is sometimes used as the Art Ross for defenders.

Certainly, he will still put up the points, and hopefully Tanev can cover off the heavier lifting, but there are some of us who see some concerning signs. Last night he was unable to keep up with an attacking forward. He was thoroughly beat and it wasn't even close. Maybe it was at the end of a shift, but it was glaringly obvious. Remember it has always been his skating that put him at the top of the Leafs' defensive hierarchy.

He's probably been the Leafs best defenseman since Phaneuf, who had his own warts.

He might still be their best defenseman ... but maybe he isn't?

He turned 30 this year, while it’s not like he’s toast. His career is likely on a linear decline from here on out, maybe he has some more good seasons, but his prime is definitely behind him and skating is usually the first noticeable decline with age.

He's likely to maintain a good level of play but he's in his prime now, he will only decline from this point onwards.

I find he's a flawed player, he's not dynamic enough to QB an elite PP because of his lack of shooting prowess and I don't trust him against other team's top players, he can burn you as we saw with the Pastrnak dagger last year.

I was ready to turn the page after the playoffs but no one was ready to have that conversation.

I thought about it more and I just don't think this organization knows how to develop defenseman.

You see it with OEL, McCabe, Muzzin, Tanev and I am sure with Hakanpaa shortly, guys that came from good teams know how to play the position pretty well, they can play both defense and add a bit of offense but they're obviously not Quinn Hughes, but Rielly isn't Hughes either.

Maybe it is something that would get revisited next off-season.

 

[67leafs]

If been saying MR has been mediocre for years.

 

[Leafs87]

He's likely to maintain a good level of play but he's in his prime now, he will only decline from this point onwards.

I find he's a flawed player, he's not dynamic enough to QB an elite PP because of his lack of shooting prowess and I don't trust him against other team's top players, he can burn you as we saw with the Pastrnak dagger last year.

I was ready to turn the page after the playoffs but no one was ready to have that conversation.

I thought about it more and I just don't think this organization knows how to develop defenseman.

You see it with OEL, McCabe, Muzzin, Tanev and I am sure with Hakanpaa shortly, guys that came from good teams know how to play the position pretty well, they can play both defense and add a bit of offense but they're obviously not Quinn Hughes, but Rielly isn't Hughes either.

Maybe it is something that would get revisited next off-season.

Yeah agreed on the Leafs defensemen developing. Aside from Rielly and Kaberle, I can’t think of any other #1/2s developed in the last 25 years. Also I feel Morgan and Kaberle kind of just progressed due to their natural skills more than due to the Leafs development. Schenn was an obvious whiff.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Yeah agreed on the Leafs defensemen developing. Aside from Rielly and Kaberle, I can’t think of any other #1/2s developed in the last 25 years. Also I feel Morgan and Kaberle kind of just progressed due to their natural skills more than due to the Leafs development. Schenn was an obvious whiff.

We screwed Schenn by rushing him, if they gave him another 2 years, he probably is better for it. He had to seek out Oates to develop more puck skills on his own.

If he got to get more touches in Junior and even 20 minutes a night in the AHL, he develops his puck skills and likely doesn't have that bad period where he was up/down. He's probably a good #4 for his career like a Manson.

 

[Hellcat]

5 months later and wow.

I'm not sure the player we're seeing today is a #1.

Might make more sense to talk about finding a partner for Tanev on the 1st. pairing.

He never was a #1, he played some shifts like he was a #1, monster playoffs a few years back but can you say his name in the same breath as legit #1's? Hedman, Josi, Heiskanen, Makar, Hughes, Fox, McAvoy, Slavin, Morrissey, Doughty, Toews, Dahlin, Dobson, Letang, Pietrangelo, Theodore, Ekbland, Sieder, Sergachev, Tanev, Carlson ... this is off the top of my head. He's a #2 that can play like a #1 for short stretches and frequently has bouts of playing like a #3.

This should be Riellys walk out song

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

He’s played rough but I think he’s earned himself time to warm up to peak athleticism from the start of the season. If he still looks shaky a month in I’ll be concerned.

 

[mclaren55]

He starts slow every year. A month in no one is going to be saying "he looks slow".